Hypogonadism, adrenal impairment???

[Dopamineloveaffair]

Hi guys, I was hoping I could get some input here. I'm not hoping for a diagnosis but more of a direction to follow with treatment to help with a number of health complaints.

I'm 29 y/o, male, 6'3, 225 lbs, 8% bf. Squat, deadlift, and bench are all approx. 315lbs. My squat and deadlift are probably a little higher but I haven't maxed out on them lately due to my back pain being more problematic lately.

My main ailments are as follows:

Depression
Moodiness(my ex once refered to me as Dr. Jeckel and Mr. Hyde)
Fatigue
Brain fog/poor cognition and memory
Hypoglycemia
Seasonal allergies
Back pain
Poor stress and exercise tolerance (can only tolerate moderate exercise twice a week or so)

Some other things that may paint a better picture:

Horizontally ridged fingernails
Acne(mostly white heads)
Hearing loss(mild to moderate in the upper frequency range)
Tinnitus(ringing ears)
Greying hair(started at age 20)... I know this isn't that uncommon.
Polyuria(urinate very frequently)
Polydipsia(very thirsty almost all the time, drink up to 2 gallons a day of water)
Social anxiety
Muscle spasms(psoas, piriformis, and soleus, almost always in constant spasm that are very resistant to stretching)
Hoarseness in voice(tendency to lose voice easy with raspiness)
Heart palpitations
Gyno as a teenager, but not anymore.

I've had fasting glucose done a number of times which checked out "normal". I had a 2 hour glucose tolerance test that checked out "normal" as well, although I felt like shit throughout the whole thing. My blood pressure is consistantly around 130/80. Pulse around 70b/m. I've been on countless antidepressants over the years that have been of no help what so ever, sometimes making me worse. My lab results check out normal after a physical. My neutrophils were low on one occasion.

I can only manage to workout once or twice a week due to the extreme fatigue that follows. My workouts consist of 10 min. interval cardio, 35 min. weights, and 15 min. stretching. I try and stay well away from failure with my weights due to my inability to tolerate it. I play volleyball once a week competitively for 2 hours which leaves me in a state of exhaustion for a couple days as well as bad back pain. Compared to the almost sedentary people I play with, they can tolerate it no problem. On the outside I look like I'm in "great shape", but have unbearable fatigue and depression the majority of the time.

My nutrition is composed of a macro breakdown of 300g protein, 200g carbohydrates, and 150-200g fat per day. I've been "blessed" with a good metabolism. I've never really been over 10% bf although I've always been an avid exerciser and closely watched what I ate. The high fat and protein greatly helps with managing my hypoglycemia.

I'm thinking at this point I have some sort of dysfunction with either my adrenals or gonads at this point. My TSH has checked out "normal" although I don't have the exact figures in front of me. Don't have T3 or T4 values to go on. If anything I'd think my thyroid is a little on the overactive side considering my metabolism. I could be wrong though. My mother is diagnosed with hypothyroid as well as my grandmother.

I am overly reliant on caffeine to get myself through the day. I know it's not good for my adrenal health, but the alternative isn't much better at this point. I didn't start using caffeine till I was 23, but had many of the same problems back then as well including fatigue. This has been a 12 year process which seemed to have begun with the initiation of Accutane when I was 17.

I'm very intolerant of many vitamins and minerals. Supplements which seem to make my problems worse are: Zinc, selenium, manganese, chromium, vanadium, molybdenum, iodine, boron, potassium, B-complex vitamins except for B-5, vitamin E, vitamin A, ascorbic acid, choline, tyrosine, fish oil, licorice root, and bioflavonoids. Supplements which seem to help: Calcium, magnesium, copper, iron, B5, low dose calcium ascorbate, vitamin D, acetyl L-Carnitine, TMG, and SAMe. Although I've gotten minimal relief it's not a whole lot with my current regimand.

The licorice root seemed to make me feel much more depressed. I tried a number of different trials and everytime I took it I had the same reaction. I had read that it's supposed to increase adrenal gland function by increasing cortisol. Perhaps what I have is too much cortisol. I suppose a test should be in order.

