TESTOSTERONE 1ST CYCLE PROTOCOL FOR REVIEW

[Dark Eagle]

Hi Everyone,

I'm about to start my first cycle and I would REALLY appreciate some advice from experienced steroid users on this protocol below i.e. is it solid? Does it need to be tweaked, does the PCT need to be on a 'do I detect anything' dosage? etc. Thanks Guys:

At 44yrs of age with normal test levels, I feel more comfortable easing into it and gradually increasing as its all new to this body – be great to hear if anyone has also ran their first cycle like this:

Testosterone CypionateCycle - “Testodex Cypionate 250 (250mg/ml)

Week 1:
*100mgs Test x 2 Mon & Thu (Possibly same again 2nd week to ascertain body’s reaction to it) If all good, increase -

Week 2:
*150mg Test x 2 Mon & Thu

Week 3:
* 200mg Test x 2 Mon & Thu

Week 4–10:
*250mg Test x 2 Mon & Thur

Week 11:
*150mg Test x 2 Mon & Thu

Week 12:
*100mg Test x 2 Mon & Thu

Week 1-12:
*1 quarter tablet of Fincar per day (1.25mg) -
*1 quarter tablet of arimidex every second day (0.25mg)
*1 tablet of clomid every second day (50mg)
*320mg of standardized Saw Palmetto Extract per day

Week 13:
*1.25mg of finasteride per day
*.25mg of Arimidex every second day
*100mg of clomid every day

Week 14:
*1 quarter tablet of Arimidex every 3rd day (0.25mg)
*50mg of clomid every day

Finished!

Thanks gents
Nick

 

[unforgivingconsumer]

Ascertain your body's reaction to test? If you really want to do that I say more power to you for being cautious. But I think you'll just be pissed down the road when you realize you wasted time on cycle. There is no reason to taper up or down. So I'm seeing your highest dose is 250mg twice a week. Just run that the whole cycle. It is so simple!

I'm wondering why you're taking Clomid EOD during the cycle. What is you logic? I would recommend against that. If you're extremely prone to gyno even with an AI you could do Nolvadex twice a week (long half-life). But this is your first cycle, you wouldn't know.

Also, the Saw Palmetto, plus Finasteride? Dude, just drop the Saw Palmetto. You're taking a pharmaceutical DHT blocker. If you need to up to dose on cycle, do so. Do you presently take Finasteride?

Week 13 is too early to start PCT as well (and I really don't see much of a PCT right now).

Week 1:
*100mgs Test x 2 Mon & Thu

Week 2-12:
*250mg Test x 2 Mon & Thur

Week 1-12:
*1 quarter tablet of Fincar per day (1.25mg) -
*1 quarter tablet of arimidex every second day (0.25mg)

Week 13-14:
*1.25mg of finasteride per day
*.25mg of arimidex every second day
*Begin HCG blast at 2000iu EOD for 20 days, 10 injections total, will run into week 15

Week 15-18:
*1.25mg of finasteride per day
2x 50mg Clomid ED
1x 20mg Nolvadex ED

Week 19-20:
20mg Nolvadex ED

 

[Colt44]

^^^He's absolutely correct. No need for tapering. Just run 250mg X2 per week every 3.5 days. Drop the clomid until pct. Why run it during? Not giving you shit, but why?

 

[Dark Eagle]

Thanks so much for writing this up that's really awesome and apologies for delayed reply, just out of hospital...prolapsed disc. :-/

All good now and back at gym today.

Ok - Appreciate your words re tapering up and down from the test. Its just fear based because my test levels are normal. After reading both your thoughts on this I will go the 250mg x 2 a week for full cycle.

This cycle that I put up was found here at this link: http://www.timinvermont.com/fitness/test1.htm

Re: Clomid - no I'm physically healthy with no issues. Clomid was just recommended to be taken as mentioned in the cycle I found. My thoughts were by taking it, it counteracted effects and kept things in good state whilst on the test.
- I see your suggested scheduling and dosage. Excellent

Re Finasteride and Saw Palmeto - No I don't take it. (Only in cycle because it was suggested in the article. The article appears to be written from old texts which I felt could be out of date with current trends and science.)
*The only thing I have noticed that I'm susceptible to is when taking excessive bodybuilding supplements my hair begins to fall out. Wanted to make sure I had the balding area covered sufficiently.
- Will follow your cycle and up dosage of Finasteride if required. Great

Re "Week 13-14 - *Begin HCG blast at 2000iu EOD for 20 days, 10 injections total, will run into week 15"
1. What does EOD stand for? (Its not end of day is it?)
2. What time of the day should it be pinned?
3. If its 10 injections, how is pinned for 20 days? (The EOD question will probably answer 2 & 3..

I'm ordering through sciroxx dot kom coming to LA. Are you familiar with them or have any suggestions?

Thanks so much for this great advise.




This

Ascertain your body's reaction to test? If you really want to do that I say more power to you for being cautious. But I think you'll just be pissed down the road when you realize you wasted time on cycle. There is no reason to taper up or down. So I'm seeing your highest dose is 250mg twice a week. Just run that the whole cycle. It is so simple!

