Mentzer and HRT

[ciobl]

bros I just have a couple books on training and workout, among them one from McRobert I don't know where I put it but it's around somewhere, another one from Little, one from Schwarzenegger ( overrated in my personal opinion but others have found it very informative ) and the one book, the reason why I brought this thread in the first place:

High Intensity Training by Mike Mentzer.

out of all the books, from what I have read, he is the only writer to make an emphasis on testosterone level, here is the excerpt from page 134:

"It is very important that before starting this or any training program you consult with your doctor and obtain a through check-up. No matter how healthy you may seem, undetected
problems could exist. In addition to a full physical, you should have a blood panel done, and men should additional request a testosterone measure ( something not ordinarily included in a general blood test ). A normal level of testosterone will be necessary to ensure optimal results from the training program."

bros, he deserves a long ovation for those remarks others have not mentioned. Rest in peace Mr. Mentzer.

 

[SD1959]

bros I just have a couple books on training and workout, among them one from McRobert I don't know where I put it but it's around somewhere, another one from Little, one from Schwarzenegger ( overrated in my personal opinion but others have found it very informative ) and the one book, the reason why I brought this thread in the first place:

High Intensity Training by Mike Mentzer.

out of all the books, from what I have read, he is the only writer to make an emphasis on testosterone level, here is the excerpt from page 134:

"It is very important that before starting this or any training program you consult with your doctor and obtain a through check-up. No matter how healthy you may seem, undetected
problems could exist. In addition to a full physical, you should have a blood panel done, and men should additional request a testosterone measure ( something not ordinarily included in a general blood test ). A normal level of testosterone will be necessary to ensure optimal results from the training program."

bros, he deserves a long ovation for those remarks others have not mentioned. Rest in peace Mr. Mentzer.

I had the pleasure of a few phone conversations with the man and was awestruck. A total gentleman.

 

[ciobl]

I had the pleasure of a few phone conversations with the man and was awestruck. A total gentleman.

I envy you, Sir. I am not contemporary with Mr Mentzer but if he still was alive today it would be an honor at least to get some his books autographed.

His works are a legacy, unmatched even today.

 

[peewee327]

how and when did mike mentzer passaway

 

[ciobl]

He passed away on June 9th, 2001 I believe.

Heart problems. His brother Ray passed 2 days after.

From what I have read, his father died at a young age too, same heart complications.

 

[SWALE]

I stood next to Mike Mentzer at the, um, was it the '79 Olympia (where he was second to Frank Zane), while he was signing autographs. Yes, what a guy.

In fact, after seeing Ray win the Mr. USA, getting into my car out in a parking field, this huge guy carrying a monstrous trophy came running toward us with a bunch of other people. It was Ray. This small crowd jumped into the back of a pickup truck next to my Formula (I was working in a GM plant at the time, so could afford to buy a new car), he literally tossed this gigantic trophy into the back, jumped behind the wheel, and, with hoots and hollers, sped off, doing doughnuts in the field as he went. For a nineteen year old, THAT was pretty cool.

 

[ciobl]

(I was working in a GM plant at the time, so could afford to buy a new car), he literally tossed this gigantic trophy into the back, jumped behind the wheel, and, with hoots and hollers, sped off, doing doughnuts in the field as he went. For a nineteen year old, THAT was pretty cool.

I might add:

M.D tuition: $$$$$
M.D books : $$$$$
remembering ol' times: priceless

On a serious note: Doctor Swale you've been around for a while !!!! wow, amazing. By opening this thread I never guessed you previously had met the Mentzer brothers. I won't ask you or the other gentleman to add anecdotes, even though I might want to hear them but because the objective of the forum is directed towards hrt

 

[Bob Smith]

A normal level of testosterone will be necessary to ensure optimal results from the training program.

bros, he deserves a long ovation for those remarks others have not mentioned. Rest in peace Mr. Mentzer.

I dont see that comment as being all that remarkable. Of course having higher levels of T will help to produce optimal/maximal results, thats not exactly brain surgery.

