Bulking advice (Testosterone or NPP)

[Deleted member 123722]

Nah I’m a complete novice but that seems like a bad idea.

No testosterone with the nand?

That’s chemical castration.

Anything you do will "castrate" your natty levels; and yes, you don't "need" test with the nandrolone at higher levels, that's the point lol. One day, run the experiment for yourself, that is, if you get bad sides with test/deca combo.

 

[Big_paul]

I need an opinion.

I’m on a bulk.

I’m curious whether I should increase the testosterone dosage to 750mg pw from 500mg.

Or alternatively,

To continue running 500mg pw of testosterone & also adding in 500mg pw of NPP.

Would love to hear some thoughts.

Thanks.

Add the npp, it's more anabolic. If you can't keep an erection stop.

 

[Mechanic]

Crashed E2 is fucking awful bro. Literally changed who I was as an individual. Lost motivation to do anything but sleep and just felt like shit the entire time. Took me a month to catch on and another month to rebound and feel normal. Wouldn't wish it on anyone.

There should be a sticky on this. I was among those when I first started who thought estrogen was the devil from all the horror stories about gyno and limp dick online and overused AIs. Now I let my E2 ride high and feel much better.

I don't even check my E2 anymore at all. I've had it up at 200 and felt perfectly fine. Not sure but my body seems to aromatize heavily as when I wasn't on gear I had an E2 of 130~ and 550 Total Test. Seems like my body is used to high e2 and doesn't give a fuck. Never had gyno issues and still don't.

 

[Mechanic]

Do what I did and run a gram of deca only...virtually zero sides, no deca dick, no high blood pressure; I did a whole post about it on cycle logs. I did add Drol for like 19 days, but then dropped it, as it was giving me sides. But the point of the experiment was, you don't need test to grow, and you can avoid sides, including bloating. I also kept every ounce I gained when I got off as well. Currently cutting right now.

Mike Mentzer would run 900mg of NPP only.

Source on the Mentzer usage? I read that he supposedly used 300mg NPP EOD...

 

[Rido]

Wow you get this wound up over what 250mg of test does?

What dose of test do you normally run then. educate me expert.

Don't some people say they start seeing some diminishing returns on 500 to 750? Then increase side effects?

 

[jJjburton]

Don't some people say they start seeing some diminishing returns on 500 to 750? Then increase side effects?

I upped the npp to 700 mg but test is at 350. Wanting to up the test too to 700, but i have just got more sides when i tried that.

 

[barbell001]

Don't some people say they start seeing some diminishing returns on 500 to 750? Then increase side effects?

I think it depends person to person - I've always done well on high Test and never take an AI. I know other guys who can't stand over 400mg/wk and always need an AI.

 

[Jackripper]

Never had libido problems on nand.
Deca increases my libido even on therapeutic dosage. Whatever the ratio.

Same here. My hoe was actually complaining that I hit it too hard yesterday lol. Running only 300/300 test/NPP w 50 anadrol. I DO, however, start getting really jealous and paranoid after a few weeks, especially at higher doses. Almost manic. But, the juice is worth the squeeze!

 

[Turbo charged]

I would not start with 500 npp I would use 300 then after 2 weeks give your body another 100 then again in 2 more weeks 100 more. Remember 500 test 500 npp is going to put on alot of water weight to me is slop weight. This is a big dose you don't need that much but have at it.

 

[Mechanic]

I would not start with 500 npp I would use 300 then after 2 weeks give your body another 100 then again in 2 more weeks 100 more. Remember 500 test 500 npp is going to put on alot of water weight to me is slop weight. This is a big dose you don't need that much but have at it.

Does it always result in a lot of water accumulation or can it be circumvented? Im tempted to try Test and Nand together at like 350 Test and 300-500 NPP.

 

[theotherguy]

Does it always result in a lot of water accumulation or can it be circumvented? Im tempted to try Test and Nand together at like 350 Test and 300-500 NPP.