I'm wondering why you're taking Clomid EOD during the cycle. What is you logic? I would recommend against that. If you're extremely prone to gyno even with an AI you could do Nolvadex twice a week (long half-life). But this is your first cycle, you wouldn't know.

Also, the Saw Palmetto, plus Finasteride? Dude, just drop the Saw Palmetto. You're taking a pharmaceutical DHT blocker. If you need to up to dose on cycle, do so. Do you presently take Finasteride?

Week 13 is too early to start PCT as well (and I really don't see much of a PCT right now).

Week 1:
*100mgs Test x 2 Mon & Thu

Week 2-12:
*250mg Test x 2 Mon & Thur

Week 1-12:
*1 quarter tablet of Fincar per day (1.25mg) -
*1 quarter tablet of arimidex every second day (0.25mg)

Week 13-14:
*1.25mg of finasteride per day
*.25mg of arimidex every second day
*Begin HCG blast at 2000iu EOD for 20 days, 10 injections total, will run into week 15

Week 15-18:
*1.25mg of finasteride per day
2x 50mg Clomid ED
1x 20mg Nolvadex ED

Week 19-20:
20mg Nolvadex ED

 

[Dark Eagle]

^^^He's absolutely correct. No need for tapering. Just run 250mg X2 per week every 3.5 days. Drop the clomid until pct. Why run it during? Not giving you shit, but why?

Thanks for the info Colt44 ;-)

 

[unforgivingconsumer]

@Dark Eagle

I'm not really sure I've ever heard of Sciroxx, but I'm really in no place to recommend a supplier, and even if I was, I wouldn't recommend one. Check out the underground section and lurk a bit. It would be a shame if your first cycle turned out to be bunk (not insinuating, just saying). If you think they're good then do it.

EOD stands for every other day, HCG should just be pinned around the same time as your first pin, but really doesn't matter too much as long you're consistent. So 10 injections, every other day, is 20 days.

Please make sure you've got all the SERMs, AI's, and HCG on hand. You never know if you'll need to cycle off quickly. Or like my first cycle, itchy nipples within a week, so bad I was waking up in the middle of the night (test prop, thankfully I follow my own advice).

Also, make sure you're tracking on all the possible side effects, and know how to treat them. Particularly estrogen related.

 

[Dr JIM]

I suspect you would benefit considerably if you would devote more time reading about cycling dosing, intervals, half lives, AI's, SERMs, DHT inhibitors etc.

Like C-44 implied someone grossly over thought their cycle.

How about you pin 250mg of TT twice a week for 12 weeks, nothing more or less. The other items cab be placed on hold awaiting the development of those signs and/or symptoms which warrant their use.

What pre-cycle labs have you obtained? I ask bc this step must NOT be omitted especially at your age fella!

 

[Dark Eagle]

@Dark Eagle

I'm not really sure I've ever heard of Sciroxx, but I'm really in no place to recommend a supplier, and even if I was, I wouldn't recommend one. Check out the underground section and lurk a bit. It would be a shame if your first cycle turned out to be bunk (not insinuating, just saying). If you think they're good then do it.

EOD stands for every other day, HCG should just be pinned around the same time as your first pin, but really doesn't matter too much as long you're consistent. So 10 injections, every other day, is 20 days.

Please make sure you've got all the SERMs, AI's, and HCG on hand. You never know if you'll need to cycle off quickly. Or like my first cycle, itchy nipples within a week, so bad I was waking up in the middle of the night (test prop, thankfully I follow my own advice).

Also, make sure you're tracking on all the possible side effects, and know how to treat them. Particularly estrogen related.

Hey buddy, no worries re reliable source just going on a trusted referral.

re EOD - Ahh ok great im Australian, 'every other day' is 'every second day' in Aus. 20 days

re serm's, ai's & hcg - Yes will definitely have everything prior and hope to avoid the itchys. You mentioned 'You never know if you'll need to cycle off quickly'. In what instances would one need to cycle off other than injury (work around possibly) or serious reaction? I just strained my posterior deltoid/teres yesterday so I wont be starting the cycle anytime soon by the looks...but thats my concern cycling also, I do injuries when I go heavy that are usually tendon related. Right now I have forearm and shoulder pain so hopefully a few weeks will be enough before using them again.

Great advice will certainly research the sides and treatment further for them further.

Thanks again for the advice really appreciate it and post my cycle as I go. ;-)

 

[Dark Eagle]

I suspect you would benefit considerably if you would devote more time reading about cycling dosing, intervals, half lives, AI's, SERMs, DHT inhibitors etc.

Like C-44 implied someone grossly over thought their cycle.

How about you pin 250mg of TT twice a week for 12 weeks, nothing more or less. The other items cab be placed on hold awaiting the development of those signs and/or symptoms which warrant their use.

What pre-cycle labs have you obtained? I ask bc this step must NOT be omitted especially at your age fella!

Hey Dr Jim,

Appreciate the input thank you.

Yep lotttta conflicting info out there....

