I have read that you can use clen for up to 6-8 weeks straight if you use it with Ketotifen which prevents beta receptor down-regulation. Is this true? And if so, I read the side effect of ketotifen is drowsiness, so can the 3mg just be taken at night? Anyone have any experience with this? Thanks.
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
clenbuterol and Ketotifen??
- Thread starter r100proof
- Start date
Carlito
New Member
Very True!
I have done a 6 week cycle of clen/ketotefin stack and it worked well I took my daily dose before I went to bed and slept like a baby, I also noticed it made me hungrier than usual(from the ketotefin) but that is not so bad if you choose to eat the right foods.
Carlito
I have done a 6 week cycle of clen/ketotefin stack and it worked well I took my daily dose before I went to bed and slept like a baby, I also noticed it made me hungrier than usual(from the ketotefin) but that is not so bad if you choose to eat the right foods.
Carlito
thick
New Member
i have tried clen with keto and although it gave me the shakes, i got very drowsy on it. I worked out in the evenings. WOrked great taking it an hour b4 w/o and than supper and bed. Slept great. Made me hungry as F'k though. Not sure about how many weeks u can get away with using it. take care
You'd be surprised at how many studies there are indicating that Ketotifen is effective at preventing beta-adrenoceptor down-regulation. Here are a few I have bookmarked:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2848777&query_hl=6
Effects of ketotifen on the responsiveness of peripheral blood lymphocyte beta-adrenergic receptors.
"The effects of ketotifen therapy on the responsiveness of lymphocyte beta-adrenergic receptors was evaluated by measuring cyclic AMP elevations caused by isoproterenol [a beta2-agonist] in cells isolated from patients treated with ketotifen for more than 1 year. Binding of 3H-dihydroalprenolol to beta-receptors was also evaluated. The isoproterenol-induced rise in cyclic AMP relative to each individual's baseline level was greater in patients on current ketotifen therapy than in other asthmatic patients or non-asthmatic subjects. Ketotifen therapy increased the apparent equilibrium dissociation constant for specific 3H-dihydroalprenolol binding to the receptors. Receptor numbers in symptomatic asthma patients on standard drug therapy were decreased. The results indicate that long term ketotifen therapy is associated with increased responsiveness of beta-receptors to stimulation by catecholamines and that this alteration may involve changes in the receptors themselves, their membrane environment, adenylate cyclase or components of the adenylate cyclase coupling system."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=1964319&query_hl=2
Effects of ketotifen and clenbuterol on beta-adrenergic receptor functions of lymphocytes
"Applying ketotifen and clenbuterol together the beta-adrenergic receptor function increased compared to the values obtained after application of clenbuterol alone (intraindividual-control) as well as vs. the group of healthies (control). Data presented support the view that therapeutic doses of selective beta 2-agonists do not lead to damage of the beta-adrenoceptor function. The improvement of receptor function after parallel administration of clenbuterol and ketotifen may be a consequence of the participation of ketotifen in the control of beta-adrenergic receptor system."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2571180&query_hl=6
Effects... of ketotifen on beta 2 adrenergic receptor regulation in intact human lymphocytes
"KET alone also induced an up-regulation of cell surface beta adrenergic receptors."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2846002&query_hl=6
[Bronchial adrenergic receptors and asthma. Tachyphylaxis and its prevention]
(Tachyphylaxis is rapidly diminishing response to successive doses of a drug, rendering it less effective)
"The majority of the clinical studies in healthy volunteers have shown that chronic inhalation or oral intake of sympathomimetics causes tachyphylaxis of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptors... Several well controlled studies have however shown that chronic administration of sympathomimetics results in a significantly decreased sensitivity of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptor... Corticosteroids, given orally or parenterally, restore the sensitivity of the beta adrenergic receptors. In a double blind, placebo controlled study in healthy subjects we have observed that ketotifen prevents the development of a tachyphylaxis of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptor during prolonged treatment with inhaled sympathomimetics."
Look at related articles and you'll find 100 more. After seeing the research, I'm pretty confident that ketotifen does the job.
