Finished product (GCMS) vs Raws + Finished product testing

[Photon]

Is there any point in testing raws?
Assume the following scenario. You have 100g of raws, you can either

Option 1
(1) Send a sample (0.2g - 1g) for raws testing and assume the purity is representative of the whole 100g (probably not).
(2) Brew it or not (dump it if purity sucks).
(3) Filter, leave in beaker, send product for testing.
(4) Adjust if needed.
(5) Filter into vials.

Total cost (120x2=$240). And lets face it, most wont send the finished product for testing.

vs

Option 2
(1) Do not test raws, assume 85% - 90% purity depending on product. Brew 30-50g.
(2) Filter, leave in beaker, send product for mg/ml and GCMS testing. GCMS will show the breakdown BA/BB, impurities, etc.
(3) Work backwards using simple math to find purity% based off GCMS.
(4) Adjust if needed. If purity sucks, dump product.
(5) Filter into vials.

Total cost (120+130(GCMS?)=$250)

Option 1 assumes that the sample sent for testing is representative of the whole.
Maybe the sample you picked was badly contaminated or has degraded due to heat. Who knows? But its only a really small part of your entire batch.

Option 2 does GCMS on the final product, isn't this more important?
This is what goes into your body, impurities and all. You also get the purity% of 30-50g of the compound..rather than what..a pathetic 0.2-1g?
If the purity sucks, you just wasted some BA/BB and oil which isn't significant.

In an ideal world, you GCMS both raws and final product. In reality, most only do purity% testing of raws or mg/ml testing on final product.

Is there something I'm missing?

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

Is there any point in testing raws?
Assume the following scenario. You have 100g of raws, you can either

Option 1
(1) Send a sample (0.2g - 1g) for raws testing and assume the purity is representative of the whole 100g (probably not).
(2) Brew it or not (dump it if purity sucks).
(3) Filter, leave in beaker, send product for testing.
(4) Adjust if needed.
(5) Filter into vials.

Total cost (120x2=$240). And lets face it, most wont send the finished product for testing.

vs

Option 2
(1) Do not test raws, assume 85% - 90% purity depending on product. Brew 30-50g.
(2) Filter, leave in beaker, send product for mg/ml and GCMS testing. GCMS will show the breakdown BA/BB, impurities, etc.
(3) Work backwards using simple math to find purity% based off GCMS.
(4) Adjust if needed. If purity sucks, dump product.
(5) Filter into vials.

Total cost (120+130(GCMS?)=$250)

Option 1 assumes that the sample sent for testing is representative of the whole.
Maybe the sample you picked was badly contaminated or has degraded due to heat. Who knows? But its only a really small part of your entire batch.

Option 2 does GCMS on the final product, isn't this more important?
This is what goes into your body, impurities and all. You also get the purity% of 30-50g of the compound..rather than what..a pathetic 0.2-1g?
If the purity sucks, you just wasted some BA/BB and oil which isn't significant.

In an ideal world, you GCMS both raws and final product. In reality, most only do purity% testing of raws or mg/ml testing on final product.

Is there something I'm missing?

Option 3.

Purify the raws.

If your glass and everything you did was relatively clean including the solvent is of high purity. Achieve 98% purity or higher even if your raws was 70% pure to begin with

No matter the situation or the raws

This side steps everything

This also prevents from injecting impurities in the first place. They all get removed.


If you are interested in this process here's a few videos on the subject.





View: https://youtu.be/04HWovMzkAk





View: https://youtu.be/czX8lF1IscE





View: https://youtu.be/uVA0rK_VITY

 

[Photon]

Option 3.

Purify the raws.

If your glass and everything you did was relatively clean including the solvent is of high purity. Achieve 98% purity or higher even if your raws was 70% pure to begin with

No matter the situation or the raws

This side steps everything

This also prevents from injecting impurities in the first place. They all get removed.


If you are interested in this process here's a few videos on the subject.





View: https://youtu.be/04HWovMzkAk





View: https://youtu.be/czX8lF1IscE





View: https://youtu.be/uVA0rK_VITY

Not sure why you keep quoting people and trying to link them to your thread.
Personally I'll just buy new raws.

