Chronic Low ferritin. Need advice from those who have fixed low ferritin.

[fiver]

December 2nd: Ferritin 33, CRP 4.5
January 13th: Ferritin 74.4, CRP 1.9

How I crashed it: Stupidly donating double reds at the red cross. It had been crashed back in October and probably before that, I had tried a few different iron sups with my daily routine (paying no attention to meal timing or anything else) and getting nowhere.

How I raised it: My stomach is never truly empty because I'm on low dose Reta and I take casein a few hours before bed, but I determined the time my stomach would be the most empty and the farthest away from any other elements (magnesium, etc) that would interfere with iron absorption is deadass in the middle of the night. It just so happens I'm an older guy and get up around 3am to piss whether I want to or not.

MWF I take extra digestive enzymes and betaine with my last meal I leave an 8 oz glass of water with 1 gram liquid liposomal vitamin C by the bathroom sink before bed to remind me in my stupor I'm supposed to take something. I take 2x 325 Ferrous Fumarate, 2x Betaine HCL, and 2x Ox Bile and wash it down with the vit c water.

The Betaine is to further increase acidity in the gut to help with absorption. The Ox Bile I bro scienced straight out of my ass, it has dubious benefits for iron absorption but I do it anyway.

No problems with upset stomach, I fall immediately back to sleep. Sometimes my poops are sub obtimal but nothing really disruptive.

 

[Tbaz192]

Good shit ^

 

[Tbaz192]

Starting to feel some old low ferritin symptoms.

Weak numb arms, brain fog, and random anxiety, worse sleep.

But I have been training really hard. Which is my absolute favorite. But uhhh if I can’t train hard and can only chase pumps. I’ll be pretty bummed. Means less gym time and less intensity. Since it’s depleting my iron. And I’m eating like a horse too. So it’s not food related

Labs on Wednesday to confirm.

Going to be adding

Heme Iron Polypeptide 11 mg​

See if my body likes it compared to iron biglycinate.

Trying to find that happy medium is proving to be a pain.

 

[Tbaz192]

Been looking into heme iron polypeptide, looks pretty promising. Seems most things that inhibit iron absorption ( coffee, calcium, fibers etc) don’t have an effect on HIP.

 

[Tbaz192]

This ferritin thread is something else.
Turning into a damn log of bs from me

I have labs later today. Finally got a decent nights sleep.
Been researching and reevaluating my training and trt.

I’m notorious for training really hard and pushing it. Like no one else can hang kinda training. Which unfortunately seems to also not be a great idea. Was hoping with the supplements and dose change id be able to keep it. Nope. Prob not. The iron demand from all the hard training is too great. So going forward regardless the ferritin test result. I’m lowering my training intensity & total volume. To roughly 15 sets a muscle group per week. See how that goes. Adjust accordingly.

Started taking iron biglycinate 25mg in the middle of the night with vitamin C 500mg.
HIP - might actually cause my HCT/HBG to rise. We’ll see if glycinate has an effect. I’m also part of the rare few who get heavy limbs and or weakness/numbness from taking iron. Which is also a fun side effect of low ferritin.
Shits stupid. So I’m taking every supplement to aid in transport, absorption, and just overall heath.

 

[Ateam2023]

This ferritin thread is something else.
Turning into a damn log of bs from me

I have labs later today. Finally got a decent nights sleep.
Been researching and reevaluating my training and trt.

I’m notorious for training really hard and pushing it. Like no one else can hang kinda training. Which unfortunately seems to also not be a great idea. Was hoping with the supplements and dose change id be able to keep it. Nope. Prob not. The iron demand from all the hard training is too great. So going forward regardless the ferritin test result. I’m lowering my training intensity & total volume. To roughly 15 sets a muscle group per week. See how that goes. Adjust accordingly.

Started taking iron biglycinate 25mg in the middle of the night with vitamin C 500mg.
HIP - might actually cause my HCT/HBG to rise. We’ll see if glycinate has an effect. I’m also part of the rare few who get heavy limbs and or weakness/numbness from taking iron. Which is also a fun side effect of low ferritin.
Shits stupid. So I’m taking every supplement to aid in transport, absorption, and just overall heath.

