Novice here, T,NPP,Mast or Test, EQ, NPP?

[Handy-jezza]

Short intro. 5’11, 33yo, 16st/100kg and have been training 7 years solely with weights.
Done 2 - 15 week cycles.
Test only and test primo.

Looking to experiment with another cycle.

What’s a more manageable cycle from the above?

I’ve read elsewhere though that the second cycle is a very synergistic one also but I just don’t know how I will respond to EQ in regards to rbc and hematocrit.

As for doesages I have not used any more than 400 test pw and feel it to be enough at this point.
I feel that anything more than a gram total of three compounds would just become more troublesome than beneficial.

Can anyone with past experience in these cycles offer some more insight?

thanks all

 

[Fattyone]

NPP and EQ can be a bitch sides wise for some. I suggest not running both at the same time.

Eq takes a while to clear should you experience sides.

NPP usually clears quick but some have lasting effects.

If those are your only choices I’d do test NPP mast. That’s still two new to you drugs (not a good idea) but most is fairly side effect free minus hair.

 

[JC Grifter]

Correct. Two cycles in, there’s no reason to go that high on 3 compounds. I would suggest Test and NPP. I don’t know if you really need to throw the mast in there too. That would be two new compounds you’re adding. I’d see how you do on just Test and NPP. For doses I would do this as my 3rd cycle test 400mg and NPP 300-400mg.

 

[Astartes]

The one that works best with your physiology.

You need to run cycles of them both and the compounds added one at a time over several years to have any clear understanding of which is _best_ for you.

Otherwise you are going to get widely varying answers. Only one thing I would adamantly advise, don’t change compounds once in cycle. Stick with it.

 

[Sector]

Test/NPP/EQ is one of the best stacks out there for size, but like others mentioned it can easily comes with a plethora of sides. A lot of people get negative mental effects on 19 nors like npp/deca/tren, and EQ can also spike anxiety.

You'll also put on a good amount of mass with test/npp/mast. Not as much as the previous cycle, but the sides will be much less, and the mast will help with the feeling of well being, as well as reducing bloat from the test and NPP. If it's only your third cycle and you don't have experience with eq and/or npp, I'd probably go with mast instead of EQ

The last thing you want is to get slammed with a wall of horrible side effects

 

[Handy-jezza]

NPP and EQ can be a bitch sides wise for some. I suggest not running both at the same time.

Eq takes a while to clear should you experience sides.

NPP usually clears quick but some have lasting effects.

If those are your only choices I’d do test NPP mast. That’s still two new to you drugs (not a good idea) but most is fairly side effect free minus hair.

Im not limiting my choices per se, I used test/primo and while it was a fairly good cycle there was a fair bit of tweaking to find the sweet spot of test/primo. It was good at 450/400 in the end.
I wanted to try and run a 19no r and thought NNP seemed the most sensible being shorter ester.
The mast would purely have been to help with e2. Rather use mast than a.i if poss.
But I definitely hear what you’re saying about experimenting with multiple new compounds in one cycle it’s a bit silly.
I’d likely run the test/NPP and add the mast in after if bloods show e2 getting a bit out of hand.
I normally do bloods at week 5 and again 5 weeks later. So I get an idea of where I’m headed.
So 300-400 test and 200-300 NPP. Possibly ramp it so I can feel it out. Add 100mg mast if necessary?

 

[Sector]

Im not limiting my choices per se, I used test/primo and while it was a fairly good cycle there was a fair bit of tweaking to find the sweet spot of test/primo. It was good at 450/400 in the end.
I wanted to try and run a 19no r and thought NNP seemed the most sensible being shorter ester.
The mast would purely have been to help with e2. Rather use mast than a.i if poss.
But I definitely hear what you’re saying about experimenting with multiple new compounds in one cycle it’s a bit silly.
I’d likely run the test/NPP and add the mast in after if bloods show e2 getting a bit out of hand.
I normally do bloods at week 5 and again 5 weeks later. So I get an idea of where I’m headed.
So 300-400 test and 200-300 NPP. Possibly ramp it so I can feel it out. Add 100mg mast if necessary?

The mast will take a few weeks to saturate in the system, so waiting until E2 is high to add it might not be the best plan. Plus high estrogen leads to increased prolactin sides. Try 200mast/week, can always tiltrate to 400 later in the cycle if you want but 200 should be solid for what you're looking for.

Still keep an AI and caber on Hand though. I wouldn't count on Mast to not need an AI. It also depends on how much the person aromatizes. Some people can run 400 test and not need an AI, others do. I fall in the group of people that do need an AI

 

[millcityuhh]

yeah man u always wanna have an ai. u cant just depend on mast to combat estrogen. as mentioned above you wanna make sure e2 is under control especially while running something like a 19nor. i think test and npp would be a good cycle. im assuming you're bulking sine you want to use npp. you wont see too much visual changes from mast on a bulk depending on where your bodyfat is at. i would save mast for your cut!

 

[Handy-jezza]

Of course, I keep asin in the Box always. I made the mistake of not having pharma asin to hand on the first cycle and had wild readings on e2 .
Caber I have a small amount sitting around but I haven’t ever needed. I’m actually not sure how much caber would be needed weekly if prolactin started to climb.
I didn’t hardly aromatise at all with the test and primo. Not at least until I added in some dbol back end. Some nipple sensitivity here and there.
I’ve had people say why not try just running 600-800mg test only but I think that would be a bit wild on the sides front.

