Lean Bulking on AAS/fat gain and nutrient partitioning

[Almoister]

I disagree on that. If you wanna get big you have to eat and gain weight and that's not debatable. Progress in the gym means only a fraction of progress regarding bodybuilding.

I've hit 270kg deadlift, 240kg squat and 180kg bench as a natty and since i got on gear i'm nowhere near that strong because i don't chase strength anymore. My physique has changed drastically though.. To be clear, from the moment i started gear and up to this day yes i'm a litle stronger, but this wasn't my goal. It just happened inevitably.

If you are obsessed with strength and progression while bodybuilding you'll end up tearing muscles and destroying your joints. I'm 37yo and doing this for 21 years, i have already a good number of injuries and i'm not planning to increase them. Not everyone has to train like jordan peters to progress. IMO strength progression is mandatory only in the first years being on the game, then when you reach a good level of strength i guess it's time to incorporate a different and smarter approach.



A 1000kcal surplas that was increased steadily, so that amount was my peak for the last weeks and not from the start obviously. My protein and fats remained the same and i just added carbs. Started with 400gr and ended up at 720. This is like 1300kcal more but i was backing off at non training days and my weekly net surplas including my one cheat meal was something like 7000kcal.

Then my guy i don't have to say anything else, if you did what you're saying and with extra calories you accrued enough fat just find another way to progress and if that's going with small surplas then by all means, obviously it's the best thing for you. This is unfortunate but we all have to find what works individually.

Insane bench natty Lol

 

[Eddie.]

Insane bench natty Lol

It was good, i was heavy though and bench was my fave since 16. I could bench 100kg at 16 and squat 120kg. I wish i could go back in time though and skip MANY of those lifts so i don't have to be in pain in my shoulders now while doing simple tasks like pulling up the blanket in my bed.

 

[Almoister]

It was good, i was heavy though and bench was my fave since 16. I could bench 100kg at 16 and squat 120kg. I wish i could go back in time though and skip MANY of those lifts so i don't have to be in pain in my shoulders now while doing simple tasks like pulling up the blanket in my bed.

My best were 140bench, 165 squat 3x Lol

 

[krvuxn]

I truly fail to grasp this whole “one pound per week” notion.
As bodybuilders, during off-season, our focus ought to be on performance, at least to some extent.
The scale should not be our compass; rather, our progress should be measured by the weights we lift and the repetitions we achieve. And when that progress plateaus, the solution is simple: increase carbohydrate intake.

Advancement in this sport is inherently gradual, just as the process of building muscle itself is. That is what my former coaches instilled in me. Perhaps there is a middle ground to be found, and I am genuinely curious to hear others’ perspectives.

The issue with this approach is that I can increase my calories by a quite a lot, get heavy really quickly and absolutely smash the weights I was using previously. In order to progress over time, I need to make sure I’m not getting fat, because otherwise progress will stall very quickly.

For me, progress in the gym is a given, so I need to push body weight up as the metric I use instead. Even on a cut I’m progressing in the gym. At a slower pace, but I’m still progressing.

 

[Jaxino]

The issue with this approach is that I can increase my calories by a quite a lot, get heavy really quickly and absolutely smash the weights I was using previously. In order to progress over time, I need to make sure I’m not getting fat, because otherwise progress will stall very quickly.

For me, progress in the gym is a given, so I need to push body weight up as the metric I use instead. Even on a cut I’m progressing in the gym. At a slower pace, but I’m still progressing.

Often, with as little as an additional 50 g of carbohydrates per day, one can sustain progress for another two to three weeks.
I fully agree: bodyweight must also be taken into account, otherwise there is the risk of escalating too quickly and accumulating primarily fat while fostering insulin resistance.

Initially, I was skeptical; however, since I began tracking my logs, I have consistently observed weekly increases of 0.5–0.6 kg while still maintaining progression in the gym.

When I transition into a dieting phase, I typically progress for a few weeks, then stall, and eventually begin losing repetitions. This is, however, expected: as calories drop and bodyweight declines, strength loss occurs in most movements. A heavier muscle is, by nature, also a stronger muscle—even if accompanied by some fat.

Thus, overall progress—particularly bodyweight—does not follow a linear trajectory, but rather resembles a sawtooth pattern.

 

[eery]

I disagree on that. If you wanna get big you have to eat and gain weight and that's not debatable. Progress in the gym means only a fraction of progress regarding bodybuilding.

I've hit 270kg deadlift, 240kg squat and 180kg bench as a natty and since i got on gear i'm nowhere near that strong because i don't chase strength anymore. My physique has changed drastically though.. To be clear, from the moment i started gear and up to this day yes i'm a litle stronger, but this wasn't my goal. It just happened inevitably.

If you are obsessed with strength and progression while bodybuilding you'll end up tearing muscles and destroying your joints. I'm 37yo and doing this for 21 years, i have already a good number of injuries and i'm not planning to increase them. Not everyone has to train like jordan peters to progress. IMO strength progression is mandatory only in the first years being on the game, then when you reach a good level of strength i guess it's time to incorporate a different and smarter approach.

i agree with both of you to a certain degree but i think during a productive offseason your weight should be trending up across time and you should have a focus in the gym on progression, but it should be within reason. If you are aiming to build muscle, its more important that you load the muscle with the efficient tension/stimulus you need to progress, and that doesnt require adding 1 rep or 1kg every single session. People also lose the focus on their technique and end up egolifting and not loading and growing the muscles they intend to use. TLDR: find a balance where you are slowly adding some weight to your frame while focusing on strict intent, focus, tension, form and technique progressively to grow what you want to grow during the phase, not focus blindly on numbers and lift and eat without intent and focus.

Theres also other factors that could impact the progress in the gym, that really isnt relevant to gaining more muscle like change in leverages that could be exacerbated by excessive weight gain. Theres also the neural adaptions from training and possibly certian drugs, so strength isnt a linear predictor of muscle gain, but it can be a good indicator that you are heading in the right direction towards gaining the most muscle you can and that you are recovering and giving your body sufficient stimulus to cause some adaptions in the right direction.