Considering the effects of clen and ketotifen, I'd buy them seperately and take the clen in the morning and the ketotifen at night. Works much better (practically) than simultaneous administration. Note that DNP is a great addition to this stack, as the ketotifen acts as an antihistimine (no need for benedryl, etc). Take the DNP in the morning along with the clen.
http://www.innovative-research.net/clen.htm
http://www.innovative-research.net/keto.htm
Also, I think 3mg is overkill. 1mg of ketotifen each night should be sufficient IMO.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2848777&query_hl=6
Effects of ketotifen on the responsiveness of peripheral blood lymphocyte beta-adrenergic receptors.
"The effects of ketotifen therapy on the responsiveness of lymphocyte beta-adrenergic receptors was evaluated by measuring cyclic AMP elevations caused by isoproterenol [a beta2-agonist] in cells isolated from patients treated with ketotifen for more than 1 year. Binding of 3H-dihydroalprenolol to beta-receptors was also evaluated. The isoproterenol-induced rise in cyclic AMP relative to each individual's baseline level was greater in patients on current ketotifen therapy than in other asthmatic patients or non-asthmatic subjects. Ketotifen therapy increased the apparent equilibrium dissociation constant for specific 3H-dihydroalprenolol binding to the receptors. Receptor numbers in symptomatic asthma patients on standard drug therapy were decreased. The results indicate that long term ketotifen therapy is associated with increased responsiveness of beta-receptors to stimulation by catecholamines and that this alteration may involve changes in the receptors themselves, their membrane environment, adenylate cyclase or components of the adenylate cyclase coupling system."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=1964319&query_hl=2
Effects of ketotifen and clenbuterol on beta-adrenergic receptor functions of lymphocytes
"Applying ketotifen and clenbuterol together the beta-adrenergic receptor function increased compared to the values obtained after application of clenbuterol alone (intraindividual-control) as well as vs. the group of healthies (control). Data presented support the view that therapeutic doses of selective beta 2-agonists do not lead to damage of the beta-adrenoceptor function. The improvement of receptor function after parallel administration of clenbuterol and ketotifen may be a consequence of the participation of ketotifen in the control of beta-adrenergic receptor system."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2571180&query_hl=6
Effects... of ketotifen on beta 2 adrenergic receptor regulation in intact human lymphocytes
"KET alone also induced an up-regulation of cell surface beta adrenergic receptors."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2846002&query_hl=6
[Bronchial adrenergic receptors and asthma. Tachyphylaxis and its prevention]
(Tachyphylaxis is rapidly diminishing response to successive doses of a drug, rendering it less effective)
"The majority of the clinical studies in healthy volunteers have shown that chronic inhalation or oral intake of sympathomimetics causes tachyphylaxis of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptors... Several well controlled studies have however shown that chronic administration of sympathomimetics results in a significantly decreased sensitivity of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptor... Corticosteroids, given orally or parenterally, restore the sensitivity of the beta adrenergic receptors. In a double blind, placebo controlled study in healthy subjects we have observed that ketotifen prevents the development of a tachyphylaxis of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptor during prolonged treatment with inhaled sympathomimetics."
Look at related articles and you'll find 100 more. After seeing the research, I'm pretty confident that ketotifen does the job.
Considering the effects of clen and ketotifen, I'd buy them seperately and take the clen in the morning and the ketotifen at night. Works much better (practically) than simultaneous administration. Note that DNP is a great addition to this stack, as the ketotifen acts as an antihistimine (no need for benedryl, etc). Take the DNP in the morning along with the clen.
http://www.innovative-research.net/clen.htm
http://www.innovative-research.net/keto.htm
Also, I think 3mg is overkill. 1mg of ketotifen each night should be sufficient IMO.
chewiechomp
New Member
In lieu of ketotifen, what is the consensus on use of diphenhydramine HCL / Benadryl for the same purpose?
Yep. Sounds like a safe assumption to me.
Benadryl is in a whole different class of antihistamines. I haven't seen any research showing that it can upregulate beta receptors like ketotifen, so as far as I know, it's just a big gamble if you want to use it for that purpose.
Grappler76
New Member
You will get bored with taking clenbuterol week after week after week...
chewiechomp
New Member
I've been trying to research this, but what I'm running into is either people who repeat shit they read in a forum verbatim, or people who dismiss it out of hand simply because AR came up with it.
Still, I prefer to come to my own conclusions, and appreciate your reply.
How about hydroxyzine for the same purpose?
