36 yo, 24% BF, Cutting

[Rbvasques]

Question for my cutting:
About 8 months ago i started “trt” 150mg test week and that gave me energy to do gym, cardio, diet, etc.

I went from 41% bf to 29% while gaining ~12lb of muscle in the same 8 months.

5.7height
36yo
Current weight 202 lb

About a 8 weeks ago i started a “semi-cut” transitioning to a real cut, ~400 calorie deficit and added HGH 2iu 2xday and Tirzepatide 3mg every 5 days and increase my testo dose to 300mg/week, I have removed around ~150 calories per week after that, now sitting around 1k calorie deficit.

Lost ~19lbs in these 8weeks and around 6% bf (24% now) i plan to continue cutting for 6 more weeks, where i plan to add clen in the last 4 weeks, im starting to fear that im losing a lot of muscle.

Now to the question:
I have seen people using EQ, Primo and others during cutting, what is your guys experience and recommendations as far as steroids to avoid muscle loss?

 

[Cereal masturbator]

Great numbers so far man !

Honestly don’t worry so much about the muscle loss, you’ll lose a little, it’s part of being in a deficit, but you’ll gain it back and look much better at a lower BF, unless you’re in prep for a show, you have time to just re gain it with less BF when you’re leaner, you’ll look a little flatter and you’ll stress and feel you’ve lost way more than you actually have.

However I will answer your question in all honesty to what I belive to be true, personally I can eat next to nothing and still maintain a seriously decent amount of muscle if I’m on enough tren, a lot of people on here will tell you not to touch it etc, but you’re an adult making your own decisions and that’s the answer haha

 

[Dunkirk]

Take it from me, you're doing too much too fast. I was exactly where you were, except I wasn't on trt, Reta only and consuming 1500-1600 calories a day.

To explain, I'm 37 weighed 200 when I started my cut on Sema and cycling cjc/ipa. Towards the end I switched to Reta only and went from 200 30% bf to 151 13% bf in a total of 8 months. I crashed my lipids I was so malnourished. I added trt very recently and kept Reta only, then increased my calories to 1800 then 2100 and now at 2400 going with a lean bulk. **ON TRT ONLY** with 125/mg (caps for emphasis) and more calories I've gained 8 pounds and LOST fat. I'm really cut now, so vascular about 11% bf.

I know exactly what you're doing, you're sick of looking fat, yes 30% bf is fat I was there. And you want results yesterday. **DON'T**. It took you years to get this big, let it at least take a 1-2 years to get in shape. Stop doing so much.

You don't know me, you don't have to take my word for it, but I'm extremely confident I know exactly where you stand. I'm not telling you not to blast (even though you could cut down), I'm only saying eat right.

 

[BabaJagga]

as former fat slob who cut 25kg naturaly in less than year, dont worry about muscle loss. even if you lose some, you will gain it back very fast when you up your kcals again.

ive found more wffective / better for mental health to rather do more activity (bike for me) than going so low with kcals... you can have same deficit but its still more food for you than 1000kcal...

good luck

 

[Rbvasques]

im new here, literally my first post, i was imagining getting full on hated, this is great.

 

[BabaJagga]

im new here, literally my first post, i was imagining getting full on hated, this is great.

why would you? no shame when you are/were fat and wanna lose weight. i bet plenty of people started in your shoes. welcome.

 

[Dunkirk]

im new here, literally my first post, i was imagining getting full on hated, this is great.

You're not overdoing it to a certain degree. You are at the right age to add these things. Just make sure you eat with all these things you're adding. I know I keep repeating it, because it's very important.

I realized you didn't mention bloodwork, I'm the type of person that like to see how things effect our bodies. Obviously not required, but strongly recommend especially going to 300mg test.

 

[Rbvasques]

Bloodwork wise
Test was 400ish when i started, now is 1.2k
Cholesterol went up, but still within range, almost passing now though.
Triglycerides 5.0 no change
Estrogen from initial 15 now 35.

