Low SHBG

[I6JQdr06]

I’ve just started a cutting cycle: 25ish weeks of Nebido (250mg/week), a few weeks of Anavar at the beginning to get things going, and 10 weeks of Masteron (400mg/week) at the end. So it’s basically generous TRT with a mini-blast at the end.

I’ve received my pre-cycle blood work results and my SHBG is on the low end of normal (19.7 nmol/L).

Should I be concerned about adding in the Masteron? Will it lower it further? What about the Anavar? Is there anything I can do to raise SHBG other than run Test only?

 

[PeterBond]

Anabolic steroids decrease SHBG, including testosterone. Why do you want to increase it?

 

[I6JQdr06]

Because decreasing it further will take it out of the reference range

 

[I6JQdr06]

Ok. Slightly different question: are there any anabolic PEDs (steroids, sarms, other novel compounds), which don’t suppress SHBG? Or suppress it less than others?

I understand Masteron is a particularly effective SHBG suppressor?

 

[PeterBond]

Because decreasing it further will take it out of the reference range

If you inject testosterone, testosterone will be out of the reference range too. What's the problem with it?

 

[I6JQdr06]

By that logic I might as well have all my bio markers out of reference range and then what’s the point in doing blood analysis in the first place?

 

[PeterBond]

By that logic I might as well have all my bio markers out of reference range and then what’s the point in doing blood analysis in the first place?

It depends on the type of marker and what's it indicating. For example, creatine kinase (CK) is a marker of muscle damage. It's increased very often in people who undertake resistance exercise and this is a completely harmless finding. Would you also want to decrease CK to be within the reference range?

SHBG is a carrier protein for sex hormones, such as dihydrotestosterone, testosterone and estradiol in the bloodstream. It also has the highest affinity for these androgens compared to estradiol, and thereby it's speculated that it perhaps modulates androgenic to estrogenic action. At least it appears to do so meaningfully in women, where high SHBG concentrations 'protect' the tissues from circulating androgens. In men its role is less clear. The most important aspect of it is that there's no indication that an AAS-induced decrease in SHBG is harmful, besides increasing the free fraction of androgens. And the latter is pretty much a goal of administering supraphysiological concentrations.

 

[Lifting88]

As far as i know very low shbg isn't good, your body isn't able to carrier your sex hormones to the right places into the body and your body goes faster true your testosteron and that gives fluctuations in bloodlevens.

I have low shbg and it effect my libido and i have more acne theb ever before so think thats also because the low shbg


Every day small injections will help to raise al little, and serms and hcg
...you dont want low estrogen or to many ai's

 

[PeterBond]

As far as i know very low shbg isn't good, your body isn't able to carrier your sex hormones to the right places into the body and your body goes faster true your testosteron and that gives fluctuations in bloodlevens.

I have low shbg and it effect my libido and i have more acne theb ever before so think thats also because the low shbg


Every day small injections will help to raise al little, and serms and hcg
...you dont want low estrogen or to many ai's

One molecule of SHBG measured in the blood can carry a maximum of 2 steroids. So if your SHBG comes back at 15 nmol/L, it can carry a maximum of 30 nmol/L of androgens with full occupation (this already isn't really the case in practice). How relevant do you think this is when administering testosterone or any other androgen in high dosages? Notably, quite some androgens hardly have any affinity for SHBG to begin with, such as stanozolol and nandrolone (having approx. 1/100th the affinity for SHBG as does DHT).

Carrying it to tissues is no problem at all; albumin binds the remainder and some animals (such as rats) don't even have SHBG and rely solely on albumin for this too. See this picture from my book:


There is no proof that an AAS-induced decrease in SHBG is harmful per se, and there is even less proof that any intervention artificially increasing it would ameloriate any hypothetical harm.

Even a low dosage of 200 mg testosterone enanthate already almost halves SHBG levels. It's inevitable.

Effect of testosterone enanthate on serum lipoproteins in man - PubMed

Sixty-three normal Caucasian men were administered intramuscular testosterone enanthate (TE) 200 mg i.m. weekly for 12 months as part of a male contraceptive trial. This dose of TE caused a 2.5-fold increase in trough serum testosterone concentrations. High density lipoprotein cholesterol...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The decrease in SHBG is likely just to amplify the exogenously administered androgen's effect in target tissues.

If you want to increase SHBG, despite the lack of any evidence to want this, oral estrogens are very potent at it.

 

[GuerillaPete]

One molecule of SHBG measured in the blood can carry a maximum of 2 steroids. So if your SHBG comes back at 15 nmol/L, it can carry a maximum of 30 nmol/L of androgens with full occupation (this already isn't really the case in practice). How relevant do you think this is when administering testosterone or any other androgen in high dosages? Notably, quite some androgens hardly have any affinity for SHBG to begin with, such as stanozolol and nandrolone (having approx. 1/100th the affinity for SHBG as does DHT).

Carrying it to tissues is no problem at all; albumin binds the remainder and some animals (such as rats) don't even have SHBG and rely solely on albumin for this too. See this picture from my book:
View attachment 157367

There is no proof that an AAS-induced decrease in SHBG is harmful per se, and there is even less proof that any intervention artificially increasing it would ameloriate any hypothetical harm.