I got total testosterone and prolactin levels checked before which turned out "normal" although we all know what that can mean sometime. I went to my GP recently to order some blood tests to rule out hypogonadism. All he would test for is free testosterone, TSH, prolactin, FSH, and LH. I tried to get him to test for sensitive E2 would he couldn't understand why it would be important.

I was wondering if it's possible to have hypogonadism while being reasonably muscular and lean. Are they mutually exclusive to some degree?

I tried to give as much background as possible here. I know it isn't much to go on without certain assays and blood tests. Any direction would be greatly appreciated.

 

[pmgamer18]

You have a lot on your plate here. And it would help us a lot if you can get copys of your blood work and post them normal or not. Post them with the units and ranges. Also go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for Success and the HCG Update all the tests you need are in this and why. Print out the testing from this and tell your Dr. you want all of these tests. If he will not do them ask him if he will work with Dr. John over the phone to test and treat you. He is one of the best.

Do not workout if you feel this bad it is holding you back from recovering form what ever is wrong. You need stop doing things that take you hrs. to recover let alone days. Do you think you could have over trained and are burned out this happens a lot guys set to many goals that burn them out.

Read some of the posts by Dr. Marianco on over doing it and causing problems. Read the Sticky's above and the Adrenal Thread. I hope his helps you.

 

[Dopamineloveaffair]

You have a lot on your plate here. And it would help us a lot if you can get copys of your blood work and post them normal or not. Post them with the units and ranges. Also go to www.allthingsmale.com and read TRT: A Recipe for Success and the HCG Update all the tests you need are in this and why. Print out the testing from this and tell your Dr. you want all of these tests. If he will not do them ask him if he will work with Dr. John over the phone to test and treat you. He is one of the best.

Do not workout if you feel this bad it is holding you back from recovering form what ever is wrong. You need stop doing things that take you hrs. to recover let alone days. Do you think you could have over trained and are burned out this happens a lot guys set to many goals that burn them out.

Read some of the posts by Dr. Marianco on over doing it and causing problems. Read the Sticky's above and the Adrenal Thread. I hope his helps you.

Thanks Phil I appreciate your help.

I've read the sticky adrenal thread and Dr. John's site and the articles you described previously. I agree it's a good idea to print off and show it to my doctor. It would probably do a better job of explaining the reasoning behind the tests better than I can.

Regarding overtraining... I've been working out twice a week, sometimes three, sometimes once for the last few years so I haven't "overdone it" for awhile. I routinely take a week or so off from time to time as well. Considering my recovery ability I still may be overtraining at this point though. It's something to think about. I couldn't imagine doing no training at all but perhaps it would be best to tone things down even more until I get a proper diagnosis.

I'll read Dr. Marianco's posts regarding overdoing it, perhaps I can glean some more knowledge that might be useful for my situation.

It would be ideal for my doctor to work alongside Dr. John over the phone. I live in Canada and am not sure of the logistics of it all regarding insurance and so forth. I would love to be able to find a doctor that's somewhat local that could do the proper testing although that may not be very likely. I live nearby Toronto, Ontario. I have limited funds.

I have considered at this point trying a short trial of blackmarket testosterone enthanate and Arimidex. I'm not sure if I'm going to through with it yet. I've already procured the Arimidex but my aquaintance has had a tough time getting the test. Of all things you'd think it would be the other way around. I know it's not ideal, but I'm at wits end with coping with this thing. It can be very exhausting dealing with a problem like this for years. Hope of getting better and finding a new treatment is the only thing keeping me going. I'm sure a lot here can relate. I decided to go that route after hearing from my GP that he's not very fond at all about prescribing trt, and I can't wait another few months risking other dead ends at this point.

 

[LiquidGib]

you need to know your levels before going on anything
Try to get and post up blood test results for adrenals (cortisol and dhea), testosterone (Total T, Free T), and thyroid (TSH,Free T3, Free T4).
Also, have you had a sleep study done on you? Alot of those symptoms could be due to a sleep problem like sleep apnea which you may never know that you have until you do a sleep study.