That was from the 8 months of 150 test week.
Just started the 300 test week, triz and hgh, next bloodwork is scheduled for may, not having any new side effects other than feeling more energetic so far.

 

[Joeblack]

Take the slow route. No more than 500 deficit. Learn to change your eating habits and make this the norm.

 

[Joeblack]

as former fat slob who cut 25kg naturaly in less than year, dont worry about muscle loss. even if you lose some, you will gain it back very fast when you up your kcals again.

I don't agree with this. Lowering your muscle mass will also drop your metabolic rate.

You're on test. Do everything you can to hold onto the muscle you have while cutting. Make sure to get enough protein 0.7 to 1.2g per lbs. You might even be able to put on more muscle depending on how experience weight lifter you are.

 

[Grey Spartan]

Everyone here has given you great advice. I will add, make sure your training is on point this will prevent muscle loss. Now on to your question.

Now to the question:
I have seen people using EQ, Primo and others during cutting, what is your guys experience and recommendations as far as steroids to avoid muscle loss?

@Cereal masturbator hit the nail on the head. Tren is the only drug known to add muscle while in a calorie deficit. He already covered the "Tren is the Devils nectar" disclaimer so I won't add to it. But I will add, (anavar) Oxandrolone (taken 2 hours before training) combined with HGH taken at night, with fasted cardio upon waking in my experience accelerates fat loss.

 

[AlexDavis43]

Question for my cutting:
About 8 months ago i started “trt” 150mg test week and that gave me energy to do gym, cardio, diet, etc.

I went from 41% bf to 29% while gaining ~12lb of muscle in the same 8 months.

5.7height
36yo
Current weight 202 lb

About a 8 weeks ago i started a “semi-cut” transitioning to a real cut, ~400 calorie deficit and added HGH 2iu 2xday and Tirzepatide 3mg every 5 days and increase my testo dose to 300mg/week, I have removed around ~150 calories per week after that, now sitting around 1k calorie deficit.

Lost ~19lbs in these 8weeks and around 6% bf (24% now) i plan to continue cutting for 6 more weeks, where i plan to add clen in the last 4 weeks, im starting to fear that im losing a lot of muscle.

Now to the question:
I have seen people using EQ, Primo and others during cutting, what is your guys experience and recommendations as far as steroids to avoid muscle loss?

In addition to the good advice above, there was a study. Two groups on the same hypocaloric diet: one was sleep restricted; the other had adequate sleep. The group with poor sleep lost more muscle and less fat than the group with adequate sleep (ref).

Testosterone will definitely help, but we like to stack the deck in our favor.

Tl;dr: be mindful of sleep hygiene

 

[Joeblack]

Everyone here has given you great advice. I will add, make sure your training is on point this will prevent muscle loss. Now on to your question.

@Cereal masturbator hit the nail on the head. Tren is the only drug known to add muscle while in a calorie deficit. He already covered the "Tren is the Devils nectar" disclaimer so I won't add to it. But I will add, (anavar) Oxandrolone (taken 2 hours before training) combined with HGH taken at night, with fasted cardio upon waking in my experience accelerates fat loss.

Fasted cardio makes no difference for fat loss than cardio an other time. If you like it, that's good. Do it.

Body composition changes associated with fasted versus non-fasted aerobic exercise - PubMed

It has been hypothesized that performing aerobic exercise after an overnight fast accelerates the loss of body fat. The purpose of this study was to investigate changes in fat mass and fat-free mass following four weeks of volume-equated fasted versus fed aerobic exercise in young women adhering...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Grey Spartan]

Fasted cardio makes no difference for fat loss than cardio an other time. If you like it, that's good. Do it.

Body composition changes associated with fasted versus non-fasted aerobic exercise - PubMed

It has been hypothesized that performing aerobic exercise after an overnight fast accelerates the loss of body fat. The purpose of this study was to investigate changes in fat mass and fat-free mass following four weeks of volume-equated fasted versus fed aerobic exercise in young women adhering...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I'm not doubting you or the study, but for me it made a difference compared to not fasted. However, every single study is not done with participants on HGH and Anavar or any other PED for that matter. This is the problem us PED users face.

