shady shady biz

well,I was under the impression the chinese are fucking up the synthesis, by cutting back on the component that drives the reaction. Thats why in the hplc you see alot of "byproduct", its unreacted material.
I wasnt sure if methanol extraction would get good results.I know theres alot of people working on this, but I havent seen anybody publishing their results.
 
Another way is to find out what your experimenting on is soluble or insoluble in different things. Find one that dissolves everything but what you want left behind , and there might be a gem or two staring you in the eyes. Twinkling.

This is the method I used to remove primarily water soluble contaminants.
Like dredd09 said in his post the idea is to find what your compound is soluble and insoluble in.

In our case we are talking testosterone which is soluble in a solvent but is insoluble in water.
The solvent in our grear is BA but I chose ethanol (everclear) 95% idealy you would use usp grade 100% or 200 proof available online for $60 a pint plus $25 hazmat fee min order of 2.

The other ingredient is chilled distilled water.

I found 7ml of ethanol per gram of testosterone to do the trick to disolve it.
Some mild heat may be required as well 180F or so.

Chill in fridge or freezer 10ml of distilled water per gram while disolving test.

Once disolved and all crystals are gone leaving a clear liquid allow to cool somewhat then
using a 20ml pin or larger draw up the chilled distilled water.
Then slowly, very slowly dribble the water into the flask along the inside edge.
You should see white crystals from as the water comes into contact with you solute.
The testosterone is falling out of the solution or precipitating out of the solute.
Any water soluble substance will remain in the liquid.
Continue to slowly add water till the test no longer precipitates out of solute.

Using a coffee filter and another beaker filter the clumpy white powder out of the liquid.
Then using more distilled water rinse the crystals a few more times to get any of the ethanol off.

Allow to dry, for test esters with a higher melting point this can be done with heat as long as it is well below the melting point.

My results so far have been a 65% yield on some test E and a 95% yield on some test p
Obviously there was additional water soluble products in the test E and a little bit in the test p
Now there can still be contaminants in them that have the same properties of testosterone
soluble in solvent and not in water.

Both products tested very well after using LM and the TestE very well after brewing, I have yet to brew the test P.

Tip: weigh everything before hand and write it down. beakers, filter, stir stick, rubberbands or paperclips used to hold the filter.
This will make calculating yield much easier, for instance if you know the weight of you filter then you can leave powder in filter and deduct its weight, because you will lose some in the filter.

If anyone else has something to add or notice an error please post up, I am an amature and enjoy learning and sharing what I have found.
 
great post @BIGMESC will have to try this out sometime. how long do you have to dry/how do you know there is no more moisture in the yielded test E? as you know this can sometimes mess with brews making them crash or cloudy...
 
A few days, then I used heat, brought it up above the melting point for a little while prior to adding the oil ect.
Moisture can be an issue with this method obviously, good comment.
I was considering putting it in a container with some Silica Gel Desiccant Packets but I didn't have the patience.
 
A few days, then I used heat, brought it up above the melting point for a little while prior to adding the oil ect.
Moisture can be an issue with this method obviously, good comment.
I was considering putting it in a container with some Silica Gel Desiccant Packets but I didn't have the patience.

you didnt have problems with cloudiness or water right? im curious as to how big of a batch you did? because if it's like 10g then there's not as much matter for water to cling onto but if it's like 100-200g then unless you're spreading it out all that water is going to be clinging onto crevasses and even with a desiccant it's going to take a few days

edit: if you use a desiccant i believe it has to be in a sealed environment correct? maybe if you had a big container or bottle and spread out the powder it would be a big faster...in any case having it all clumped together i would think would take forever to "dry"
 
you didnt have problems with cloudiness or water right? im curious as to how big of a batch you did? because if it's like 10g then there's not as much matter for water to cling onto but if it's like 100-200g then unless you're spreading it out all that water is going to be clinging onto crevasses and even with a desiccant it's going to take a few days

edit: if you use a desiccant i believe it has to be in a sealed environment correct? maybe if you had a big container or bottle and spread out the powder it would be a big faster...in any case having it all clumped together i would think would take forever to "dry"

Check it out @CensoredBoardsSuck , the "new" guy also knows all about brewing!!
 