 

[pmgamer18]

you need to know your levels before going on anything
Try to get and post up blood test results for adrenals (cortisol and dhea), testosterone (Total T, Free T), and thyroid (TSH,Free T3, Free T4).
Also, have you had a sleep study done on you? Alot of those symptoms could be due to a sleep problem like sleep apnea which you may never know that you have until you do a sleep study.

It is like LiquidGib said you need testing and a lot of it first. Don't fool with T and E2 meds with out a dam good Dr. There are Dr.'s in your country that test and Treat low T. Try a teaching Hosp.

 

[marianco]

Thanks Phil I appreciate your help.

I've read the sticky adrenal thread and Dr. John's site and the articles you described previously. I agree it's a good idea to print off and show it to my doctor. It would probably do a better job of explaining the reasoning behind the tests better than I can.

Regarding overtraining... I've been working out twice a week, sometimes three, sometimes once for the last few years so I haven't "overdone it" for awhile. I routinely take a week or so off from time to time as well. Considering my recovery ability I still may be overtraining at this point though. It's something to think about. I couldn't imagine doing no training at all but perhaps it would be best to tone things down even more until I get a proper diagnosis.

I'll read Dr. Marianco's posts regarding overdoing it, perhaps I can glean some more knowledge that might be useful for my situation.

It would be ideal for my doctor to work alongside Dr. John over the phone. I live in Canada and am not sure of the logistics of it all regarding insurance and so forth. I would love to be able to find a doctor that's somewhat local that could do the proper testing although that may not be very likely. I live nearby Toronto, Ontario. I have limited funds.

I have considered at this point trying a short trial of blackmarket testosterone enthanate and Arimidex. I'm not sure if I'm going to through with it yet. I've already procured the Arimidex but my aquaintance has had a tough time getting the test. Of all things you'd think it would be the other way around. I know it's not ideal, but I'm at wits end with coping with this thing. It can be very exhausting dealing with a problem like this for years. Hope of getting better and finding a new treatment is the only thing keeping me going. I'm sure a lot here can relate. I decided to go that route after hearing from my GP that he's not very fond at all about prescribing trt, and I can't wait another few months risking other dead ends at this point.

If a person cannot recover from their training, they are over training. Recovery of the neuroendocrine and immune system is much more important than muscle recovery because it takes longer to recover.

One technique some bodybuilders take is to take off for 3-6 weeks to allow recovery. This has allowed many to obtain larger gains in their workouts.

Once adrenal fatigue sets in, the treatments allow the adrenals to rest and recover. But it still takes time to do so. If one is stressing oneself during this time, the recovery will take a longer time. Stimulants such as coffee force the adrenal to work harder, but in the end make adrenal fatigue worse.

Interestingly, there has not been a mention of sexual function. Lower libido or erectile dysfunction is a clue to hypogonadism or other neuroendocrine problems.

Before any treatment, it is important to know what direction to go. Thus lab testing becomes useful since it provides a person with a guidepost.

One patient, for example, with low bodyfat was being treated with a high potency testosterone PLO cream. Despite a good enough dose, he still had no libido. Thinking the problem was excessive aromatization of testosterone to estrogen, he tried Arimidex. There was no improvement. When lab tests were done what we found was that his total and free testosterone and DHT levels were so high, aromatization was actually impaired and he developed lower estrogen levels than before treatment. Thus the Arimidex was the wrong answer. Rather a switch to an alcohol-based testosterone gel or depo-testosterone injections or HCG injections were the solutions - since they result in more aromatization than with the cream. Testing was necessary to avoid a lot of trial and mostly error attempts.

Regarding labs, it is not enough to know something is in the "normal range". A normal TSH, for example, can completely be totally wrong - the person can actually be hypothyroid. Patterns among groups of lab tests even if they are normal are important to help determine what is occurring. Thus, the actual lab value and the range is important. To be picky about it, the lab and its testing procedure would be important to know. Some labs use more sensitive testing methods than others.

 

[pmgamer18]

If a person cannot recover from their training, they are over training. Recovery of the neuroendocrine and immune system is much more important than muscle recovery because it takes longer to recover.

