First 16 Week Cycle Starting in the Fall. Opinions?

[Wrigley12]

Pretty self explanatory. I am planning out my first cycle in the fall after I lose a bit of BF and dial in my training more. Spoke to a few local doctors over the last few years and they all agreed my test is pretty damn low for my age. Last time I got blood-work I was sitting at about 375 total test. Estradiol was around 20. I developed gyno during puberty but luckily its never grown since so I assume my body balanced out at some point. Life long multi-sport athlete (wrestling and football mainly) and had a pretty hectic head injury which I wont disclose here, but that's what the Doctors believe is the culprit. Any advice on this cycle that can help me maintain my gains after dropping my dose to TRT would be greatly appreciated. I am also always open to new food suggestions, articles, supplementation, and strength training advice as I am a big fan of Powerlifting and may want to get into it down the road competition wise.

Current Stats:

Age: 23
Height: 5'5
Weight 187lbs
BF%: 23% roughly
Desired Weight Before Cycle & TRT after: 177lbs sitting around 12% BF

My diet mainly consists of whole, clean foods that include the following: 2200 Calories

Protein Sources: 200 grams of protein daily, varying between different sources

Chicken Breast - 400 grams daily
Thigh meat - 150 grams added in with the breast randomly throughout the week when I get bored of just breast meat
Beef Bone Broth - about a quarter cup daily
95/15 Lean Ground Beef - 200 grams a day 2x/week
Egg Whites - 2 cups a day
Turkey Bacon - 2 slices about 3x weekly with my eggs
PB2 - once a week sometimes twice when I really crave it, spread over 1 slice Whole Wheat Toast. (kind of a dessert/treat)
Shakes of Course - roughly 80 grams a day, two scoops each shake.

Fat Sources: 100 grams of fat daily varying between different sources

Whole Eggs - 3 daily usually, most previously prepped a day or two in advance due to work schedule and I aim for adequate sleep
Extra Virgin Olive Oil - 3x weekly (I don't really measure this out very much because its most of the time lightly drizzled over meat while cooking)
Ghee - I use a teaspoon of this every time I recook rice. I find when I don't use it at all, I don't sleep very well? Weird I know lol
All Natural Peanut Butter - again, once a week Ill use a tablespoon of this mixed with pb2 to raise the health value more
Chia Seeds - sprinkled over my toast and sometimes my egg whites

Carb Sources: 175 grams of Carbs varying between VERY few sources
White Rice - Generally will have close to half a cup of this with my post workout meals to get glycogen back into my muscles fast. Thats the only time my body likes it
Long Grain Brown Rice - I will have this with 2 of my meals daily, about half a cup and sometimes 3/4 of a cup with second meal on days with no toast
Whole Wheat Toast - a single slice Once or Twice a week as stated above. Usually after dinner as a snack/treat

- I want to make it known I haven't really been eating and training for a specific performance outcome in awhile. I have just been trying to naturally get my testosterone levels back up using the advice of doctors which hasn't seemed to work and I can't really afford a coach. However, with years of being a life long athlete when I have a goal, I tackle it really hard and I have no doubts that by the fall I can reach my goal and kickstart my TRT with a healthy dosed and stable beginner's cycle. I will be doing a push/pull/rest/legs/rest split with 75% max weight with high intensity to maintain/recomp while in a caloric deficit starting in August. I want to use this month for letting my body get used to eating a little less calories and completely cut meals such as takeout with the lady despite my meals being much healthier than most would eat for takeout. During this month I will be trying probiotics for the first time, as well as increasing my vitamin intake. On rest days I will be aiming to do 60 mins of low intensity cardio and on training days 30 minutes of medium intensity to allow more blood flow and peak my two rest days' recovery. -

My ideas for the 16 week cycle currently is as follows

Testosterone - 375mg - 400 mg a week (I am currently using Ampules atm due to TRT doctor wanting wayyyy too much money for a single months supply) - Sourced from a lab-tested verified pharmacy reseller here on the board. I could really use some advice on how to split this dosage weekly since I am using amps. As of right now this will be the only anabolic agent I will be taking. If I notice fat gain to become a bit much, I MAY consider a low dose of Anavar for 4 weeks. Thats a big IF however as I only want to take Testosterone and keep things simple. Being younger, if I don't notice much of a difference with 375 I will increase the dose to 400mg a week. 500mg weekly seems overkill and as someone prone to estrogen as is, I really would rather not take two amps a week even though thats a much more clear cut approach to dosing with the ampules.