you didnt have problems with cloudiness or water right? im curious as to how big of a batch you did? because if it's like 10g then there's not as much matter for water to cling onto but if it's like 100-200g then unless you're spreading it out all that water is going to be clinging onto crevasses and even with a desiccant it's going to take a few days

edit: if you use a desiccant i believe it has to be in a sealed environment correct? maybe if you had a big container or bottle and spread out the powder it would be a big faster...in any case having it all clumped together i would think would take forever to "dry"

you could use a food dehydrator (disable the heating element). Also, damp rid
 
Best to let the crystals dry slow. The slow crystallization of any crystal will produce larger, higher quality crystals, which push impurities to the outside of the crystal. This is done in tandem with a "wash" of said crystals to remove byproducts and impurities after slow drying.
 
Also using the above method stated, dont wait for cooling at all before adding chilled water..this jump starts the formations..which you tgen control by rate of drying.
 
Also using the above method stated, dont wait for cooling at all before adding chilled water..this jump starts the formations..which you tgen control by rate of drying.

I was told you can get some nice big crystals if you are patient. Im not so much.
 
After you have dissolved crystals in meoh, heating , but being aware of pure alcohols flash point. ...i wouldnt go to 180..kinda high for me ..but ive seen alcohol fires destroy homes..after heating in a heat safe container..meaning pyrex or better...otherwise you'll possibly have broken glass when you add ice cold water..this extreme cold crashes out the crystals ..rough and dirty like. If you want to remove byproducts, continue forward with solvent wash or acid base type extraction/ crystallization.
 
@BIGMESC I tried something similar with methanol and water, only I heated them to just under the boiling point of methanol to get higher solubility, and (stupidly) I mixed the test raws in the water then added methanol until the test dissolved (the solution turned clear). I now have a nice solution of water, methanol and 20g of test-e raws. It doesn't recrystallize even in the freezer. I did get some sediment out that's definitely not test and not water soluble.

Have been planning on trying it again using hexane and water because they are immiscible, only my "lab" isn't fire resistant enough.

A dumb question... If you are just removing the water soluble impurities, couldn't you just do a water wash without the ethanol? The reason I was looking at recrystallization was to get the stuff that isn't water soluble out. @Dr JIM says this won't work and I need to instead use fractional distillation. I've been pestering him for answers along these lines while moving my toys to a lab I can't burn down.
 
you could do a water wash only but that may only remove the exterior contaminants, I believe the idea of dissolving completely is to remove as many bonds as possible prior to the wash, to obtain a more complete wash.
I did try methanol in an earlier trial but even after rinsing many times I was uncomfortable with the idea of injecting some methanol, that is why I tried the ethanol.

@BIGMESC I tried something similar with methanol and water, only I heated them to just under the boiling point of methanol to get higher solubility, and (stupidly) I mixed the test raws in the water then added methanol until the test dissolved (the solution turned clear). I now have a nice solution of water, methanol and 20g of test-e raws. It doesn't recrystallize even in the freezer. I did get some sediment out that's definitely not test and not water soluble.

Have been planning on trying it again using hexane and water because they are immiscible, only my "lab" isn't fire resistant enough.

A dumb question... If you are just removing the water soluble impurities, couldn't you just do a water wash without the ethanol? The reason I was looking at recrystallization was to get the stuff that isn't water soluble out. @Dr JIM says this won't work and I need to instead use fractional distillation. I've been pestering him for answers along these lines while moving my toys to a lab I can't burn down.
 
After you have dissolved crystals in meoh, heating , but being aware of pure alcohols flash point. ...i wouldnt go to 180..kinda high for me ..but ive seen alcohol fires destroy homes..after heating in a heat safe container..meaning pyrex or better...otherwise you'll possibly have broken glass when you add ice cold water..this extreme cold crashes out the crystals ..rough and dirty like. If you want to remove byproducts, continue forward with solvent wash or acid base type extraction/ crystallization.

I may try this next, I have a friend who is experienced in the PH method (acid/base) and is willing to give me a hand. It is a little more technical due to having to monitoring the PH and temp.
 
It works. Instead of water, no reason not to try another polar solvent that doesn't dissolve oil? And why hexane instead of the commonly available five times filtered butane? Also washing methanol away seems risky at best.. Adding heating after washing with DH20 would be ideal to dry meoh from the goodies.
 
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