One technique some bodybuilders take is to take off for 3-6 weeks to allow recovery. This has allowed many to obtain larger gains in their workouts.

Once adrenal fatigue sets in, the treatments allow the adrenals to rest and recover. But it still takes time to do so. If one is stressing oneself during this time, the recovery will take a longer time. Stimulants such as coffee force the adrenal to work harder, but in the end make adrenal fatigue worse.

Interestingly, there has not been a mention of sexual function. Lower libido or erectile dysfunction is a clue to hypogonadism or other neuroendocrine problems.

Before any treatment, it is important to know what direction to go. Thus lab testing becomes useful since it provides a person with a guidepost.

One patient, for example, with low bodyfat was being treated with a high potency testosterone PLO cream. Despite a good enough dose, he still had no libido. Thinking the problem was excessive aromatization of testosterone to estrogen, he tried Arimidex. There was no improvement. When lab tests were done what we found was that his total and free testosterone and DHT levels were so high, aromatization was actually impaired and he developed lower estrogen levels than before treatment. Thus the Arimidex was the wrong answer. Rather a switch to an alcohol-based testosterone gel or depo-testosterone injections or HCG injections were the solutions - since they result in more aromatization than with the cream. Testing was necessary to avoid a lot of trial and mostly error attempts.

Regarding labs, it is not enough to know something is in the "normal range". A normal TSH, for example, can completely be totally wrong - the person can actually be hypothyroid. Patterns among groups of lab tests even if they are normal are important to help determine what is occurring. Thus, the actual lab value and the range is important. To be picky about it, the lab and its testing procedure would be important to know. Some labs use more sensitive testing methods than others.

Marianco if you did a Book like The Testosterone Syndrome I feel it would be a number 1 seller. Hell you have a dam good start on a book on low T at this site. I have read them all and most are so over my head I have no idea what they said. But your the best.

 

[1cc]

This has been a 12 year process which seemed to have begun with the initiation of Accutane when I was 17.

Accutane reduces 5-alpha-reductase, which reduces DHT. Your symptoms are very similar to people who have used propecia, which also reduces DHT. The propecia in many cases has caused permanent hormonal changes which were not reversed after discontinuing propecia. This link has some info.

http://forum.lef.org/pr.aspx?f=41&m=16852

Gyno as a teenager, but not anymore.

This can happen because of low DHT, which will make you extra sensitive to Estrogen. The low DHT can also elevate Estrogen.

The licorice root seemed to make me feel much more depressed. I tried a number of different trials and everytime I took it I had the same reaction. I had read that it's supposed to increase adrenal gland function by increasing cortisol. Perhaps what I have is too much cortisol. I suppose a test should be in order.

Licorice is good for women with Adrenal problems, but not for men. Licorice reduces testosterone and acts as an Estrogen. Women with menopausal symptoms can take Licorice and get relief. Here is some more info:
http://www.youngagain.com/licorice.html


12 years is a long time to be suffering for. What you need to do is get a complete set of labs per Swale's TRT recipe document sticky. For Adrenals, get Saliva labs done per the Adrenal sticky. This way you and your doctor will have a complete picture, without the need for speculation. It's a pity you are not close to Marianco, because he would be able to handle your problem from all the angles, hormonal, psychological, and adrenals which is generally overlooked.
Do not start taking meds before getting baseline labs and consulting with a good doctor, because you will just end up in worse shape than you are now. I know it is very frustrating, but if you deal with this methodically, I am pretty certain you will resolve your problem very soon.

 

[Dopamineloveaffair]

Thank you Dr. Marianco for responding to my post. I've read many of your posts and love your ability to see things from many different angles. It's too bad you're not local.

Sexual function waxes and wanes depending on the time of year. For some reason I tend to feel best during the months of march/april, and sept/october. Mood, energy, recovery, libido, and stress tolerance, are at their best where as acne is at it's worst interestingly enough. When may and november hits everything goes south. It feels almost like some bipolar syndrome variation going from normal/subnormal to depression throughout the year but my psychiatrist tends to think otherwise. Lithium and anticonvulsants didn't seem to help any. It's hard to get an accurate reading of my sexual function as well the last few years since being on many different antidepressants that compromise that area. My last relationship suffered though from lack of sexual interest on my part.

