QUESTION FROM NEW MEMBER REGARDING CARDIO ON FIRST AAS CYCLE

[djk]

Hi-

I am confused about cardio, and how it relates to weight training. I have read Poliquin’s articles where he describes cardio as muscle-wasting, and he believes the neural adaption required for strength gains is compromised. Others say LISS cardio, in moderation, helps active recovery. I currently am embarking on my first AAS cycle (500 Test E) with no cardio, and one of the things I have noticed is, on my rest days, I become restless. I would like to do something, but I am concerned about doing anything which might impinge on my strength gains, which up to this point have been higher than I ever would have imagined. This, for an admittedly weak 48 year-old man who has lifted for 5 years, but hasn’t experienced significant strength increases (with my AAS cycle so far, PRs most every workout). I should mention that PERFORMANCE is the goal of this first cycle. If I can get stronger, I know how to lose the fat, having lost over forty pounds a few years ago.

 

[D-Ballin]

Neither conditioning work nor liss cardio should impede strength or mass gains, within reason. Feel free to add either in, just manage your fatigue accordingly. If you feel you need the extra rest, skip for the day.

Realistically, everybody should be doing some sort of cardio, if nothing else then for the cardiovascular benefit.

Conditioning is important to me, as it fits into my goals for total overall fitness. Not just about being the biggest strongest dude, I like being the fastest and hardest to kill too. Find what's important for you.

You mean performance in terms of 1rm strength? General "hypertrophy range" lift numbers? Sport specific? Thorough conditioning work will enhance your capabilities in pretty much any athletic field, but you can tailor specifics pretty finely.

 

[djk]

I would be pursuing the hypertrophy range at this point. I have seen, at least by my standards, a marked increase in strength (3 weeks and some lifts' poundage are, no exaggeration, 30% or more higher). If I shared my workout log, it would be laughable to most members here. Nonetheless, for me it is remarkable. I used to think it was a neurological thing, genetic, that I could never push myself past these plateaus (maddening - I really used to get down on myself). Looking back to before I started this a very short time ago, I have been spinning my wheels in the gym(though, to my credit a lesser man would have given up entirely and let himself completely go, but I never gave up the dream). I have been on TRT for over three years (though I was unconscionably under dosed both topically and with injections). I imagine I would have been a candidate for TRT eight years ago or longer. I had a T level of 197 when I first visited a doctor over three years ago.

So, with normalized hormonal levels, and now optimal I imagine, I am getting strong(er), at a rate that is alarming. I do worry about injury, but I try to keep it, at heaviest, a resistance I can do at least six times WITH GOOD FORM. I am very curious to see what I can work up to. I am very late to the party at 48, almost 49. But I am a heck of a lot better than I ever may have been, had I not forayed into AAS (may well have given up entirely which would have sucked). I will share something: I am a recovering alcoholic (2 years sober). I had a real ethical struggle doing this illicitly ( a better AA member would say being in shape is beyond your control, be grateful just to be healthy). If I can house this sick mind in a healthier body, i think I have a better chance of staying sober. Maybe skewed thinking, but I know me.

I appreciate your getting back to me, and I do look forward to doing some LISS (jamming out with headphones on bike). I think it will do me some good, plus have a synergistic affect on my transformation.

 

[D-Ballin]

Glad to hear that your are overcoming your stopping blocks! No better feeling than breaking through a stubborn plateau.

I know you said you were feeling restless on your off days. My only suggestion for limiting your training would be to keep one full rest day a week, at least until you get a feel for your endurance. Other than that, just manage your fatigue as you see fit.

I like fasted morning cardio myself, whether cutting or gaining. Great to burn fat, and it also wakes up the hunger big time for me. Helps to get the calories in when you're actually looking forward to them.

 

[djk]

I am glad you mentioned fasted cardio, because I always was under the impression fasted is catabolic (lean mass disintegrating on the treadmill, please step around). I used to love fasted cardio, until I read some article advising against it.

I like a strong coffee with L Tyrosine (an amino acid beta-agonist not frequently discussed which I use pre-workout), and go. The Tyrosine does not have any anorectic qualities purportedly, but for me I swear it does. Also, and this is strictly anecdotal, it tends to make me eat better throughout the day (at least not want to eat crappy-it promotes a sense of well-being for me).

By the way, and this is off topic, are you familiar with Piracetam? My wife, who is Russian, introduced it to me. I know Poliquin took an interest in it, at least at one time. I cannot impress enough the focus it delivers (by the way, it is banned by IOC which means it must be good, huh?) She just completed a Master's degree at a top five business school, and credits this with giving her an edge, even over students supplementing with Adderall.

I am fascinated by neurotrophic drugs. I think there is something there, that it is not all hype.

 

[rigs03]

It's always good to have some sort of cardio in your routine for general health and fitness imo. I swore it off for a long time, and now that I added it back in I feel so much better, especially whenat a higher weight. Nothing crazy, just a bike ride or treadmill here and there.

The only way it is going to interfere with your strength and/or mass gains is if you aren't eating enough and the cardio translates into an overall caloric deficit.

 

[D-Ballin]

Piracetam interests me. I was looking into it before, but currently most of my play money is tied up in aas and iron. That, and modafinil, are two drugs I'm seeing more and more of nowadays. I'm wary of playing too much with these kind off things though, as I've come to learn that messing with my dopamine can put me in a strange place. . .

