Just wanted to know what everyone's opinion was on secondary hypogonadism and taking test. Some believe that you would only need HCG, while others believe you need both HCG and test. Should an hcg only protocol be attempted before adding in test to assess the response? Reason I ask is because I started out on both hcg and androgel. Doses were 75iu/5g per day, respectively. DHT after 4 weeks was 1.5 times upper limit, so I dropped the androgel to 2.5g and raised hcg to 110iu/day. Funny thing is, I still can "feel" like my DHT is too high. I believe this is due to my T levels reaching maximal levels with the HCG and the androgel is merely being converted to DHT. Any thoughts? I plan on staying with this protocol until my next blood test to see where DHT is.
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Secondary Hypo and Test...
- Thread starter SPE
- Start date
Androgel and then Testim drove my DHT to 3 times the upper levels of my lab.
And it drove my prostate nuts. When I switched to shots evey week in one month my DHT came down a lot. I added 500 IU's of Hcg to the shots 3 times a week MWF. My T levels and E2 went up my T went up over 400 and my E2 went from 20 to 51. I am keeping the E2 down and feel the best I every have on TRT in 21 yrs.
Phil
And it drove my prostate nuts. When I switched to shots evey week in one month my DHT came down a lot. I added 500 IU's of Hcg to the shots 3 times a week MWF. My T levels and E2 went up my T went up over 400 and my E2 went from 20 to 51. I am keeping the E2 down and feel the best I every have on TRT in 21 yrs.
Phil
Weatherlite
New Member
SWALE has stated that in theory an HcG only regime would work great but that the real world results haven't supported that theory. Perhaps it's because HcG is not truly LH but only an analog so it may not be 100% exact in its actions when compared to LH?
As for the DHT, some men are just more sensitive to gels...their skin contains too much conversion enzyme. It may be possible to see normal DHT with a lowered dose of gel. You may have to switch to cyp.
As for the DHT, some men are just more sensitive to gels...their skin contains too much conversion enzyme. It may be possible to see normal DHT with a lowered dose of gel. You may have to switch to cyp.
I told my physician the truth: that I really disliked having the use the gel each morning. The gel also turned into a goo on me after several hours due to sweat.SPE said:
Of course, many physicians aren't open to the seven day thing. Heck, many physicians don't even think to allow the patient to do the injections themsevles at home. But doing the injections every seven days is important.
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Axl
New Member
Secondary hypo and HCG
QUOTE Some believe that you would only need HCG, while others believe you need both HCG and test. Should an hcg only protocol be attempted before adding in test to assess the response? END QUOTE
There is a difference between theory and reality. In theory, only HCG might do the trick, if your testicals are 100% healthy. In my case it didn't work with HCG alone. I am hypogonadal, and stimulation with HCG did not help me a great deal: my levels rose from 200 ng/dl to 440 ng/dl after 6 months. I still felt like crap.
If you have been hypogonadal all your life, it's very likely that your balls aren't in optimal condition either. If you're hypogonadal after steroid abuse, your testicels might still be in optimal shape and might react to HCG alone. Only in this case HCG alone might do the trick.
For that high DHT, switching to IM shots is a good alternative.
QUOTE Some believe that you would only need HCG, while others believe you need both HCG and test. Should an hcg only protocol be attempted before adding in test to assess the response? END QUOTE
There is a difference between theory and reality. In theory, only HCG might do the trick, if your testicals are 100% healthy. In my case it didn't work with HCG alone. I am hypogonadal, and stimulation with HCG did not help me a great deal: my levels rose from 200 ng/dl to 440 ng/dl after 6 months. I still felt like crap.
If you have been hypogonadal all your life, it's very likely that your balls aren't in optimal condition either. If you're hypogonadal after steroid abuse, your testicels might still be in optimal shape and might react to HCG alone. Only in this case HCG alone might do the trick.
For that high DHT, switching to IM shots is a good alternative.
I know a lot of men that do HCG only and they are doing ok so they say. I say try HCG only and see how you do if you don't get good levels the add the T shot or Gel. I wish David Z was around for you he does hcg and I think he put his treatment in a post here some time ago. His Dr. is Shippen.SPE said:
Phil
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