I agree lab tests will help with figuring out what's going on. My psychiatrist is pretty open minded so hopefully there won't be any problems getting the proper lab work done. I have an appt May 30.

If a person cannot recover from their training, they are over training. Recovery of the neuroendocrine and immune system is much more important than muscle recovery because it takes longer to recover.

One technique some bodybuilders take is to take off for 3-6 weeks to allow recovery. This has allowed many to obtain larger gains in their workouts.

Once adrenal fatigue sets in, the treatments allow the adrenals to rest and recover. But it still takes time to do so. If one is stressing oneself during this time, the recovery will take a longer time. Stimulants such as coffee force the adrenal to work harder, but in the end make adrenal fatigue worse.

Interestingly, there has not been a mention of sexual function. Lower libido or erectile dysfunction is a clue to hypogonadism or other neuroendocrine problems.

Before any treatment, it is important to know what direction to go. Thus lab testing becomes useful since it provides a person with a guidepost.

One patient, for example, with low bodyfat was being treated with a high potency testosterone PLO cream. Despite a good enough dose, he still had no libido. Thinking the problem was excessive aromatization of testosterone to estrogen, he tried Arimidex. There was no improvement. When lab tests were done what we found was that his total and free testosterone and DHT levels were so high, aromatization was actually impaired and he developed lower estrogen levels than before treatment. Thus the Arimidex was the wrong answer. Rather a switch to an alcohol-based testosterone gel or depo-testosterone injections or HCG injections were the solutions - since they result in more aromatization than with the cream. Testing was necessary to avoid a lot of trial and mostly error attempts.

Regarding labs, it is not enough to know something is in the "normal range". A normal TSH, for example, can completely be totally wrong - the person can actually be hypothyroid. Patterns among groups of lab tests even if they are normal are important to help determine what is occurring. Thus, the actual lab value and the range is important. To be picky about it, the lab and its testing procedure would be important to know. Some labs use more sensitive testing methods than others.

 

[Dopamineloveaffair]

Interesting info 1cc, thanks.

The Accutane DHT reduction mechanism is interesting. Perhaps that's the main mechanism in which Accutane exerts it's anti-acne effects. I'd be interested in doing more research on that.

Charles Poliquin has used licorice to improve testosterone dynamics. Here's a quote taken from an article off T-Nation.

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=05-021-feature

"TC: I know youve been using licorice cream to elevate Testosterone levels. Most of the sports science guys say that licorice is bad news, a strong estrogen agonist, so how did you come up with the idea of using it to elevate T levels?

CP: Most of the studies on licorice being an estrogen agonist were done on women. What was shown was that the licorice cream aggravated PMS symptoms in women already showing estrogen dominance.

TC: Well thats a hell of a good model for athletes!

CP: Yes! Its like saying boron increases Testosterone, yes, in women going through menopause who are also magnesium deficient. So, heres the rationale: the reason some people are Testosterone deficient has to do with acetyl coenzyme A, which changes into pregnenolone, and pregnenolone is the mother of hormones. Pregnenolone has two choices in life: it can become cortisol or DHEA.

When a guy has a shitty diet, a poor lifestyle, useless training programs, he forms a preferential pathway so his pregnenolone turns into cortisol and what happens is that theres less raw material to turn into DHEA. If you dont have enough DHEA, youre basically castrating yourself.

The function of licorice root is to do two things; one is to prolong the half-life or cortisol. Now there are actually 7 mathematical permutations of what can happen to the Testosterone/cortisol ratio, depending on time of day, so what you have to do is give licorice cream when the guys cortisol is low.

By the way, only one patient out every 250 comes up well in circadian Testosterone/cortisol tests.