And I've never found fasted cardio to be particularly catabolic. I've actually been making modest gains during a cut (so more recomp really) while using it, along with a modified intermittent fasting routine. Builds enough hunger late in the day to where I can't under eat (which is a problem for me at times), but with enough time restriction that I can't really overeat unless I go to shit food, or just really try. I think it's really a matter of finding a system that works well for you, so that you can be consistent. Rather than trying to fit some sort of "ideal" eating schedule.

 

[djk]

Do you think that, with an intermittent fast, the influx of calories after the fast (I assume) serve as a bit of a refeed, like the carb-up in Bodyopus or similar CKD? I am curious about that. Do you use any thermogenics to hasten fast loss, or extend fasting period via their appetite-suppressant qualities?

Also, and this is again off topic, I started this cycle, my first, three weeks ago. I did not have Arimidex on hand, as I did not think I would need it at a dose of 500 Test E. I was feeling great, and had made progress, but I did notice not a lump but a bit of "jigglyness" over my left pectoral (why only one I couldn't say). I front loaded 1 mg Arimidex two days go, and BAM, a shitload of water came off pectorals and more incredibly, abdominal area. I think, and this may be related to my previous obesity and potato-eating leprechaun genetics, I am extremely prone to estrogen, which with my low T stands to reason. Perhaps what I thought were pounds and pounds of visceral fat werejust bloat, bloat i have carried my whole life. I may be closer to low double digits BF than I originally antcipated. My personal best physique may not be as far off as I thought. In just 48 hours I was flabbergasted how much leaner I became. I imagine, unless I pony up for Masteron (I think I will), I am going to stick with Arimidex on TRT cruising and periodic cycles.

 

[djk]

It's always good to have some sort of cardio in your routine for general health and fitness imo. I swore it off for a long time, and now that I added it back in I feel so much better, especially whenat a higher weight. Nothing crazy, just a bike ride or treadmill here and there.

The only way it is going to interfere with your strength and/or mass gains is if you aren't eating enough and the cardio translates into an overall caloric deficit.

Yes- I also am going to incorporate LISS as a secondary part of my fitness, taking care to eat enough. Thank you.

 

[dirtydogs]

A good cardio regiment will be beneficial to your growth. You'll notice many improvements, not to mention it helps with your blood pressure and lipid profile.

 

[D-Ballin]

Do you think that, with an intermittent fast, the influx of calories after the fast (I assume) serve as a bit of a refeed, like the carb-up in Bodyopus or similar CKD? I am curious about that. Do you use any thermogenics to hasten fast loss, or extend fasting period via their appetite-suppressant qualities?

I like to run the EC stack when cutting. Kills my appetite, and increases fat loss. Also helps greatly with performance on a deficit.

Have also been playing with t3, but I'm not sure where I stand on it yet to recommend it. It certainly hastens weight loss, but it makes me weak too. I'm not sure if the performance loss outweighs the increased metabolism yet. I will be revisiting it in a few months at a higher dosage to see, but that's on hold for the moment.

 

[SDbronco]

Dballin gave some real solid advice imo. If you run T3, I believe you should definitely increase your AAS dosage to counteract its catabolic effects. If not you will look flat and weak.

 

[SDbronco]

I am glad you mentioned fasted cardio, because I always was under the impression fasted is catabolic (lean mass disintegrating on the treadmill, please step around). I used to love fasted cardio, until I read some article advising against it.

I like a strong coffee with L Tyrosine (an amino acid beta-agonist not frequently discussed which I use pre-workout), and go. The Tyrosine does not have any anorectic qualities purportedly, but for me I swear it does. Also, and this is strictly anecdotal, it tends to make me eat better throughout the day (at least not want to eat crappy-it promotes a sense of well-being for me).

By the way, and this is off topic, are you familiar with Piracetam? My wife, who is Russian, introduced it to me. I know Poliquin took an interest in it, at least at one time. I cannot impress enough the focus it delivers (by the way, it is banned by IOC which means it must be good, huh?) She just completed a Master's degree at a top five business school, and credits this with giving her an edge, even over students supplementing with Adderall.

I am fascinated by neurotrophic drugs. I think there is something there, that it is not all hype.

Don't just believe everything you read! Just cause one guy thinks fasted cardio will disintegrate muscle mass it doesn't mean it works that way for everyone. I know guys that hate cardio and swear by not doing it, and they look great. And I also know guys that do tons of cardio and swear by it, they look better IMO.

 

[djk]

Yes. I think it is a matter of sticking to something. I see some guys in the weight room of my gym who look great: some do cardio, while others solely lift weights. The thing they have in common is they do it week in, week out. Consistency is the key. I think, having a taste of success, with AAS, I will see results I didn't see before (hell I already know) and to be at least able to make progress will be a new world for me. I believe that, for all of the start and stop efforts, I was doomed because of my hormonal profile. I never thought something so simple as an easy injection a couple times a week, could open so many doors. I wish i had been bold enough to do this ten years ago or more when these issues first reared their heads.
Wish me luck and I do you as well.

 

[SDbronco]

Goodluck brother.

 

[lightshift]

As long as you consume an excess of calories and consume enough carbohydrates post workout to replenish glycogen in your muscles, you should be fine with combining cardio with weight training. Compound exercises that get the heart rate elevated like squats are cardio too so you would not need to do much if at all cardio on those days imo as these hit two birds with one stone. If you're taking AAS you will get elevated protein synthesis so under those conditions I would have to say that it would not hinder your workouts, so long as you eat right.