 

[kain]

Question for my cutting:
About 8 months ago i started “trt” 150mg test week and that gave me energy to do gym, cardio, diet, etc.

I went from 41% bf to 29% while gaining ~12lb of muscle in the same 8 months.

5.7height
36yo
Current weight 202 lb

About a 8 weeks ago i started a “semi-cut” transitioning to a real cut, ~400 calorie deficit and added HGH 2iu 2xday and Tirzepatide 3mg every 5 days and increase my testo dose to 300mg/week, I have removed around ~150 calories per week after that, now sitting around 1k calorie deficit.

Lost ~19lbs in these 8weeks and around 6% bf (24% now) i plan to continue cutting for 6 more weeks, where i plan to add clen in the last 4 weeks, im starting to fear that im losing a lot of muscle.

Now to the question:
I have seen people using EQ, Primo and others during cutting, what is your guys experience and recommendations as far as steroids to avoid muscle loss?

What does your meal plan look like, and what are your macros? How adherent are you to it? What is your cardio structure? How often do you train?

You are asking about drugs but should focus on the basics first.

 

[Rbvasques]

What does your meal plan look like, and what are your macros? How adherent are you to it? What is your cardio structure? How often do you train?

You are asking about drugs but should focus on the basics first.

I have been well disciplined in the last year, and extremely disciplined in the last few months.

Hitting around 180g protein a day and 2000 calories, those are the only to items I’m tracking, fat is low and carbs are very low.

Have not missed a meal in the last 10 weeks.

I do 50 to 70min of cardio fasted in the morning daily, and 5 before workout and 5 after at night.

I train every day, 3 workout days then 1 active cardio.

Tomorrow i will share a updated weight/bf.

 

[kain]

180 grams of protein is equal to ~720 calories and probably on the low side. The remaining calories are either fat or carbs and you said both are “low”. That can’t be true. You need to track ALL macros and have targets for each. I’m assuming you’re using a food tracking app, those can be deceptive.

As something to compare: I’m currently “cutting” on 200mg test only, 237 lb, 12% bf, 45 min of cardio daily (hr 120-135), HIIT 3x per week (45sec on, 90 off).
Training day macros: 270 protein, 425 carbs, 16 fat (measuring added fat, nuts or olive oil)
Non-training days: 180 protein, 150 carbs, 24 fat
Leg day: 280 protein, 585 carbs, zero added fat

Only eating lean protein: chicken, 99% ground turkey, white fish, 94/6 beef once per day maximum, if that.

You should also add a rest day, recovery is just as important as training.

Honestly, I would highly recommend you hire a coach to help you. I worked with @Type-IIx last year and he got me from 34% bf to 10%. You can see before and after here :
Post in thread 'Type-IIx's Coaching: Results from ovmmds, kain'
Type-IIx's Coaching: Results from ovmmds, kain
.

 

[Rbvasques]

I have signed up for @Type-IIx services yesterday morning, i definitely agree that i need more help.

 

[kain]

I have signed up for @Type-IIx services yesterday morning, i definitely agree that i need more help.

You will be in good hands! Looking forward to seeing your progress.

 

[Dunkirk]

Training day macros: 270 protein, 425 carbs, 16 fat (measuring added fat, nuts or olive oil)
Non-training days: 180 protein, 150 carbs, 24 fat
Leg day: 280 protein, 585 carbs, zero added fat

Here is my issue with these percentages. Side note, I have no problem being proven wrong, they obviously work for bodybuilders. My goal is health longevity, rather than looking massive and/or cut... A good balance I guess.

Based on what I researched, the brain needs 20% of calories for optimal health. That information isn't hard to find. At 16g of fat in 3000 calories, you're only at 1/4 of the 66g needed. Now even if you were to base the 20% off your maintenance calories and we'll assume 2000 calories, then you'd need 44g of fat. Your off days you're barely at half (24g).

My question is that really sustainable? It seems extremely low and I see that low fat everywhere in bodybuilders. Something isn't right.