Now, if an athletes been under stress for too long a time, you actually get to the point where he does not make cortisol or DHEA, and thats when you start running on adrenaline. The worst scores most always come from people living in the Northeast part of the USA. A symptom of that is you start waking up in the middle of the night because cortisol, if you remember, is low-grade adrenaline.

So, if a guy tests with low Testosterone and low cortisol in the morning and also low DHEA, we give him licorice extract. It prolongs the half-life of the cortisol and it fools the body into thinking, "Okay, now when I next have the opportunity to make cortisol or DHEA, Im going to go the way of DHEA because my cortisol is elevated. Then, of course, DHEA is preferentially converted to Testosterone.

Licorice root also has the advantage of lowering LDL and triglycerides; including helping convert T4 to T3. You can also put it on the abs and your fat levels will go down.

But you cant give it to everybody every time; you can only use it to increase T in guys who have low cortisol and low DHEA.

By the way, another way to fool the body is to give it a stable form of Vitamin B5 in very large quantities, and since the B5 is the precursor to acetyl Coenzyme A, it leads to more pregnenolone, which ultimately leads to higher Testosterone."

 

[Dopamineloveaffair]

I have to come clean here... I know you guys won't be a fan of this, but my "source" ended up coming through two days ago. I injected 400mg testosterone enanthate thurs. and have been taking 0.25mg Arimidex ED since. Was this ideal? No. I know my baselines will be screwed up for awhile now. The day before on wednesday I did get my free test., prolactin, LH, FSH, and TSH tested though, although not ideal I know. I would have liked my GP to have tested for cortisol, E2, T3, T4, DHEA, and DHT, but he refused.

Already I feel much much better at this point. Energy, confidence, motivation, mood, brain fog and stamina I have seen a big difference in. Placebo effect after two days? Not sure. I wanted to use a big enough bolus of test to make sure I felt the physiological effects. I know it was a crap shoot though. Whether my problems stemmed from variations in cortisol, estrogen, DHT, prolactin, etc... the testosterone wouldn't have helped in all instances and could have confused the issue further delaying progress.

Taking 0.25mg Arimidex daily could be driving my estradiol levels too low as well I'm aware. Telling my doctor that testosterone therapy is already working for me strangely enough may help her prescribe it to me. That is my psychiatrist that is, not my GP. She's prescribed a number of psychiatric drugs that she's never presribed before to me including Selegiline, Parnate, and Lamictal.

I do very much respect the intelligence of the contributors to this board, and especially Dr. Marianco. I know this may have sounded idiotic to many but desperate times call for desperate measure sometimes however cliche. This is a very hard time of the year for me depression wise and the thought of spending a couple months getting proper treatment felt unbearable. Not to provide a copout but it's better than resorting to other illicit drugs or self-destructive behaviours. It's sometimes hard to make intelligent well thought-out decisions when one is experiencing brain fog, cognitive dysfunction, and a warped sense of the world.

I will continue to look for qualified support and have a doctor monitor my labs. I'll fill in with some more info later...

p.s. 400mg per week is not what I have mind. It was just a test dose. Something more conservative as 100mg, with HCG, and Arimidex if needed, is what I had more in mind, although my lab tests will better dictate that later.

 

[1cc]

The Accutane DHT reduction mechanism is interesting. Perhaps that's the main mechanism in which Accutane exerts it's anti-acne effects. I'd be interested in doing more research on that.

This looks like the root of your problem.

Charles Poliquin has used licorice to improve testosterone dynamics. Here's a quote taken from an article off T-Nation.

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=05-021-feature

Most of this article is incorrect.

Pregnenolone has two choices in life: it can become cortisol or DHEA.

Or progesterone.

If you dont have enough DHEA, youre basically castrating yourself.

Normal levels of DHEA do not have any significant impact on testosterone.

Now, if an athletes been under stress for too long a time, you actually get to the point where he does not make cortisol or DHEA, and thats when you start running on adrenaline.

Adrenal Fatigue.

So, if a guy tests with low Testosterone and low cortisol in the morning and also low DHEA, we give him licorice extract.

Better he takes some time off to rest.

Then, of course, DHEA is preferentially converted to Testosterone.

Incorrect.

