Must be only if you are really prone to it... My nips went desensitised on hcg, but were touchy on sust. I don't need anything while doing hcg.
Here's one guy's take on it:
HOW TO USE HCG
It is best to prevent testicular atrophy in the first place rather than trying to bringing the boys back to size after they have already atrophied.
With this in mind prudent use of hcg is DURING a cycle.
HCG can be taken either IM or sub Q in the fat and yes you can mix it with your oils.
Take it at 500iu's every 3rd or 4th day while on cycle.
Some use it post cycle at higher doses after their testes have already shrunk. This method works but I do not believe that it is the best way to use HCG. In this method one injects a high dose of hcg right near the end ofa cycle but before clomid. The opening dose is often 3000iu's followed sometimes by another 3000 4 days latter and then 1500iu's every 4th or 5th day and then the last shot is usually only 1000iu's....total time three weeks.
No use taking clomid or nolav with the HCG since HCG will supress the hpta all by itself via the testosterone production it stimulates.
WARNING.....if you use hcg at a high dose for too long you might desensitize the testes to LH so don't get carried away with it.
SERMS clomid and nolva
After any cycle a SERM should be used, either clomid or nolva.
SERMS help to "kickstart" a sleepy hpyothalmic GnRH response.
GnRH is pretty quick to recover but SERMS help the hypothalamus to "turn the key" on the GnRH impulse generating engine.
SERMS block the affect of estrogen at the hypothalamus and since estrogen is highly inhibitory this blocking affect allows for greater LH production. This "greater LH production" strongly stimulates the testes to produce testosterone.
If you use only gear that does NOT aromatize to estrogen then you don't have to worry about the inhibitory affect of estrogen post cycle(from the steroid)...but SERMs should still be used to counter the inhibitory affect of the estrogen seen form the T production(from the hcg use).....and also from the estrogen production from the aromatization of the T production form your testes after the hcg is stopped.
*Even if you never used HCG you should still use a SERM after a cycle with non aromatizing gear to counter the inhibitory effect of normal estrogen production(from the aromatization of T from your improving T production)
You have to wait until exogenous androgen levels drop to a similar level of what a normal T production would be, in order for this LH stimulating affect from SERMS to work, since androgens are also highly inhibitory on the hypothalamus.
So you must have to have a good grasp on the half lifes of the various gear you use. You also have to be aware of the how the dose taken factors into the equation. ie: test cyp has a half life of around 6 days so with this in mind 500mg of test cyp will reduce to 250 mg in a week and about 125 in another week. That 125mg is about 100mg of pure testosterone(minus ester weight) and you can now begin SERM therapy because that level is near what a normal T output would be(slightly higher though)
NOTE: There is no penalty for starting a SERM too early but there is one for starting too late.
Search for half lifes of other gear in other threads on the boards.
On opening "SERM day", post cycle, you want to do a "loading dose" of about 200-300mg of clomid in divided doses in order to get blood levels up pronto. Then take 50-100mg/day for a week and then 50mg/day for 3 more weeks MINIMUM... and longer after deca use.
Alternatively you can use nolva at 80mg on day one in divided dose and then 40mg /day for a week and then 20mg/day for at least 3 more weeks.
bigmike said:
thanks for the input guys. i know hcg can cause gyno but i was wondering if arimidex would be just as good as nolvadex since i have extra arimidex and no nolva right now
