PCT-My thoughts on Post cycle therapy ~ Phreezer

hackskii

Member
jasthace said:
I think I get your message. Since I'm younger and on a low dose 560mg week x8 weeks i may not need PCT

You will need it.
Shutdown happens around the 4th week and continues after your last shot due to the half life of the AAS, so a week or even more you will continue to shutdown.

At one point you will end up being well below your base levels.

I would never consider a cycle without all the stuff in order before hand.

I got a blood test after just 4 weeks on winstrol at 50mg and I had a 34 test level.
The dock was shocked.

So yes 8 weeks get that PCT down you.
 

hackskii

Member
Phreezer said:
well IF the boys are full size at the end of a cycle..then I can't see much of a use for HCG

Full size is not an indication of full testicular function bro.
Now that is an awesome sign but size does not equate natural test production.

I just found that out after talking to a doc to find out when I stop my HCG therapy.
He suggested a blood test be done and anywhere around 400 or higher you are ready to drop the HCG then continue with the clomid and nolva.

The Doc suggested the HPTA took 45 days to recover.
 

Phreezer

Member
hackskii said:
Full size is not an indication of full testicular function bro.
Now that is an awesome sign but size does not equate natural test production.

I just found that out after talking to a doc to find out when I stop my HCG therapy.
He suggested a blood test be done and anywhere around 400 or higher you are ready to drop the HCG then continue with the clomid and nolva.

The Doc suggested the HPTA took 45 days to recover.

Well, IMO if there is no testicular atrophy there is little reason for HCG treatment in normal healthy men who are only temporarily repressed..

He asked if I thought he needed HCG.. And IMO he didn't... I only offer my opinion.. I can not contend with every variable out there.. and I can't answer every possible question.. everyone and every situation are different... And IMO the shotgun approach of just throwing a drug at something cause "MAYBE" it might combat something that may or may not be happening is wrong.
 

hackskii

Member
Like I said.

The doc said testicuar size was no indication of testicular function.

I told him my nuts were full size and he said follow the plan he gave me.
His suggestion was to draw blood day 10 of HCG administration to see if the range was around 400.
If so then the HCG could be dropped and the clomid and nolva can continue.

Testicular size is probably the only indication after or during a cycle as blood drawn with androgens in the mix will yield inacurate information.

It might be better to add HCG in the mix during the cycle at lets say week 3-4 to maintain testicular function before starting PCT.

The testicles take far longer to bring online than LH.
No sense trying to fire LH with clomid/nolva when the nuts wont respond to LH as they are not ready.

The doc said it can take 6-18 months for a shutdown HPTA to fully recover.
45 days with the protocol he suggested.

It is not a shotgun approach as low test levels post cycle are not good anyway.
Some HCG is not going to hurt you and if anything else will avoid a crash Post Cycle.

Telling someone that 8 weeks is not going to shut you down and you wont need HCG is not good advice in my opinion.
Nothing personal as I respect your opinions but in the end it makes sense to plan for the unexpected or the worse case scenario.

I was shutdown from 30 days of orals.
Might just be me but hey, 34 test level after 30 days.
 

Beefy

Junior Member
Speaking of blood tests, can you get the appropriate work done at a walk in clinic? I don't want to go to my regular doc, so what should I request at a clinic? Just say, "I need a full spectrum blood test done to check lipids, hormones, etc."?
 

ds111

Junior Member
Has anyone ever heard of taking hcg this way, 5000IU Day1, 5000IU Day6, 2500IU day11, 2500IU Day14, 2500IU Day17, 2500 Day20?
 

ds111

Junior Member
Phreezer thanks, thats what I thought too. I was told there was no difference in taking it this way verses just taking it 1000IU/Day which is how I've always done it before. I'm gonna go with the old way and 40mg/day of Nolvadex. Thanks again.
 

flannel

Junior Member
Phreezer, I loved your article? But I have a question about the "bridge" using a cortisol blocker. I just ran my very first cycle using 500mg a week of Sustanon 250 and (2 shots weekly) and 50mgs daily of Winstrol (oral). I loved the results. I just began the HCG to shock my testes and the Clomid which I will use according to your previous post. I was going to take a little time off and go natural before running my next cycle, and didn't realize the importance of the "bridge" until reading your post.

My question is: What is "ed" first of all. Does that mean "daily" in reference to taking the Anavar. And also, how long should I stay on the bridge. Two weeks. A month. Two months. Or should I just stay on it indefinitely until taking my next cycle.

Your help would be greatly appreciated !!! Thank you!!!
 

hackskii

Member
Bridging still hinders recovery.
I was put on TRT and had total shutdown after 10 months.

Not only that if PCT is done correctly 45 days is all it takes for recovery, no bridge needed.

I get very stiff joints blocking cortisol, if it is not elivated it is not necessary to block cortisol.
 

flannel

Junior Member
Thanks hackskii !!! I greatly appreciate the reply. I'll make sure my PCT is correct and not worry about the bridge, as I don't want to hinder recovery at all. Again, thanks!!!
 

Dr.B.PT

Junior Member
What do you have to say to those who chose to not use Clomiphene citrate post cycle, and have no negative side effects such as hypogonadism? Just wondering what you might think of that? Thanks
 

Naudo11

Junior Member
Sup,

I am about to finish a cycle of 200mg deca only and I think i should do PCT. I have already got some clomi, and tamox on hand. What do you think? Should I do these two and add some HCG (around 500ui daily) to bring my test up and when should I start the PCT. I am a little worried about this PCT and feel like I might be going overboard considering the small dosages of deca. Any thoughts?

Naudo11
 

hackskii

Member
Naudo11 said:
Sup,

I am about to finish a cycle of 200mg deca only and I think i should do PCT. I have already got some clomi, and tamox on hand. What do you think? Should I do these two and add some HCG (around 500ui daily) to bring my test up and when should I start the PCT. I am a little worried about this PCT and feel like I might be going overboard considering the small dosages of deca. Any thoughts?

Naudo11

If you have testicular atrophy then yes add the HCG.
 

Naudo11

Junior Member
My balls don't hang as low as they use to but would HCG be positive because of how suppressive the deca is?
 

hackskii

Member
Supression comes to many things, testicles, pituitary and hypothalamus.

I never do deca anymore, it tends to keep shutting me down months after the cycle has ended.
But then again I was using more than you but I will never use deca again.

So, yah, some HCG would be ok.
I always run nolva and clomid together.
 

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