I hope you get it figured out you have been putting in some due diligence and I appreciate the information you provide

 

[KL8209]

I appreciate this log also. I haven't really been commenting but have been following along.

Please do keep us updated

 

[Tbaz192]

Update to come with results.

Hopefully a few days.

I’ll go over everything I’ve done / learned so far. And what changes I’ve made and any effects they’ve had.
Recap it.
Unfortunately haven’t been keeping dates. Wish I did. But if I have the energy I’ll go thru this thread & my labs. kinda ball park it.

 

[Tbaz192]

This is going to be long. But it’s a recap and a lot of information to help. Since this is harm reduction board. And hopefully in doing so it’ll answer questions.
Apologies if I butcher any science or miss anything. Regardless of my recent results. This is everything going forward.

EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT. THIS MAY NOT HELP YOU.

I’m part of the select lame few who can’t handle high doses, blood donation, intense prolonged work load. My body reacts to it all very quick. And lab markers rise and my ferritin goes bye bye. No matter my diet. You can’t out train genetics. Some people get the luxury of year round cycle and ferritin doesn’t even move. Must be nice.
And any normal ferritin protocol had zero effect on me.

For reference
I’m 28, 6’3, 220.
fairly lean. Nothing wild.
11 years in the gym.
———————
My issues.
They’ll come and go in waves for weeks and months at a time. I’d be feeling good, locked it. And few weeks back in the gym I’d be hit with fatigue and all the symptoms
Weakness, dizzy spells, flatness, shitty pumps, breathlessness, fatigue, brain fog, anxiety, lack of recovery, major anxiety, heart palps, heavy restless limbs.
————————
The source and what caused my ferritin issues?

It all stemmed from CONSTANT iron demand for creating RBC’s… -> which was all the high doses, constant TRT+, adding cycles & HGH. And training too hard for too long.

All things that demand to create red blood cells. Over and over for months or years on end. My body never had a true long term time off.

My ferritin stayed around 11-30 ( low )
Even with an iron supplement. You can feel symptoms at 50 & below.
I tried Multiple different forms and protocols. Not effective.
Why? Because the demand was still too great for RBC creation. My bone marrow was constantly active. Any iron, It would free float essentially in my system and be pushed to RBC/HBG/HCT elevation. Not to ferritin / iron storage. Doing the exact opposite of what I needed. Took a long time to figure this simple shit out. I saw many many doctors thinking it was something else. Because they brushed off my iron/ ferritin. Nope.
—————-
So my ferritin now? And how did I fix it?
It was only till I dropped everything and moved to low dose TRT & training 4/5 days a week. Moderate intensity, that after 4-5 weeks my ferritin finally climbed to 50+ (still low mid)

I’m talking 50-70mg Test cyp twice a week.

Twice a week. You need to LIMIT RBC demand/ creation. And limit your work load. Find the middle ground of what works.

LESS PEAKS = LESS CONSISTENT DEMAND/CREATION!

I tried low dose daily. It doesn’t work for me. You’re constantly stimulating RBC creation. It’s potentially possible to supplement enough to keep it level. But watch your CBC.
Cuz every Test dose you take is stimulating this process. You want to keep this as low as possible while you re build. I’m talking LOW enough doses for for Test levels of 500-600. You do not want anything any higher. Because higher test levels = more demand.

Ferritin takes weeks if not months to rebuild to a normal level.

———————————
NOW.

My current protocol. Which is the only thing to have an effect. And help.

Lower my doses and my training. Before you say hey why didnt you do this to begin with? I’m impatient, love to train hard, and love the hard grind. And I was too stubborn to do it, till now. I have to drop the ego and immature thinking of go hard or no results will come. Tough pill to swallow. Cuz i love the intensity. Big fan of Seth feorce. So that should tell ya something. So eat my shorts lol.

Work load is max 12-15 sets per muscle group PER WEEK. 8-12 rep. 2-3 RIR. No drop sets or major pump intensifiers. Just moving moderate weight nothing crazy.
———————-

And if I decide to cycle something it’ll be in 4-5 months AFTER I REBUILD & I have to be very slow & methodical about it. Cant go high doses. Cant “blast”.