Aromasin - 12.5 mg twice a week IF NEEDED. I made sure to grab it because of my puberty onset of gyno and I also have been on Finasteride for 1 year as a preventive measure. If I can avoid AI completely of course, I will but I have a strong feeling I'll be needing something at some point. If I can only do 12.5 mg weekly and split the pills into 4s and get the estrogen in control, I would love that of course.

Nolvadex - 5-10 mg daily if needed (I am thinking I will incorporate this into my PCT perhaps if gyno doesn't flare up at all. Seemed like a better option to Clomid due to the increased side effects of clomid and I am still young however I do have that on hand aswell incase I decide to switch.) I doubt I need this for a PCT because I intend on remaining on a TRT dose as recommended by my doctor but you never know, and I'd rather be safe than sorry.

HCG - I have this on hand as well however I am not sure how I want to dose this because I only got advice on dosing from the doctor when talking about TRT doses. This is another area I am wanting to discuss with members here on the board.

Caber - This is on hand incase of Prolactin issues but with Aromasin keeping Estrogen in check, I dont think I will be needing it.

Hopefully this is a nice slew of information for you guys to offer some advice on how I should go about things. I've done alot of research into this for a few years now and I would like to say I have a very solid foundation to build quality muscle on after years of athletics, weight training, and nutritional practice. I understand my situation is pretty unique and definitely does NOT fall under the category in which other people my age do, but I do the best I can to study up, become informed, keep notes, and make the most of the cards I have been dealt. My apologies for the bible length post but I wanted to lay out as much as I can with the time I have today to gather some people up and attack my goals and enjoy a high quality of life at the same time. I would much rather cut my BF% down a bit and start this journey with a fun cycle instead of getting on TRT doses at my current BF% and possibly see minuscule results and waste what I have on hand now.

Thanks!

 

[EyeSeeYou33]

I for one always appreciate a bible-length post…however after a 12 hour workday my cerebral output is garbage. That being said, the one thing that stuck out to me was having caber on hand. Pretty heavy duty ancillary for a low dose test cycle. I’m assuming it’s due to your unique hormone profile?

 

[Canknucklehead]

I don’t think you will need caber...

And are you starting at 23%bf or 12%bf?

If it is the former you will most likely need to use the Aromasin.

Otherwise looks good.

 

[MrHowie]

Great post! If I could go back to when I started, I'd definitely recommend running Masteron with every cycle to avoid worrying about gyno or needing an AI during the cycle.

Regarding Caber, it's best to avoid it due to its toxicity. Instead, opt for vitamin B6, which can be sufficient. I personally take B6 year-round, especially as I prefer TRT with test and deca.

It's true that running test while having higher body fat can increase estrogen conversion. To counter this, I suggest staying consistent with cardio and pushing yourself on days when you feel lethargic or lazy. A cup of coffee before the workout might be just the boost you need. Cheers, mate!

 

[BigTomJ]

Great post! If I could go back to when I started, I'd definitely recommend running Masteron with every cycle to avoid worrying about gyno or needing an AI during the cycle.

Masterson is not an AI, and does not have any "AI like" effects for most people.

Some people see a lowing of serum e2 on cycle via bloodwork.

some people do not see a lowering, but perceive low e2 sides regardless (that are almost certainly misattributed due to the broscience behind Masterson)

And most do not see a change in serum e2 or a perceived reduction in high e2 sides or a perceived increase in low e2 sides.