What you linked is also not relevant to what I posted.

Either way, good luck.

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

Not sure why you keep quoting people and trying to link them to your thread.
Personally I'll just buy new raws.

What you linked is also not relevant to what I posted.

Either way, good luck.

So you will throw away money and not recover what you can?

Makes sense.

 

[Photon]

So you will throw away money and not recover what you can?

Makes sense.

Yes

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

Yes

Can't argue with that

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

Is there any point in testing raws?
Assume the following scenario. You have 100g of raws, you can either

Option 1
(1) Send a sample (0.2g - 1g) for raws testing and assume the purity is representative of the whole 100g (probably not).
(2) Brew it or not (dump it if purity sucks).
(3) Filter, leave in beaker, send product for testing.
(4) Adjust if needed.
(5) Filter into vials.

Total cost (120x2=$240). And lets face it, most wont send the finished product for testing.

vs

Option 2
(1) Do not test raws, assume 85% - 90% purity depending on product. Brew 30-50g.
(2) Filter, leave in beaker, send product for mg/ml and GCMS testing. GCMS will show the breakdown BA/BB, impurities, etc.
(3) Work backwards using simple math to find purity% based off GCMS.
(4) Adjust if needed. If purity sucks, dump product.
(5) Filter into vials.

Total cost (120+130(GCMS?)=$250)

Option 1 assumes that the sample sent for testing is representative of the whole.
Maybe the sample you picked was badly contaminated or has degraded due to heat. Who knows? But its only a really small part of your entire batch.

Option 2 does GCMS on the final product, isn't this more important?
This is what goes into your body, impurities and all. You also get the purity% of 30-50g of the compound..rather than what..a pathetic 0.2-1g?
If the purity sucks, you just wasted some BA/BB and oil which isn't significant.

In an ideal world, you GCMS both raws and final product. In reality, most only do purity% testing of raws or mg/ml testing on final product.

Is there something I'm missing?

My actual response

I’m leaning toward Option 1. If you sample the raw properly and it’s mixed well, 0.5–1g is usually enough to get a solid idea of purity. It’s cheaper, faster, and you’re not wasting oil, BA, or filters on something that could be trash. You can always retest after brewing if needed...... but testing before saves time and money upfront.

 

[dasking]

My actual response

I’m leaning toward Option 1. If you sample the raw properly and it’s mixed well, 0.5–1g is usually enough to get a solid idea of purity. It’s cheaper, faster, and you’re not wasting oil, BA, or filters on something that could be trash. You can always retest after brewing if needed...... but testing before saves time and money upfront.

exactly what I was going to say, if im dealing with any amount of quantity I test before! All those supplies add up eventually. But if im doing just like 100ml of test e for myself I'll just test after

 

[Mac81]

I would never throw it out,, none of it's trash, It could come in 60% pure, recrystallize it and it's 100% pure, you still got 600 g out of a kilo that's 99% pure, no way in hell I'd throw 1000 grams of raws away, when you have 600 g of pure steroid in there...You can recrystallize and purify any compound on the planet, obviously you try to buy it 100% pure, but I wouldn't throw it to f*** away That's just craziness, what he's doing is a proof of concept but it's not that difficult, If you can brew your own gear, you can also purify it.

 

[Mac81]

I mean if you got it like that just to throw kilos in the trash. I suppose some of you guys do, me personally I would buy some chemicals and purify that shit

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

I would never throw it out,, none of it's trash, It could come in 60% pure, recrystallize it and it's 100% pure, you still got 600 g out of a kilo that's 99% pure, no way in hell I'd throw 1000 grams of raws away, when you have 600 g of pure steroid in there...You can recrystallize and purify any compound on the planet, obviously you try to buy it 100% pure, but I wouldn't throw it to f*** away That's just craziness, what he's doing is a proof of concept but it's not that difficult, If you can brew your own gear, you can also purify it.

At this point, anyone who threw out their raws is wasting money. I have proven, or at least gave a very general outline of how anyone can save any amount of raws when a little bit of effort Is applied.