Training has to stay the same and not increase heavily or fast.
———————-
Also being looked at for sleep apnea. Sleep apnea can also raise CBC levels., so I could be getting hit from multiple fronts on this ferritin issue.

 

[OldGHGuy]

This is going to be long. But it’s a recap and a lot of information to help. Since this is harm reduction board. And hopefully in doing so it’ll answer questions.
Apologies if I butcher any science or miss anything. Regardless of my recent results. This is everything going forward.

EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT. THIS MAY NOT HELP YOU.

I’m part of the select lame few who can’t handle high doses, blood donation, intense prolonged work load. My body reacts to it all very quick. And lab markers rise and my ferritin goes bye bye. No matter my diet. You can’t out train genetics. Some people get the luxury of year round cycle and ferritin doesn’t even move. Must be nice.
And any normal ferritin protocol had zero effect on me.

For reference
I’m 28, 6’3, 220.
fairly lean. Nothing wild.
11 years in the gym.
———————
My issues.
They’ll come and go in waves for weeks and months at a time. I’d be feeling good, locked it. And few weeks back in the gym I’d be hit with fatigue and all the symptoms
Weakness, dizzy spells, flatness, shitty pumps, breathlessness, fatigue, brain fog, anxiety, lack of recovery, major anxiety, heart palps, heavy restless limbs.
————————
The source and what caused my ferritin issues?

It all stemmed from CONSTANT iron demand for creating RBC’s… -> which was all the high doses, constant TRT+, adding cycles & HGH. And training too hard for too long.

All things that demand to create red blood cells. Over and over for months or years on end. My body never had a true long term time off.

My ferritin stayed around 11-30 ( low )
Even with an iron supplement. You can feel symptoms at 50 & below.
I tried Multiple different forms and protocols. Not effective.
Why? Because the demand was still too great for RBC creation. My bone marrow was constantly active. Any iron, It would free float essentially in my system and be pushed to RBC/HBG/HCT elevation. Not to ferritin / iron storage. Doing the exact opposite of what I needed. Took a long time to figure this simple shit out. I saw many many doctors thinking it was something else. Because they brushed off my iron/ ferritin. Nope.
—————-
So my ferritin now? And how did I fix it?
It was only till I dropped everything and moved to low dose TRT & training 4/5 days a week. Moderate intensity, that after 4-5 weeks my ferritin finally climbed to 50+ (still low mid)

I’m talking 50-70mg Test cyp twice a week.

Twice a week. You need to LIMIT RBC demand/ creation. And limit your work load. Find the middle ground of what works.

LESS PEAKS = LESS CONSISTENT DEMAND/CREATION!

I tried low dose daily. It doesn’t work for me. You’re constantly stimulating RBC creation. It’s potentially possible to supplement enough to keep it level. But watch your CBC.
Cuz every Test dose you take is stimulating this process. You want to keep this as low as possible while you re build. I’m talking LOW enough doses for for Test levels of 500-600. You do not want anything any higher. Because higher test levels = more demand.

Ferritin takes weeks if not months to rebuild to a normal level.

———————————
NOW.

My current protocol. Which is the only thing to have an effect. And help.

Lower my doses and my training. Before you say hey why didnt you do this to begin with? I’m impatient, love to train hard, and love the hard grind. And I was too stubborn to do it, till now. I have to drop the ego and immature thinking of go hard or no results will come. Tough pill to swallow. Cuz i love the intensity. Big fan of Seth feorce. So that should tell ya something. So eat my shorts lol.

Work load is max 12-15 sets per muscle group PER WEEK. 8-12 rep. 2-3 RIR. No drop sets or major pump intensifiers. Just moving moderate weight nothing crazy.
———————-

And if I decide to cycle something it’ll be in 4-5 months AFTER I REBUILD & I have to be very slow & methodical about it. Cant go high doses. Cant “blast”.

Training has to stay the same and not increase heavily or fast.
———————-
Also being looked at for sleep apnea. Sleep apnea can also raise CBC levels., so I could be getting hit from multiple fronts on this ferritin issue.

