MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
HMG for post cycle therapy?
- Thread starter Ronin_
- Start date
ThePatriot
New Member
Not I said the Patriot
Cronk
New Member
Ronin, I posted up about this a couple weeks ago. I got no responses. I have a boat-load of this stuff bc my wife has fertility probs. It contains FSH and LH. By rights, this would work for PCT. However, the HMG I have only contains 15iu of each LH and FSH per amp. This stuff is very expensive and the cheapest we could find it was from a pharmacy in Paris. I would need about 50 amps a day if I used this stuff. Maybe higher concentrations exist. If so, and if it's cheap enough....it would work well.
Cronk
Cronk
Bro I looked up the doses on HMG a little and found this - it seems 75IU HMG is comparable to 2000 IU HCG
"Two-year comparison of testicular responses to pulsatile gonadotropin- releasing hormone and exogenous gonadotropins from the inception of therapy in men with isolated hypogonadotropic hypogonadism
L Liu, SM Banks, KM Barnes and RJ Sherins
Developmental Endocrinology Branch, National Institute of Child Health and Human Development, Bethesda, Maryland 20892.
Men with the complete form of isolated hypogonadotropic hypogonadism (initial mean testes volume less than 4 mL) require 2 or more yr of exogenous gonadotropin therapy combining hCG and human menopausal gonadotropin (hMG) to achieve maximal, but subnormal, testis size and sperm output. To test whether pulsatile GnRH therapy, which more closely mimics normal hormonal stimulation, would accelerate or further augment testicular growth, hasten the onset of sperm production, and/or increase sperm output more than occurs during conventional exogenous gonadotropin therapy, we administered either hCG/hMG or GnRH from the inception of therapy to 2 comparable groups of men with complete IHH (initial testicular volume, less than 4 mL) and compared their testicular responses during the first 2 hr of therapy. Five men were treated with pulsatile GnRH in doses of 143-714 ng/kg every 2 h, sc, while 11 other men received hCG (2000 IU) and hMG (75 IU FSH and 75 IU LH) im 3 times/week. In the GnRH-treated men, the mean plasma total and free testosterone levels during therapy rose to within the normal range, but were significantly lower (P less than 0.01 and P less than 0.02, respectively) than those in the hCG/hMG-treated men. The mean plasma estradiol concentrations during therapy were within the high normal range and were similar in the two groups. The mean plasma FSH levels achieved in the GnRH-treated men were significantly (P less than 0.01) and 1.3- to 3.2-fold higher than those in the hCG/hMG-treated men. The mean testicular size achieved in the GnRH-treated men was not significantly different from that in the hCG/hMG-treated men (P = 0.08); the mean testicular volumes after 2 yr were 4.8- and 4.3-fold the pretreatment values in the GnRH and hCG/hMG groups, respectively. After 12 months of therapy, sperm production had occurred in one man in the GnRH group and in no subject in the hCG/hMG group. After 24 months, two men in the GnRH group and eight men in the hCG/hMG group produced sperm. Thus, 40% of the GnRH-treated men and 80% of the hCG/hMG-treated men (P = NS) produced sperm after 2 yr of therapy. The sperm concentrations in all men were below 5 million/mL and were comparable in the two groups (P = NS). These results suggest that pulsatile sc GnRH therapy for the first 2 yr does not accelerate or enhance testicular growth, hasten the onset of sperm production, or increase sperm output significantly compared to hCG/hMG. "
so 30IU of HMG with 500IU of HCG would seem about the right daily dose from this.
"Two-year comparison of testicular responses to pulsatile gonadotropin- releasing hormone and exogenous gonadotropins from the inception of therapy in men with isolated hypogonadotropic hypogonadism
L Liu, SM Banks, KM Barnes and RJ Sherins
Developmental Endocrinology Branch, National Institute of Child Health and Human Development, Bethesda, Maryland 20892.
Men with the complete form of isolated hypogonadotropic hypogonadism (initial mean testes volume less than 4 mL) require 2 or more yr of exogenous gonadotropin therapy combining hCG and human menopausal gonadotropin (hMG) to achieve maximal, but subnormal, testis size and sperm output. To test whether pulsatile GnRH therapy, which more closely mimics normal hormonal stimulation, would accelerate or further augment testicular growth, hasten the onset of sperm production, and/or increase sperm output more than occurs during conventional exogenous gonadotropin therapy, we administered either hCG/hMG or GnRH from the inception of therapy to 2 comparable groups of men with complete IHH (initial testicular volume, less than 4 mL) and compared their testicular responses during the first 2 hr of therapy. Five men were treated with pulsatile GnRH in doses of 143-714 ng/kg every 2 h, sc, while 11 other men received hCG (2000 IU) and hMG (75 IU FSH and 75 IU LH) im 3 times/week. In the GnRH-treated men, the mean plasma total and free testosterone levels during therapy rose to within the normal range, but were significantly lower (P less than 0.01 and P less than 0.02, respectively) than those in the hCG/hMG-treated men. The mean plasma estradiol concentrations during therapy were within the high normal range and were similar in the two groups. The mean plasma FSH levels achieved in the GnRH-treated men were significantly (P less than 0.01) and 1.3- to 3.2-fold higher than those in the hCG/hMG-treated men. The mean testicular size achieved in the GnRH-treated men was not significantly different from that in the hCG/hMG-treated men (P = 0.08); the mean testicular volumes after 2 yr were 4.8- and 4.3-fold the pretreatment values in the GnRH and hCG/hMG groups, respectively. After 12 months of therapy, sperm production had occurred in one man in the GnRH group and in no subject in the hCG/hMG group. After 24 months, two men in the GnRH group and eight men in the hCG/hMG group produced sperm. Thus, 40% of the GnRH-treated men and 80% of the hCG/hMG-treated men (P = NS) produced sperm after 2 yr of therapy. The sperm concentrations in all men were below 5 million/mL and were comparable in the two groups (P = NS). These results suggest that pulsatile sc GnRH therapy for the first 2 yr does not accelerate or enhance testicular growth, hasten the onset of sperm production, or increase sperm output significantly compared to hCG/hMG. "
so 30IU of HMG with 500IU of HCG would seem about the right daily dose from this.
Cronk
New Member
Thanks for posting that research Ronin. I guess that I don't see where 75iu HMG is comparable to 500iu HCG. In this study, it correlates that 75iu HMG COMBINED WITH 2000iu HCG 3 times a week were comparable to the GnRH 143-714ng/kh Q 2 hours group. It seems like you want to use the HCG 500iu and HMG 75iu daily for 10 days for PCT? I don't see the advantage of using the expensive HMG that contains the extra LH. However, if you would like to try this for post cycle recovery, I know where you can get some fairly cheap. Please let us know if you find any more information on the addition of LH to PCT. 
Cronk
Cronk
Last edited:
argent
New Member
I read a study in an endrcrinological journal about a guy who ran deca for a while and went to the doc to get his hpta working again. the docs put him on HMG and HCG.
VDC
New Member
You guys ought to check out the HRT section,,,Hrters and BBers have many commonalities,,,We all use AAS,,,Swale believes HMG would be useless in maintaining the boys(At least the FSH part),,,therefore useless for PCT,,,If its so expensive why even think about it,,,If you need a source plenty carry it,,,Thats what the Classifieds are for,,,VDC
Power Rabbit
New Member
i dont know...hcg at high dosaes can hurt lydig cells...it why i like 500iu ed...if this stuff is hella stronger id be alittle worried about runnin it..but hell it sounds cool...id just be too afraid to gueni pig it
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