Yes will be doing the testodex cyp 250 x 2 per week for 12 weeks.
Seeing its first cycle I haven't ordered the extra items before so my concern by not having them on deck prior is not getting them for what ever reason right when I need them... Need to check the reliability of my provider

Re Your last question about pre-cycle labs - My doc knows Im about to do a cycle of test so arranged a number of blood draws...7 viles I filled. I just got my blood work back from him. Everything is within normal ranges. Is there anything more or specific I needed to do?

Cheers,
Nick

 

[Dr JIM]

Yea what tests were conducted, be specific.

 

[Dark Eagle]

Yea what tests were conducted, be specific.

Testosterone, Vit D, B12, Folate, Iron, Ferritin, all other chemistry minerals, & hematolgy

 

[Dr JIM]

How about an LH, E-2 and Free Tesosterone levels? Have these ordered if they are not yet scheduled.

Is this DOC primarily involved in "aging", "wellness medicine" or does he run a TRT clinic primarily?

I ask bc those tests are primarily indicated whenever an "anemia panel" reveals some sort of abnormality anemia in particular.

What are these other "chemistry minerals" ?

No offense but what I'm hearing thus far best approximates what many involved in contemporary medical practice refer to as "shotgun medicine" and the problem with such endeavors becomes one of chasing "abnormal" lab values in spite of an asymptomatic patient!

 

[Dark Eagle]

The doctor is just a general practitioner - what type of doctor should one be seeing before cycling?

I will be sure to get LH, E-2 & Free testosterone blood work but from a different type of doc i suspect...

I had Lyme disease for 3 years, clear of it since Aug 14' but it took a toll on my body. I strain tendons and ligaments too often. I'm not sure why he ordered the blood work received. The Chemistry minerals are: sodium, potassium, chloride, creatinine, Eco2, Anion gap, glucose, calcium,protein, albumin,alkaline phos, bun, sgop/ast, sgpt/alt

 

[Dr JIM]

The doctor is just a general practitioner - what type of doctor should one be seeing before cycling?

I will be sure to get LH, E-2 & Free testosterone blood work but from a different type of doc i suspect...

I had Lyme disease for 3 years, clear of it since Aug 14' but it took a toll on my body. I strain tendons and ligaments too often. I'm not sure why he ordered the blood work received. The Chemistry minerals are: sodium, potassium, chloride, creatinine, Eco2, Anion gap, glucose, calcium,protein, albumin,alkaline phos, bun, sgop/ast, sgpt/alt

That's fine and is often referred to as a "chemistry or chem 20,16,12 panel". The numerical assignment is reflective of the number of results from each grouping.

It actually now appears his is checking your BASELINE lab values, which is within the standard IME.

Just see if he is willing to add those three tests I mentioned and by all means stick with this doc if such is the case especially if you "like him" on a personal basis! I'm not suggesting he needs to be your best friend but rather someone willing to adapt to the differing needs among patients, yours in particular.

 

[bigdeee973]

OP just curious I didn't seem to find an answer but why the taper in your dosage ? Are you afraid of sides

 

[Dark Eagle]

That's fine and is often referred to as a "chemistry or chem 20,16,12 panel". The numerical assignment is reflective of the number of results from each grouping.

It actually now appears his is checking your BASELINE lab values, which is within the standard IME.

Just see if he is willing to add those three tests I mentioned and by all means stick with this doc if such is the case especially if you "like him" on a personal basis! I'm not suggesting he needs to be your best friend but rather someone willing to adapt to the differing needs among patients, yours in particular.

thats great to get that feedback re the doc appreciate it. Yeah I like this one.lol and they are hide to find! although i'd like him more if he prescribed me testosterone. Said he isn't keen on a malpractice suit I said fare enough ;-)

I'll just have to go back to get those three done. Thanks again Dr Jim! Can't believe i just mashed the terres and delt... will be back soon I hope.

Cheers,
Nick

 

[Dark Eagle]

OP just curious I didn't seem to find an answer but why the taper in your dosage ? Are you afraid of sides

Hey bigdee, the tapering option is fear based as its first cycle and my test levels are within range. At my age hearing the possibility of stroke and heart attack warnings from the doc is enough to consider tapering but I haven't decided fully yet.

 

[bigdeee973]

Yes age ! I forgot about that ..well I will be interested to see how it goes for you. .is your heart healthy ?

 

[Dark Eagle]

yeah im pretty fit and heart healthy. Looking forward to finally starting but just got bumped back with strains...so hopefully no more than 3 weeks away now. Will be posting progress results. Cheers ;-)

 

[Dark Eagle]

How about an LH, E-2 and Free Tesosterone levels? Have these ordered if they are not yet scheduled.

Is this DOC primarily involved in "aging", "wellness medicine" or does he run a TRT clinic primarily?

I ask bc those tests are primarily indicated whenever an "anemia panel" reveals some sort of abnormality anemia in particular.

What are these other "chemistry minerals" ?

No offense but what I'm hearing thus far best approximates what many involved in contemporary medical practice refer to as "shotgun medicine" and the problem with such endeavors becomes one of chasing "abnormal" lab values in spite of an asymptomatic patient!

Dr Jim - my doc asked what E2 is? is it Estradiol?