IME, water retention has quite a lot to do with diet, but I also have to sometimes hit the AI/SERMs to get the water retention to subside.

 

[effswithtren]

Does it always result in a lot of water accumulation or can it be circumvented? Im tempted to try Test and Nand together at like 350 Test and 300-500 NPP.

I’ve had a lot less water retention when I added in telmisartan. I dunno if that was it or something else in the cycle, but I’m personally leaning to that as the culprit.

 

[EamonDeValera]

Don't some people say they start seeing some diminishing returns on 500 to 750? Then increase side effects?

I think it usually caps at 750mg for all injectable steroids besides boldenone.

Boldenone is best run at 2-3grams.

I know.... crazy isn’t it

 

[EamonDeValera]

I want to pack on as much mass as possible.

I was thinking running 350-500 NPP per week and match it up with Testosterone at the necessary dosage, running it for 16-20 weeks depending on how it goes.

I’ll throw in a bit of Dianabol as a finisher for the last 6 weeks at 50mg per day.

If anyone has any other suggestions I’d love to hear it.

I play Gaelic football (not American football this a different sport only played in Ireland) which is quite a psychical game.

Fitness or endurance is not a concern.

 

[malfeasance]

I think it usually caps at 750mg for all injectable steroids besides boldenone.

Boldenone is best run at 2-3grams.

I know.... crazy isn’t it

I just want to point out that there is no such cap as your first line claims.

If you max out on 600/300, you will get bigger on your next cycle at 1000/500, and then again at 1200/600, and so on, as long as the food is there to support it.

Extra food beyond the point that a lower dose will support is just going to go to fat - otherwise we could just keep eating more on 300mg of testosterone and all be 280 pound shredded freaks on stage.


I have heard pro bodybuilders make claims that test alone as a base is best at about 1.5 grams, but I have heard others say no, you keep growing with more as long as you can handle the sides, at which point the others usually chime in with something more like 1.2 to 1.5 is the "sweet spot" where sides and benefits are in sync. Now that is test only, all other stuff on top of that.

Just this week heard Dave Crosland (not a bodybuilder but hit 365 pounds) on a podcast saying his size came from a long period at 3 grams test and 1.5 grams Deca, yes, that's 3000/1500. He may not be an expert on steroids, but he knows what he did to put on the size he has.

So, anyway, this is a long way of saying that there is no "cap" at 750 mg for all injectables but boldenone.

 

[malfeasance]

I need an opinion.

I’m on a bulk.

I’m curious whether I should increase the testosterone dosage to 750mg pw from 500mg.

Or alternatively,

To continue running 500mg pw of testosterone & also adding in 500mg pw of NPP.

Would love to hear some thoughts.

Thanks.

Slightly different suggestion here. Increase testosterone from 500mg to 600mg, then add 300mg of NPP weekly as well. Make sure to adjust calories upward significantly, too. You do track your calories, right?

 

[Rido]

So, anyway, this is a long way of saying that there is no "cap" at 750 mg for all injectables but boldenone.

I think people usually say notice "Diminishing returns" instead of cap

 

[EamonDeValera]

I meant diminishing returns, not that it caps at any given limit.

No point in taking 3 grams of Tren if it makes your heart explode. I was coming from that sort of angle.

Yes I track my calories to a certain extant. I’m eating around 4K-6k per day.

It’s always in that range.

 

[eery]

I meant diminishing returns, not that it caps at any given limit.

No point in taking 3 grams of Tren if it makes your heart explode. I was coming from that sort of angle.

Yes I track my calories to a certain extant. I’m eating around 4K-6k per day.

It’s always in that range.

yeah, thats just a 2000 calorie difference bro.. :|

 

[EamonDeValera]

Im a busy guy, I can’t keep track of all of it.

I eat to my hunger. No point force feeding, the body won’t even use the food you’re eating.