 

[Sector]

Of course, I keep asin in the Box always. I made the mistake of not having pharma asin to hand on the first cycle and had wild readings on e2 .
Caber I have a small amount sitting around but I haven’t ever needed. I’m actually not sure how much caber would be needed weekly if prolactin started to climb.
I didn’t hardly aromatise at all with the test and primo. Not at least until I added in some dbol back end. Some nipple sensitivity here and there.
I’ve had people say why not try just running 600-800mg test only but I think that would be a bit wild on the sides front.

Test is pretty mild in terms of sides. It's not a bad idea.

At worst you'll be happy, horny, and perhaps a little bloated/watery

The sides from eq and npp can be far worse than potential sides from say 750 test

 

[Handy-jezza]

Test is pretty mild in terms of sides. It's not a bad idea.

At worst you'll be happy, horny, and perhaps a little bloated/watery

The sides from eq and npp can be far worse than potential sides from say 750 test

I think on that note, you’re the third person to say/agree with it.
Maybe the third cycle could be test only.
Currently trying to strip back a little more fat to reveal the fruits of my labour over autumn/winter.
I aim to reach 10-12% currently around 15-16.
I come off completely on 1,2nd cycles and i am contemplating self administering trt doses between cycles now.
I think I’m at an age where it cant do much harm. I get bloods frequently so I am fairly careful.
Thanks for your input I appreciate you being able to entertain my thoughts.

 

[Sector]

I think on that note, you’re the third person to say/agree with it.
Maybe the third cycle could be test only.
Currently trying to strip back a little more fat to reveal the fruits of my labour over autumn/winter.
I aim to reach 10-12% currently around 15-16.
I come off completely on 1,2nd cycles and i am contemplating self administering trt doses between cycles now.
I think I’m at an age where it cant do much harm. I get bloods frequently so I am fairly careful.
Thanks for your input I appreciate you being able to entertain my thoughts.

Of course man, glad to help.

Maybe throw in a little mast with the test and you'll love it, especially in a cutting cycle.

I run mast every cycle, cut or bulk. It's great stuff, unless you have a genetic disposition towards balding, then maybe not in that Case

 

[bigead]

Mast absolutely, never liked eq sides.

 

[Pulpfiction]

I can’t take eq sides. I’ve ran test mast eq and had amazing results in the past, but recently I ran eq again and it made my anxiety the worst it had been in a long time. Won’t run it again but that’s just me. Test npp and mast is a safe bet for amazing gains. Eq takes a while to really peak, usually about week 6-8. So if you go the eq route it has to be run over 12 weeks

 

[Handy-jezza]

I can’t take eq sides. I’ve ran test mast eq and had amazing results in the past, but recently I ran eq again and it made my anxiety the worst it had been in a long time. Won’t run it again but that’s just me. Test npp and mast is a safe bet for amazing gains. Eq takes a while to really peak, usually about week 6-8. So if you go the eq route it has to be run over 12 weeks

Thanks for sharing.
As for cycle length I see no point in running short cycles. I try to run 14+.
My last cycle of test primo I just got fed up of pinning so much oil by week 15. My bloods looked fine surprisingly at week 16, I probably should have strung it out to 20 weeks.

 

[benchbrethren]

Correct. Two cycles in, there’s no reason to go that high on 3 compounds. I would suggest Test and NPP. I don’t know if you really need to throw the mast in there too. That would be two new compounds you’re adding. I’d see how you do on just Test and NPP. For doses I would do this as my 3rd cycle test 400mg and NPP 300-400mg.

What ratio of test to npp would you recommend for the least chance of encountering mental sides? I've used 250 test e and 250 npp for my last 20-week cycle and made tremendous progress (ended the off-season 11 lbs heavier and about the same leanness) but the mental sides were brutal.

 

[Bjc23rj]

Why not try 500 mg test/600 mg Mast? Mast (in my opinion at least) is a much milder compound but still provides excellent results. It’s not going to pack on the mass like NPP, but it will keep you dry, sculpted (if you’re lean enough) and I feel aggressive AF in the gym. I’m running 500 mg Sust/600 mg Mast-E right now and loving it.

Btw, to anyone reading- I’m brand new here at MESO but I’ve been active on similar forums for 10+ years. Please let me know if I do or say anything in violation of rules or etiquette here while I’m learning the ropes!

 

[Handy-jezza]

Why not try 500 mg test/600 mg Mast? Mast (in my opinion at least) is a much milder compound but still provides excellent results. It’s not going to pack on the mass like NPP, but it will keep you dry, sculpted (if you’re lean enough) and I feel aggressive AF in the gym. I’m running 500 mg Sust/600 mg Mast-E right now and loving it.

Btw, to anyone reading- I’m brand new here at MESO but I’ve been active on similar forums for 10+ years. Please let me know if I do or say anything in violation of rules or etiquette here while I’m learning the ropes!

Welcome to meso
Worth a try at some point. I was initially worried that primo and mast would totally slaughter my hairline but it held up just fine on primo which gives me a little hope for future mast use.
I’m also a new member too, I frequently use Another forum too.

 

[Bjc23rj]

Welcome to meso
Worth a try at some point. I was initially worried that primo and mast would totally slaughter my hairline but it held up just fine on primo which gives me a little hope for future mast use.
I’m also a new member too, I frequently use Another forum too.

Welcome aboard to you too bud. Luckily, I’ve never had an issue with my hairline or thinning regardless of if I was on gear or not. I guess I’m one of the lucky ones!

 

[Handy-jezza]

What ratio of test to npp would you recommend for the least chance of encountering mental sides? I've used 250 test e and 250 npp for my last 20-week cycle and made tremendous progress (ended the off-season 11 lbs heavier and about the same leanness) but the mental sides were brutal.

Do you mind going into specific details on mental sides you suffered ?