Even a low dosage of 200 mg testosterone enanthate already almost halves SHBG levels. It's inevitable.

Effect of testosterone enanthate on serum lipoproteins in man - PubMed

Sixty-three normal Caucasian men were administered intramuscular testosterone enanthate (TE) 200 mg i.m. weekly for 12 months as part of a male contraceptive trial. This dose of TE caused a 2.5-fold increase in trough serum testosterone concentrations. High density lipoprotein cholesterol...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The decrease in SHBG is likely just to amplify the exogenously administered androgen's effect in target tissues.

If you want to increase SHBG, despite the lack of any evidence to want this, oral estrogens are very potent at it.

Could Hcg raise Shbg ?
I remember hearing about this long time ago but cant recall where it was .

 

[Lifting88]

Yes but i think its more because of the estrogen from hcg

 

[Piromanu87]

One molecule of SHBG measured in the blood can carry a maximum of 2 steroids. So if your SHBG comes back at 15 nmol/L, it can carry a maximum of 30 nmol/L of androgens with full occupation (this already isn't really the case in practice). How relevant do you think this is when administering testosterone or any other androgen in high dosages? Notably, quite some androgens hardly have any affinity for SHBG to begin with, such as stanozolol and nandrolone (having approx. 1/100th the affinity for SHBG as does DHT).

Carrying it to tissues is no problem at all; albumin binds the remainder and some animals (such as rats) don't even have SHBG and rely solely on albumin for this too. See this picture from my book:
View attachment 157367

There is no proof that an AAS-induced decrease in SHBG is harmful per se, and there is even less proof that any intervention artificially increasing it would ameloriate any hypothetical harm.

Even a low dosage of 200 mg testosterone enanthate already almost halves SHBG levels. It's inevitable.

Effect of testosterone enanthate on serum lipoproteins in man - PubMed

Sixty-three normal Caucasian men were administered intramuscular testosterone enanthate (TE) 200 mg i.m. weekly for 12 months as part of a male contraceptive trial. This dose of TE caused a 2.5-fold increase in trough serum testosterone concentrations. High density lipoprotein cholesterol...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The decrease in SHBG is likely just to amplify the exogenously administered androgen's effect in target tissues.

If you want to increase SHBG, despite the lack of any evidence to want this, oral estrogens are very potent at it.

Could you give an example of androgens that could increase SHBG? Its the first time i hear this.

 

[cmK9s33]

Could you give an example of androgens that could increase SHBG? Its the first time i hear this.

I must really need coffee but where is he saying there any exogenous androgens increase SHBG? I see where he wrote estrogen would. Regardless, his main point is that trying to boost SHBG is most likely fruitless.

 

[PeterBond]

Could you give an example of androgens that could increase SHBG? Its the first time i hear this.

I know of none and I don't know or expect any androgen to do so.

Could Hcg raise Shbg ?
I remember hearing about this long time ago but cant recall where it was .

Never really looked into that, unsure if there's direct data on that. Perhaps marginally under certain conditions via increased aromatization to estrogen.

 

[Piromanu87]

Sorry, i must be dreaming.. I saw oral androgens but you wrote oral estrogens... Sorry again

 

[PeterBond]

Sorry, i must be dreaming.. I saw oral androgens but you wrote oral estrogens... Sorry again

It's all right, I tend to have this effect on women with whom I converse too.

 

[Type-IIx]

@PeterBond I asked a guy what was the nature of his suffering with low SHBG and he said: "Estrogen sides even on lower doses is the big one. Less frequent injections make you feel worse since the test will metabolize faster. Due to faster metabolism, standard TRT doses don't feel good. Getting estrogen sides when introducing compounds that are supposed to dry you out since they'll tank SHBG. I found gradually increasing doses helps a lot."

What do you think? Is he just conflating a low SHBG with his own metabolic peculiarities of androgens?

 

[PeterBond]

@PeterBond I asked a guy what was the nature of his suffering with low SHBG and he said: "Estrogen sides even on lower doses is the big one. Less frequent injections make you feel worse since the test will metabolize faster. Due to faster metabolism, standard TRT doses don't feel good. Getting estrogen sides when introducing compounds that are supposed to dry you out since they'll tank SHBG. I found gradually increasing doses helps a lot."

What do you think? Is he just conflating a low SHBG with his own metabolic peculiarities of androgens?

If anything, low SHBG amplifies androgenic action relative to estrogenic action, as androgens have a higher binding affinity for the carrier protein. I don't understand his train of thought.

 

[Lifting88]

@PeterBond I asked a guy what was the nature of his suffering with low SHBG and he said: "Estrogen sides even on lower doses is the big one. Less frequent injections make you feel worse since the test will metabolize faster. Due to faster metabolism, standard TRT doses don't feel good. Getting estrogen sides when introducing compounds that are supposed to dry you out since they'll tank SHBG. I found gradually increasing doses helps a lot."

What do you think? Is he just conflating a low SHBG with his own metabolic peculiarities of androgens?

I notice some acne and low libido since my shbg is low, maybe thats the high estro sides he means...

Its hard go get shbg levels higher again