Post IM injection site muscle pain

Discussion in 'Men's Health Forum' started by zkt, Apr 11, 2009.

  1. #1
    zkt

    zkt Member

    I have experienced post IM injection site muscle pain a few times, am having it now, and finally want to get to the root understanding of the problem. I`ve asked many MDs and RNs and always get some variation of yes that happens sometimes to Oh really, thats interesting.
    To kick the ball off here are my anechdodal experienes- hoping others will relate theirs. IM Flu shots and the ocassional antibiotic have never resulted in more that a short duration mild local muscle pain. The first time I experienced any real muscle pain following an IM injection was the first few TE shots to the quadricetpts 2 years ago. The pain was intense and lasted several days- maybe a week. After the first 2 or 3 shots the pain quickly decreased and was having no post injection pain after six weeks. This is weekly TRT btw. I do recall a dexmethasone or other glucocorticoid in the glut that hurt like hell post 30 minutes and lasted for an hour or two. I think I have noticed more post injection pain after a T injection layoff of a few weeks, which I do every so often.
    Just tapped a new vial of TE and been dragging my leg around for 5 days now. The first I roughed it. The next two days I took 200 mg Darvocet each day which helped a lot with the pain but isnt really relevant. The next day I had to have my shit together so roughed it and there was no decrease in pain level as compared to the beginning. When I rolled out of bed the next day I could tell it was still there with me so tried 8 mg medrol. Now 6-8 hours later the quad pain is much relieved- just like you would expect if it were an immune system mediated inflammatory response. But I havent experienced the usual signs of an immune reponse, other that pain, i.e., redness, heat, and swelling. But that may be due to the fact that the reasction isnt superficial, but rather deep into the muscle. The injection consisted of .55 ml and used a 21gx1.25 needle, probably inserted at an angle downward angle. Interestingly the pain is mostly distal of the injection site, as was the downward trajectory of the depot.
    I will not take medrol tomorrow and see if its worse or not, but by now it may have run its course and the medrol may have only appeared effective in the first place.
    If anyone has any experiences or theories sure would appreciate knowing of them.
    Am posting this in both the MHF and the ASF since each forum has its own audience to a large part and I want everyones input.
     
  2. #2
    BBC3

    BBC3 Well-Known Member

    My experience is that I have occasional pain with Enenthate and really none ever with Cyp. Is it UGL of pharm quality? Sometimes people will attempt to brew test with less than 20% BB and this can lead to the testosterone comming back out of solution in the body/muscle, and thus leaving test "powder" in the muscle in a solid form. My first experience with Enanthate was awfull with this second scenario and would leave large lumps in my ass for 5-7 days sometimes depending on how much actually went and stayed in solid muscle. The leg injections with that stuff were crippling... I have also heard that some people are simply allergic to the enanthate ester.:)

    Further, I am not sure if there is Tylenol is in Darvocet. But, I have found Davocet is not a very good pain killer. You would be much better off with plain old tylenol for that type problem.


     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2009
  3. #3
    tbach

    tbach Junior Member

    I have never experienced the pain you write about from injections either in the glute or quads, but I have been told that using a size21 needle is an excellent way to exact torture - not a good thing to use for injections. For the first year I was using #21 1 1/2" needles - moderate amount of pain while injecting quads and always a rather nasty bruise. Now that I have switched to #25 for quads and #23 for glutes, I experience no pain and no bruising. I use a larger needle to extract T from vial and then change to the one for injection. It takes a little longer to get the cypionate in, but that time is more than balanced by less injection pain and no bruising.

    The only time I remember having lasting pain was when the nurse was teaching me and managed to hit my sciatic nerve on her way into my glute. I can't even imagine having to endure the ongoing pain you describe, especially since I inject twice per week. Hope you find out what's going on soon.
     
  4. #4
    jackko

    jackko Junior Member

    I am new to this but need help also- I had about 20 IM (over a 3 month period) into my right glut about a year ago -
    dexferrum -100 mg elemental iron per 2ml--and now the pain is off and on but every day- definitely chronic--
    someone suggested ultrasound - or deep massage--it just feels like a piece of meat that got scarred over and over

    any suggestions? thanks very much
    Jackko
     
  5. #5
    jackko

    jackko Junior Member

    What is cypionate?? maybe the doctor was using too large a needle on me?? You are using a #23 for gluts- I'll have to check out what was used on me But perhaps it was the iron itself that causes the scarring and inflammation and not the needle used repeatedly--not sure?/
    thanks for the info
     
  6. #6
    vernzern

    vernzern Junior Member

    It might be a little bit more difficult to do this this way but it is worth not having complications. Twist your body to reach the proper gluteal area and always inject it there, switching cheeks every time or try not to hit the same spot as before. The gluteus maximus a very large muscle and can handle a lot of injection. I learned myself not to use the quads because of the pain and stiffness ect.....
    Hope this helps someone out.
     