The way you fight for your health is impressive, young man...

 

[Tbaz192]

The way you fight for your health is impressive, young man...

Appreciate it! After all we only have one life.

 

[Tbaz192]

Alrighty gents,

So my newest experiment of daily TRT 20mg a day. In hopes a smoother peak and serum level would offset the demand didn’t work.
I felt amazing on daily. No anxiety, smoother mood and energy. Didn’t last.

Ferritin trended down. Pulled labs at 32 ferritin. With symptoms.


So next experiment.

Sub Q 10-15mg daily.
Should be lower peak EPO stimulation
& less iron demand per day. Should be similar total test levels. Closer to 500-600

 

[OldGHGuy]

Alrighty gents,

So my newest experiment of daily TRT 20mg a day. In hopes a smoother peak and serum level would offset the demand didn’t work.
I felt amazing on daily. No anxiety, smoother mood and energy. Didn’t last.

Ferritin trended down. Pulled labs at 32 ferritin. With symptoms.


So next experiment.

Sub Q 10-15mg daily.
Should be lower peak EPO stimulation
& less iron demand per day. Should be similar total test levels. Closer to 500-600

Following

 

[Photon]

Alrighty gents,

So my newest experiment of daily TRT 20mg a day. In hopes a smoother peak and serum level would offset the demand didn’t work.
I felt amazing on daily. No anxiety, smoother mood and energy. Didn’t last.

Ferritin trended down. Pulled labs at 32 ferritin. With symptoms.


So next experiment.

Sub Q 10-15mg daily.
Should be lower peak EPO stimulation
& less iron demand per day. Should be similar total test levels. Closer to 500-600

tbh i think 1-2 piggy shots will get you to where you want.
If the concern is piggy, human grade is available - KR/India Pharma.

however, if symptoms aren't bad, slow and steady isn't bad either.

Spoiler

I face the opposite issue from you.
You have working hgb/hct, iron sat, low ferritin.
I have low hgb/hct, iron sat, high ferritin.

To increase conversion from ferritin, i started oral EPO >2 weeks ago.
At 3x100mg/week, i should get a ~1.57 incr by week 6. It's not week 6 yet, but i don't see how it's going to happen if it keeps dropping.


These are my labs after a few rounds of piggy, ~3 months later.




I would have expected ferritin to have been converted to hb by week 6, but seems like it's not happening.
It's either not converting or not converting fast enough.

Also on 1g+ eq/week
Will make some changes to my cycle...i think i know why..but well let's see where this goes.

 

[Tbaz192]

tbh i think 1-2 piggy shots will get you to where you want.
If the concern is piggy, human grade is available - KR/India Pharma.

however, if symptoms aren't bad, slow and steady isn't bad either.

Mind messaging me about KR/India pharma source? I reached out to one on here. They had it on their list. But stopped carrying it.

Also wonder how long that would have my ferritin last for me and its effect on my HGB/HCT

 

[Tbaz192]

@Photon
Actually fuck it. I have gleptoforte. So I’ll just do that. Probably after this sub Q experiment, just so I know I have an option for normal TRT potentially.

Especially if I can control my ferritin with a 1to2ML glepto every 6-8 weeks ish.
Based on labs and what happens with my CBC & ferritin.
I’d love to up the doses again.

 

[Tbaz192]

Alright new plan.

Sub Q experiment. See if my ferritin will be stable.
Which will then allow me to pull fresh labs. Also checking copper & more.

Then. 2ML Gleptoforte piggy iron.
Pull labs 4-6 weeks after. CBC/Iron panel.

Adjust accordingly.

I’m also weirdly good at making pig noises. So it’s only right I use pig iron lol

 

[Photon]

@Photon
Actually fuck it. I have gleptoforte. So I’ll just do that. Probably after this sub Q experiment, just so I know I have an option for normal TRT potentially.

Especially if I can control my ferritin with a 1to2ML glepto every 6-8 weeks ish.
Based on labs and what happens with my CBC & ferritin.
I’d love to up the doses again.

You could see if Pct24x7 is willing to ship it, email for a quote or something with this pic.