Lean Bloat-Free Muscle- What To Use??

[Texas Ranger]

Guys, what would you recommend to an experienced bodybuilder(7-10+ years of training) on a First Cycle seeking LEAN, quality bloat-free muscle while keeping things SIMPLE?? I know Primo & Anavar would be ideal here, but they costs too DAMN much. Then, having to go through the hassle of wondering if they're real or not. Let me throw some options out there and get your OWN opinion, as well. 1.) Test Enanthate@300-600mgs/wk 2.) Test Enanthate@300-400mgs/wk & EQ@300mgs/wk 3.) Test Enanthate@300-400mgs/wk & Winstrol@50mgs ED Most if not all cycles will be ran for 12-16 weeks and Arimidex will be used at .5mgs EOD-ED. Opinions please...

 

[Phreezer]

Test prop 100mg EOD... Tren 125mg EOD .... Maybe some eq at 400mg a week....

Take care,

Phreezer

 

[Mark Kerr]

I agree with Phreezer.

I once ran a 12 week cycle of:

100mg Test Prop ED (Weeks 1-10)
100mg Tren ED (Weeks 1-12)
100mg Winstrol Oral ED (Weeks 8-12)
.5mg of Arimidex ED (but in hindsight, .5mg EOD would have been just as effective)

That was an amazing cycle, and by far the best one I have ever used.

A cheaper but still effective version:

Test Prop 150mg EOD (Works out to about 535mg of Test/wk)
Tren 50mg ED or 100mg EOD (Works out to about 350mg of Tren/wk)
50mg Winstrol Inj EOD or 50mg Oral ED
.5mg Arimidex EOD (you might even try .25 EOD to save money, and only up the dosage if needed).

Make sure to cut the test out for at least the last 3 weeks of the cycle and run Tren and Winstrol together w/o the Test Prop. You will be so lean and tight that you wont do anything else for LBM (Lean Body Mass) ever again.

Now for something less androgenic (If you want to avoid side effects of Tren):

400-500mg of Test Enanthate or Cypionate per week
500-600 mg of Equipose per week
.5 mg of Arimidex EOD (or .25mg EOD if you want to save money and only up the dosage if needed).

Make sure to run this for 12 weeks. You wont be as tight as if you used the cycle above, but it is much cheaper, easier on the body (less injections) and will still add good amounts of muscle without excess fat or bloat.

I hope that helped...

 

[Texas Ranger]

Mark, with this being my First Cycle I wanted to try to keep the doses low. I'm 30 years old, 6'3" 220-225lbs and 8% bodyfat. My goal is 230-235lbs and 7% bodyfat. What if I ran the Test Prop & Tren Acetate each at 100mgs M, W & F every week for 10 weeks. Then, finished with Winny@25mgs ED weeks 9-12. Does this sound ok?? Or go with longer esters like Test Enanthate@300mgs for 16 weeks & EQ@400mgs for 15 weeks?? What are Tren's sides besides a bad temper??

 

[Strenght-Gains]

Mark, with this being my First Cycle I wanted to try to keep the doses low. I'm 30 years old, 6'3" 220-225lbs and 8% bodyfat. My goal is 230-235lbs and 7% bodyfat. What if I ran the Test Prop & Tren Acetate each at 100mgs M, W & F every week for 10 weeks. Then, finished with Winny@25mgs ED weeks 9-12. Does this sound ok?? Or go with longer esters like Test Enanthate@300mgs for 16 weeks & EQ@400mgs for 15 weeks?? What are Tren's sides besides a bad temper??

since when did any type of test become good for a cycle clearly designed not to hold water? Prop,Cyp and Enan will make you hold a shit load of water.

 

[test-one]

since when did any type of test become good for a cycle clearly designed not to hold water? Prop,Cyp and Enan will make you hold a shit load of water.

thats where the arimidex comes in

 

[Texas Ranger]

Up for more opinions, please....

 

[chris gordon]

the bloat is from water retention...arimidex and nolvadex will handle that...so use whatever drugs you can get...prop tren and winny would be good though

 

[MaxRep]

I get the impression cost is an issue. IMO, when that's the case, the best low cost, lean mass gainer is a Test/Eq combo, with nolvadex or arimidex holding down the water. The other nice thing about this is assuming you're using Test enan or Test cyp. or sustanon, you are only doing 2 shots/week, which is usually better for first timers.

Your goals are very modest. Basically you want to add 10 pounds of muscle. If you can't do that on 400mg/week Test and 400mg/week Eq, then something's wrong... because realistically, at your height, you should be able to add another 10 pounds naturally, just by upping your protein and calories. But I know that's not what you want to hear, so a light cycle plus upping your protein and calories and you should be at your goal in 8 weeks max. Use the remaining 4 weeks to get your body used to the weight and with proper pct you should keep all of it.