  7. #7
    zkt

    zkt Member

    Man dont time fly!
    Howja happen to dig this up?
    It turned out to be an immune system response to some cheap A-S btw.
    Izzat you BBC3? Just to take another poke at the dead horse?[:eek:)]
    (not that they dont deserve it, of course)
     
  8. #8
    lanT

    lanT Junior Member

    Digging it up again because I am 3/4 of the way full a bottle that is kicking my ass of TE. Fine when it goes in then 2 days later it;s a golf ball for .5ml and baseball for 1 ml. I just want to do a little HRT and my source before he vanished gave me this 20ml bottle of pain. Any suggestions on how to negate the suffering? Baking, re-filter through a .22 whatman or antibiotics maybe.
    :eek:
    HELP
     
  9. #9
    johnnyBALLZ

    johnnyBALLZ Awesome Member

    Cutting it/mixing it with more oil may help.
     
  10. #10
    zkt

    zkt Member

    ethyl oleate is the best oil
     
  11. #11
    foreveryoung

    foreveryoung Active Member

    like bbc said, I also find enanthate a little bit more painful than cypionate

    but a little pain here and there goes with the territory when injecting things IM, might not happen all the time but sometimes it will
     
  12. #12
    keriheat

    keriheat Junior Member

    I hesitate getting into this conversation, but here is my opinion. If it isn't an allergic reaction, it's more than likely the solution coming back out of the muscle at the injection site. When you inject the testosterone and withdrawn the syringe, the Test leaks back out of the muscle and is trapped under the Sub-Q which has sealed. The result is swelling and soreness. I resolved this by withdrawing the syringe and immediately holding light pressure on the injection site for 1 minute. This allows the solution to 'Stay' in the muscle while the injection site seals over. I usally use a cotton swab or pad as I hold pressure on the injection spot. Have had no swelling, no bruising, no pain in over a year. I inject 0.4 mg 100 Test Cyp -- Monday 8am and Thursday 8pm 80 mg a week. I have injected 1ml 200mg, same protocol.
     
  13. #13
    Astro -Labs

    Astro -Labs Junior Member

    The most common reasons for pip imo are solvents/oil used. For instance to much benzyl alcohol will cause swelling and some pretty bad pip. Its almost always avoidable unless its a high mg. Or it could he from impurities in the raws.
     
  14. #14
    zkt

    zkt Member

    One way to eliminate the allergic reaction hypothesis is to pretreat with a good size dose of corticosteriods; medrol, ect.
     
  15. #15
    BBC3

    BBC3 Well-Known Member

    It should be noted that there are a couple of reasons for local swelling with steroid pinning. Astro mentioned a few things touching on them distantly at least. While there is no question the the BB in the mix can cause reaction (as well as BA), I just have to go with the ester most likely as I moved directly from cyp to enanthate (as first many years back). This would indicate it was not the BB. Make no mistake that the BB is a preservative by indication in usage, but qualified as a secondary solvent, preservative, and catalyst to DEPOT action in IM steroid usage. The BB is utilized to help CREATE the DEPOT - and I suspect via a "partial pickling" of the injection area which causes/results as mild inflammation in action.. So it can aggravate for sure.

    ZKT mentioned Oleate. Which i believe is touted as the best ingredient for the Enanthate Ester manufacture. I will also note that I believe I recall much more variance in POSSIBLE ingredients for Enanthate manufacture, and compared to cypionate manufacture - which would explain why some enanthate gets more complaints, and some less...

    I really do wonder the LONG TERM effects of BB exposure to the body and how it is actually metabolized out? How it relates to liver activity and potential liver stress.? When after all, the whole indication of the action of BB in the body is TO CAUSE TROUBLE...:)
     
  16. #16
    lanT

    lanT Junior Member

    Excuse my ignorance but what is the BB you are referring too? I ask because at my recent physical my doctor said my liver values were way up and tested me for a bunch of different things hep-c etc.
     
  17. #17
    BBC3

    BBC3 Well-Known Member

    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzyl_benzoate]Benzyl benzoate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

    Usually prepared as (20% I think I recall for 200mg/ml application) of cyp or enanthate IM solution. So it should be noted that the amount of BB is increasing as the amount of testosterone per CC increases - where as the Benzyl Alcohol is NOT.....

    TECHNICALLY as spoken by medical science it should not affect you adversely. At least thats what the DONT SAY..;)

    Each mL of the 100 mg/mL solution contains:

    Testosterone Cypionate............................................................................... 100 mg
    Benzyl benzoate .......................................................................................... 0.1 mL
    Cottonseed oil ............................................................................................. 736 mg
    Benzyl alcohol (as preservative).................................................................. 9.45 mg

    Each mL of the 200 mg/mL solution contains:

    Testosterone Cypionate............................................................................... 200 mg
    Benzyl benzoate........................................................................................... 0.2 mL
    Cottonseed oil............................................................................................. 560 mg

    Benzyl alcohol (as preservative).................................................................. 9.45 mg


     

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