But you cant give it to everybody every time; you can only use it to increase T in guys who have low cortisol and low DHEA.

Better to give them hydrocortisone and DHEA.

By the way, another way to fool the body is to give it a stable form of Vitamin B5 in very large quantities, and since the B5 is the precursor to acetyl Coenzyme A, it leads to more pregnenolone, which ultimately leads to higher Testosterone."

B5 stimulates the adrenals to produce cortisol. I don't believe it impacts pregnenolone. Pregnenolone does not ultimately lead to higher testosterone.

The only people who may not feel the T lowering effect of Licorice are those whose T levels are very high. Those whose T levels are already low, will feel it immediately, which was the case with myself when I used Licorice. Licorice works very well for assisting the Adrenals with cortisol and aldosterone. It's unfortunate that it affects T negativley as well.

 

[1cc]

I injected 400mg testosterone enanthate thurs. and have been taking 0.25mg Arimidex ED since. Already I feel much much better at this point. Energy, confidence, motivation, mood, brain fog and stamina I have seen a big difference in.

Considering your history with Accutane, a transdermal would have been more suitable for you because it has a much higher DHT conversion.

Already I feel much much better at this point. Energy, confidence, motivation, mood, brain fog and stamina I have seen a big difference in.

This may fade as your Estrogen catches up, and you may experience the "roller coaster" effect between shots, if you shoot longer than weekly.

 

[Dopamineloveaffair]

Considering your history with Accutane, a transdermal would have been more suitable for you because it has a much higher DHT conversion.



This may fade as your Estrogen catches up, and you may experience the "roller coaster" effect between shots, if you shoot longer than weekly.

I still have to keep my acne under control at this point so that may rule out either that Accutane has lowered my DHT permantly or that reducing DHT is one of Accutane's main effects. Perhaps my acne is not DHT precipitated is another option. I think it would be better to get my lab values first to see where my actual DHT levels lie to help aid proper treatment. It may help with a suitable starting point though regarding first choice of delivery. As we know it's a lot art as much science figuring proper treatment sometimes. My acne is pretty much in check as long as I take my 6mg copper, 10g B5, and nizoral every day. I get the odd little blemish from time to time but it's manageable.

I was intending on injecting twice a week. It may be overkill considering enanthate's halflife, but I've noticed some people following this protocol to limit estrogen conversion and reduce "roller coaster" effects. I'll also drop to 0.25mg Arimidex EOD rather than ED which would probably be more prudent. I don't need want to lower estradiol too low. I've noticed I've dropped a few pounds already as of two days ago, probably lost water weight. It's not very natural for me to weigh 220 lbs. I haven't been this low in quite awhile so there is a good chance it was from the Arimidex. I seem to look a little leaner as well due to this effect.

Overall I'm really enjoying the effects as of the last two days. I had the energy to go to the gym today which I normally wouldn't have. My lifts were all pretty heavy as well surprizingly, with incredible pumps I haven't felt in years! I felt jacked today at the gym! lol It all seems too early to experience these effects. I wasn't expecting anything until at least a week. I guess I'll know in a few weeks what the real results will be. Hopefully after more bloodwork and a more specialized treatment plan I can ensure these effects last. I would like to ultimately be taking HCG in low dosages the day before my shot, and to take enough Arimidex to keep my estradiol in the right range. I'm getting way ahead of myself here though. It's only day 2 and I'm looking this far in the future. lol I should take it in stride and plan out a proper future treatment plan.

 

[1cc]

I was intending on injecting twice a week. It may be overkill considering enanthate's halflife, but I've noticed some people following this protocol to limit estrogen conversion and reduce "roller coaster" effects.

If you decide to stay with shots, then this would be a good idea. I was doing shots every 3 days when I was on Cypionate.

Overall I'm really enjoying the effects as of the last two days. I had the energy to go to the gym today which I normally wouldn't have. My lifts were all pretty heavy as well surprizingly, with incredible pumps I haven't felt in years! I felt jacked today at the gym! lol It all seems too early to experience these effects.

That's because your T is over the top because your dosage was 400mg.