Until you, as an individual, have bloodwork showing how you particularly respond to mast (or primo or eq for that matter, all of this also applies to primo and EQ, two other compounds also claiming AI like effects in the broscience) you should not count on these effects.
So telling someone who's preparing their first cycle "use mast so you won't need an AI" is objectively bad advice.

Regarding Caber, it's best to avoid it due to its toxicity. Instead, opt for vitamin B6, which can be sufficient. I personally take B6 year-round, especially as I prefer TRT with test and deca.

Plain b6 is going to do next to nothing to reduce prolactin levels as its bioavailability is extremely low. for prolactin control you need an activated form of b6, most commonly used p5p.

 

[narta]

Plain b6 is going to do next to nothing to reduce prolactin levels as its bioavailability is extremely low. for prolactin control you need an activated form of b6, most commonly used p5p.

And you need to preload it to work efficiently. Once prolactin levels go up, they will not come down with 5p5

 

[MrHowie]

Masterson is not an AI, and does not have any "AI like" effects for most people.

Some people see a lowing of serum e2 on cycle via bloodwork.

some people do not see a lowering, but perceive low e2 sides regardless (that are almost certainly misattributed due to the broscience behind Masterson)

And most do not see a change in serum e2 or a perceived reduction in high e2 sides or a perceived increase in low e2 sides.

Until you, as an individual, have bloodwork showing how you particularly respond to mast (or primo or eq for that matter, all of this also applies to primo and EQ, two other compounds also claiming AI like effects in the broscience) you should not count on these effects.
So telling someone who's preparing their first cycle "use mast so you won't need an AI" is objectively bad advice.



Plain b6 is going to do next to nothing to reduce prolactin levels as its bioavailability is extremely low. for prolactin control you need an activated form of b6, most commonly used p5p.

Typically, I mention p5p, but since it might not be familiar to everyone, I use the term B6, which still works well for me.

As for mast, your insights are valid, and regardless, I have decided to incorporate it into my future cycles.

Masteron was used as an anti estrogen for women with breast cancer before they discontinued it for the oral version.




View: https://youtu.be/Uka5niyOCIo

View: https://youtu.be/ExzTl_5OFkI

 

[Bigtinylittle]

What ester are the amps? I’m assuming e or cyp which is good for most people. But if you have problems with estrogen I would recommend an eod inj protocol to reduce conversion. If you have access to shorter esters thats what I would get and use eod or ed for harm reduction. Masteron at half the dose to a one for one dose to test may help but I wouldn’t rely on it. anavar may help as well but again I wouldn’t rely on it and I can’t recommend a dose as I have basically no experience with it. Remember to calculate what you want your total mg use to be and adjust the test down to account for the anavar or mast mg you add. That will suck with amps I know. This is a harm reduction protocol and not the way most competitors do things.

 

[TheBeast08]

No creo que necesites caber...

¿Y estás comenzando en 23%bf o 12%bf?

Si es lo primero, lo más probable es que necesite usar el Aromasin.

De lo contrario se ve bien.

Yo con 500 testo a la semana no he usado IA y ningún efecto secundario y tengo grasa un 30% pero tampoco he notado mucha fuerza ni nada será por el nivel de grasa?

 

[marsupial]

Yo con 500 testo a la semana no he usado IA y ningún efecto secundario y tengo grasa un 30% pero tampoco he notado mucha fuerza ni nada será por el nivel de grasa?

How many weeks into it are you? The bf level is a problem because of aromatization but it won’t prevent increase in strength if you’re progressively overloading. Honestly though you should hop off the gear and try and lose that body fat. Body fat percent either stays the same or goes up with test compared to pre cycle

 

[FleshGod]

You have too high BF and too low age. I would spend 6-12 months cutting with no gear first (maybe some clen or sema)

When you are closer to 25 years and 15-17%BF maybe you could do the cycle. You have tons of years to take PEDs. Optimize yourself first

 

[Frozen]

Why don’t you find someone to mentor you through this process, there’s too many problems with your plan. You only get one first shot at this, why not do it correctly rather than trying to decipher tom, dick, and Jerry’s different opinions on how you should go about your cycle.
(Which I believe is some BS advice being given to you by fellow members)

I started around your age listening to guys on the internet aswell and ended up with a $12k gyno bill, (p5p and b12?! Science doesn’t always transfer into BB’ing reality)
And spun my wheels for multiple years until I found then proper guidance, then I was able to get the ball rolling. Don’t fuck yourself up learning, not very fun.