Good luck,
MaxRep

 

[Carlito]

I like Deca for lean mass but being your first cycle you may want to reconsider.

Deca 400mg/week week 1 thru 10
Test Enan 250mg/week 1 thru 10 ( you may want to up the dose to 500mg, 250mg works for me fine with no deca dick sides)
Winstrol 50mg ED last 4 weeks of cycle.

PCT Should start 1 week after last inject ( some do 2, again 1 week works for me )
3 weeks of clomid administration
1st week 200mg/ED
2nd week 150mg/ED
3rd Week 100mg/ED
4th week ( optional 100mg/ED )

Supplements: Antioxidants, Multi-vitamins and minerals, B6, Flax Oil and Calcium 1 gram a day.

I tried this cycle before and obtained good results as far as lean mass and strength gains with minimal bloat, no gyno, no high blood pressure, acne only during PCT ,and no loss of libido maybe because I user higher than normal doses of Clomid.

Carlito

 

[Texas Ranger]

I get the impression cost is an issue. IMO, when that's the case, the best low cost, lean mass gainer is a Test/Eq combo, with nolvadex or arimidex holding down the water. The other nice thing about this is assuming you're using Test enan or Test cyp. or sustanon, you are only doing 2 shots/week, which is usually better for first timers.

Your goals are very modest. Basically you want to add 10 pounds of muscle. If you can't do that on 400mg/week Test and 400mg/week Eq, then something's wrong... because realistically, at your height, you should be able to add another 10 pounds naturally, just by upping your protein and calories. But I know that's not what you want to hear, so a light cycle plus upping your protein and calories and you should be at your goal in 8 weeks max. Use the remaining 4 weeks to get your body used to the weight and with proper pct you should keep all of it.

Good luck,
MaxRep

Thanks for your input, Max! I just finished dieting 3-4 weeks ago. I came down from 265lbs and 21-22% bodyfat. Let myself go doing the dad & hubby thing. LOL! Yeah, my goals are pretty modest compared to most guys on their First Cycle. Most want to gain 25-30lbs with water, but I'd rather have a hard, lean 10-12lbs anytime. Ok, how does this sound?

Test Enanthate@300mgs for 14 weeks
EQ@400mgs for 13 weeks
Nolvadex@20mgs ED or Arimidex@.5mgs EOD throughout

I "might" finish off with Winstrol@50mgs ED weeks 10-16 I'm going for the lean, hard, grainy look. Hopefully, I can reach 235lbs and 7-8% bodyfat, but that might be stretching it.

 

[MaxRep]

Ok, how does this sound?

Test Enanthate@300mgs for 14 weeks
EQ@400mgs for 13 weeks
Nolvadex@20mgs ED or Arimidex@.5mgs EOD throughout

I "might" finish off with Winstrol@50mgs ED weeks 10-16 I'm going for the lean, hard, grainy look. Hopefully, I can reach 235lbs and 7-8% bodyfat, but that might be stretching it.

I think at 300mg your Test is kind of low considering you naturally produce about 200mg/week. So 300mg isn't a lot more than replacement. At first you'll still be producing natural Test but less and less as time goes on. After roughly 8 weeks, it's no longer x amount of natural Test + 300mg/week... it's now just the 300mg/week which is why I usually figure 400mg/week is the minimum amount to use, especially for a bigger guy like yourself.

Other than that, what you just wrote out looks good, plus pct.

Good luck,
MaxRep

 

[Starkraven]

I think at 300mg your Test is kind of low considering you naturally produce about 200mg/week. So 300mg isn't a lot more than replacement. At first you'll still be producing natural Test but less and less as time goes on. After roughly 8 weeks, it's no longer x amount of natural Test + 300mg/week... it's now just the 300mg/week which is why I usually figure 400mg/week is the minimum amount to use, especially for a bigger guy like yourself.

Other than that, what you just wrote out looks good, plus pct.

Good luck,
MaxRep

MaxRep, the body produces about 10mg test per day. the TRT usually does 200mg EOW or 100mg once per week which is a bit over 70mg per week.

 

[MaxRep]

MaxRep, the body produces about 10mg test per day. the TRT usually does 200mg EOW or 100mg once per week which is a bit over 70mg per week.

You're right. I don't know why I was thinking 200 for some reason. Thanks for pointing that out.

MaxRep

 

[Starkraven]

You're right. I don't know why I was thinking 200 for some reason. Thanks for pointing that out.

MaxRep

no problem. i also think 400mg test per week should be the minimum even though i know 250mg per week will give results. the user will just be disappointed, however.