The ongoing Clomid vs. Nolvadex debate?

[seand95]

Im interested in taking clomid throughout for the benefits to health (cholesterol) and estorgen blockage. I know taking 25mg/d is common. Nolvadex, of course is what is mainly used for this, but ive also heard of taking nolv as PCT. this article was posted on here by N4cer, http://www.mindandmuscle.net/magazine/i6clomid.html
im looking to do a couple things here:
A. Stop any negative effects from estrogen and get the benefits from it at the same time.
B. Not by one or the other because it seems that only one is really needed.

 

[seand95]

anyone? maybe if you do use only nolv for recovery, can you give some reasons why (besides the fact that you dont get the "clomid blues" from nolv)?

 

[stunt101]

i use nolva on cycle clomid post cycle

from my research seems to be most recomended

 

[ryan400]

Prolonged use of clomid can cause damage to the retina. Which is reason enough for me to go with nolva.

 

[Deacon]

I run nolva pct only - no clomid period

 

[einstein1905]

Llewellyn only cites older (circa 1980) papers to support his points. Read those papers and draw your own conclusions. All of the more current stuff doesn't really show one is better over the other. He fails to mention the literature that doesn't support his point, as is often the case when people write 3rd party "scientific" articles. I'm not saying he's wrong....nor am I saying he's right, but he serves you up biased "proof". I use both nolva and clomid pct, as so many others do and have for years. It doesn't have to be an either or type of thing.

 

[dustoff1]

Sheesh... wish it were more clear cut... I have both ready to go...

 

[einstein1905]

Sheesh... wish it were more clear cut... I have both ready to go...

What would be your reasons for not using both, out of curiosity?

 

[Biggriz]

Bump what Ryan400 said...sides of taking clomid for extended periods.
But I've seen it all, clomid & nolva-PCT...clomid only-PCT,,,nolva only-PCT...and it has all worked. Now if were talking heavy extended cycles...I believe there are less options, and you better know what and how much to take----A-dex, HCG,etc

 

[einstein1905]

Bump what Ryan400 said...sides of taking clomid for extended periods.
But I've seen it all, clomid & nolva-PCT...clomid only-PCT,,,nolva only-PCT...and it has all worked. Now if were talking heavy extended cycles...I believe there are less options, and you better know what and how much to take----A-dex, HCG,etc

This is kind of what I was saying before. I assume you've taken a look at the studies that implicate clomid in retinal abnormalities. There isn't anything that I've ever seen that is significant. I'm sure we all know of at least some people that have used clomid for many pcts with no ill effects, except for crying all the time I'm just saying...don't be so quick to accept what you hear or even what you see. People have been successful with a variety of pcts in the past....cytadren was used in the past and is almost unheard of these days. It's good to be cautious,,,I respect that.

 

[Biggriz]

Now I'll bump what Einstein said...I may have been misunderstood. Clomid is "great' for PCT...I and alot of people I know have used it for MANY PCT's. I also will continue to use it after all my cycles during recovery (one month at a time). BUT...I myself and others I know have complained of a "blurry type vision" when used for LONG periods. I'm not just typing what I've seen someone else write...I've actually experienced it myself. Case in point; I used clomid during, as well as PCT for a 12 week cycle once..total of more than 16 weeks straight, and I can tell you for a fact it effected my eyesight.

 

[einstein1905]

Now I'll bump what Einstein said...I may have been misunderstood. Clomid is "great' for PCT...I and alot of people I know have used it for MANY PCT's. I also will continue to use it after all my cycles during recovery (one month at a time). BUT...I myself and others I know have complained of a "blurry type vision" when used for LONG periods. I'm not just typing what I've seen someone else write...I've actually experienced it myself. Case in point; I used clomid during, as well as PCT for a 12 week cycle once..total of more than 16 weeks straight, and I can tell you for a fact it effected my eyesight.

OK I like to see this type of thing, and I'm glad you posted it. I think we'd both agree that there wouldn't be any reason to use clomid for that length again, but you actually saw an effect on vision. I've never had an issue and haven't heard of others, but they may have overlooked (poor choice of words ) some slight effect on vision due to being chemically modified in a number of ways at the time.

 

[Biggriz]

Damn your quick bro!!! I for one am a "clomid lover" and believe it's use in recovery is second to none. I however have learned the proper way to use it, and now have ZERO sides

 

[seand95]

Damn your quick bro!!! I for one am a "clomid lover" and believe it's use in recovery is second to none. I however have learned the proper way to use it, and now have ZERO sides

what works best for you. and why did you use it for 16 weeks straight? trying to get the wife pregnant?