If you do need help, look whom you’re receiving it from, and if they’re even valid to giving advice in this area.

Can afford a coach? Find a GOOD bb’er who’s willing to give you some guidance, and listens with open and very absorbent ears. There’s a couple guys on this forum who I personally think to be valid mentors, not one is in this thread.

Also not once had blood pressure been mentioned in this post, for a first time cycler.
Good job for the guys who have “chimes in”

Your plan here is a little goofy but can be adjusted to be better.
You’re not eating enough, and you’re too fat to start testosterone, ruining the risk of to many adverse sides effects.

Trim down.

There’s my contribution to the board for a couple months, hope it sticks. Holla at ya boy if you got any questions.

 

[buzzingonaas]

Forgive me if I misunderstood anything as I skimmed rather than read in detail. It looks like you have very low carbs and are attempting a recomp? I would strongly urge against this. You only get one first cycle, and I wasted mine recomping. Sure, i looked “sick as fuck bro” at 165lb 9% body fat. If I actually ate like a man I would have been 190 15-16% bf. Point being, it was a huge waste. I suggest cutting down to 10-12% while training hard and keeping nutrition on point before starting your cycle and ramping those carbs up slowly to try gaining 1.5lb/week average (after the initial water weight jump)

 

[Xplicit]

Can afford a coach? Find a GOOD bb’er who’s willing to give you some guidance, and listens with open and very absorbent ears. There’s a couple guys on this forum who I personally think to be valid mentors, not one is in this thread.

You typed out that wall of text, on a thread that was made in July, in which the original poster never even responded... Just to nullify your wall of text and say the above?

You realize he is quite literally doing that, right? He is on the forum, seeking advice, from its members who may or may not have more experience.

This tickle anyone else a bit? lol

 

[Fattyone]

in which the original poster never even responded.

You realize he is quite literally doing that, right? He is on the forum, seeking advice, from its members who may or may not have more experience.

Oh

 

[buzzingonaas]

whoops didn’t see he posted this so long ago before i replied too lmao

 

[Frozen]

You typed out that wall of text, on a thread that was made in July, in which the original poster never even responded... Just to nullify your wall of text and say the above?

You realize he is quite literally doing that, right? He is on the forum, seeking advice, from its members who may or may not have more experience.

This tickle anyone else a bit? lol

You’re probably one of them. Tickle tickle.

 

[Wrigley12]

Well, without checking many responses and totally forgetting I made this post figured I’d leave a bit of an update.

Since July, I have NOT yet started a cycle. Spent the last few months really dialing in my nutrition, vitamin intake more, and staying up to date with my doctor with a few blood panels. I also have started a new field of work that has me doing TONS of steady state cardio sometimes up to 12 miles a day of walking so naturally, weight has been coming off.

As far as the gym goes, my lifts have pretty much stayed consistent with little drops on some weeks which is to be expected since I am in a deficit and doing so much walking at work.

Only real question I have for when I do decide to cycle is that how I should be storing my leftover test if I wanna do 325mgs a week. Amps are obviously 250mgs per amp but I’m not sure if storing in syringe for 3 days is safe

 

[timfino]

I think you'll get away with running 350-375 test with incredible results without needing anything else. It's great to have all that on hand incase it needs to be deployed but I think for your first cycle you'll grow tons with just 350 test, hard training and a consistent surplus. Sounds like you've done your homework though. Please update us on this cycle week to week.

 

[Fattyone]

Since July, I have NOT yet started a cycle. Spent the last few months really dialing in my nutrition, vitamin intake more, and staying up to date with my doctor with a few blood panels.

Loved seeing this. Normally it’s “well I started my cycle and added a few compounds and haven’t been working out much and my nipples hurt, what should I do?”