 

[Mac81]

Yeah what's a gallon of solvent cost,50$ what you end up with, is pharma grade pure. That's just a straight madness. I would bitch the supplier out, try to get a refund, and still use that shit, If You're smart enough to bake brownies, and homebrew Gear, you can sure as f*** purify your own shit... I would double dip get a re-ship, for another Kilo, and purify the one you already had and you got 600 g of free shit.

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

Yeah what's a gallon of solvent cost,50$ what you end up with, is pharma grade pure. That's just a straight madness. I would bitch the supplier out, try to get a refund, and still use that shit,

Ideally the supplier should just do this.......

 

[Mac81]

Ideally the supplier should just do this.......

Yeah you're right about that, It's not like it takes a bunch of technical knowledge, or a degree in chemistry like it takes to actually synthesize a lot of these compounds, The actual purification of it is quite easy The hard work is already done

 

[TheScholarOfBrew]

Yeah you're right about that, It's not like it takes a bunch of technical knowledge, or a degree in chemistry like it takes to actually synthesize a lot of these compounds, The actual purification of it is quite easy The hard work is already done

I wonder if I should just tag the suppliers in that thread I made.

 

[Mac81]

Dude I can tell already, most of these guys for whatever reason are probably never even going to attempt it, they're basically set in their ways of doing things, and nothing is probably going to change that.. I understand where they're coming from their logic is we should just get pure stuff the first time no f****** around, we shouldn't have to go through all that, but I also don't think they realize how simple it is, It's just another part of the process that they're not really willing to do, they look at it like I shouldn't have to do that.. we both are familiar with chemistry so we know that it's so f****** simple and the end product is probably better than anything you will ever get from anywhere no matter how good your supplier is, but not everybody looks at things the same way and I see why a lot of these guys are just not even giving it a second thought, things aren't hard enough, raws are still flowing, nobody's completely dry really, they're just worried that it could happen someday, but nobody's hurting that bad obviously or they wouldn't just be willing to throw s*** in a trash... You got to try to look at it from both aspects, what one guys willing to do another isn't necessarily, they just up the dosage when brewing to make up for the lack in quality so they can still come out with the same mg/ml, they're not really interested in what the cut is and if it even goes in the final product, all their concerned about is the gear being the proper strength when it's sent out

 

[Mac81]

I'm not going to say it out loud.. but you can tell the general crowd on here.. they're in this for specific reasons... Meaning why they're purchasing it for and what they're doing with it... A lot of these guys aren't f****** around with small time shit, you can tell they have been doing it for a while,They want to get it in and get it out, quickly and as as painless as possible... This isn't a hobby for them, They can afford to throw a couple pounds in the trash, lol

 

[Pez'sAnabolicJunta]

So you will throw away money and not recover what you can?

Makes sense.

It sounds like if I wanted to learn for fun, sure. Thing is most don't. Even people like RNs don't take any significant Chemistry courses with a lab. I didn't 30yrs ago.If it were 300gm of primo or 500gm of Para that might encourage me to learn but most here are not coming close to that. They need diagnostic and troubleshooting skills.

 

[Pez'sAnabolicJunta]

Option 3.

Purify the raws.

If your glass and everything you did was relatively clean including the solvent is of high purity. Achieve 98% purity or higher even if your raws was 70% pure to begin with

No matter the situation or the raws

This side steps everything

This also prevents from injecting impurities in the first place. They all get removed.


If you are interested in this process here's a few videos on the subject.





View: https://youtu.be/04HWovMzkAk





View: https://youtu.be/czX8lF1IscE





View: https://youtu.be/uVA0rK_VITY

It's interesting and most could do this but they have never taken organic chemistry. My ex gf had to take Organic Chem (1 and/or 2) in the summer about 3 times. Delayed her graduation. She's graduated as an RPH and now everyone almost is a PharmD

 

[Photon]

It's a pity but the thread has completely derailed by people trying to draw attention to their thread.

Have reported my own thread.
Hopefully it gets locked or deleted.