Of the books/authors you mentioned, the only one worth reading, IMO, is McRobert. Sometimes I think he gets carried away with the whole hardgainer approach (but not near as much as Mentzer), McRoberts ideas are very sound and his book about exercise technique is the best available.

 

[ciobl]

I dont see that comment as being all that remarkable. Of course having higher levels of T will help to produce optimal/maximal results, thats not exactly brain surgery.

allright, since it is not brain surgery how come other authors on bodybuilding related works have not brought it up ? Oh, they assume everybody knows to check their t levels before working out ?

Of the books/authors you mentioned, the only one worth reading, IMO, is McRobert. Sometimes I think he gets carried away with the whole hardgainer approach (but not near as much as Mentzer), McRoberts ideas are very sound and his book about exercise technique is the best available.

McRobert is to bodybuilding what general practitioners are to the medical field. Mentzer on the other hand is to bodybuilding what Shippen and Swale are to hormone and testosterone replacement therapies.

Mentzer gave the neccesary tools to all his followers always keeping his integrity above the comercialization purposes others were tasting at the moment.

Mentzer never said less is better but rather "precise is best", same thing with Shippen and Crisler.

 

[Bob Smith]

allright, since it is not brain surgery how come other authors on bodybuilding related works have not brought it up ? Oh, they assume everybody knows to check their t levels before working out ?

Because its not relevant to the 95% of lifters that will never use AAS. If one isnt going to use AAS, then their test levels arent going to matter since they will have to deal with the hormonal lot theyve been given.

McRobert is to bodybuilding what general practitioners are to the medical field. Mentzer on the other hand is to bodybuilding what Shippen and Swale are to hormone and testosterone replacement therapies.

I disagree about Mentzer being a "specialist." I never liked his programs or his constant philosophizing. For all practical matters, Mentzer was the other extreme of the spectrum from guys like Arnold and the super-high volume crowd.

 

[ciobl]

Because its not relevant to the 95% of lifters that will never use AAS. If one isnt going to use AAS, then their test levels arent going to matter since they will have to deal with the hormonal lot theyve been given.

He is suggesting to take testosterone measurements to ensure optimal results from training.
Do you have any clue how many people with testosterone deficiency and years of failure have properly trained reaching less than optimal results and once a testosterone measurement is done optimal results occur ?
'...they will have to deal with the hormonal lot theyve been given' Great approach !!!! its like saying if its broke why fix it right ?
...or better yet to deny any medical advancement the proper checkup of testosterone can give elderly and even young people with hypogonadism by insuring an appropiate level is reached so they can benefit from a better workout regime.

I disagree about Mentzer being a "specialist." I never liked his programs or his constant philosophizing. For all practical matters, Mentzer was the other extreme of the spectrum from guys like Arnold and the super-high volume crowd.

I disagree about him being a 'specialist' too. He had an extensive knowledge of exercise science though. Has been the smartest bodybuilder ever lived by disregarding obsolete teachings from others that ridiculously controlled the bodybuilding bureaucracy back then and still do nowadays.
'the other extreme of the spectrum' , of course, geniuses always are on that extreme of the spectrum and usually create controversies with their ideas that are ahead of their time.

I forgot to add, I never said he is a specialist, you said it.

They call him "The Philosopher of Mind and Body" though.

 

[cpeil2]

I found most of Mentzer's articles in bodybuilding magazines nearly unreadable because of the philosophizing and the excess verbiage. But he resonates with some people. This young guy I know picked up one of his books not long ago - reading it set the kid on fire. The Neitzchean tone of it really hooked him. He gained quite a bit of lean weight in a short period of time using Mentzer's HIT methods.

 

[bigmark]

I have always been a huge fan of his. IMO his training concepts and theories in general, although many borrowed from Aurther Jones were way ahead of his time.
I still laugh to myself when I read through my Arnold's encyclopedia of bodybuilding, talk about overtraining. Mike was on the right track, I would have loved to see Ferigno continue to compete and use his methods he would have been unstoppable.

 

[SWALE]

Sit down for this one, guys:

I have seen Reg Park and Dave Draper pose, too. Casey Viator was breathtaking.

 

[prot]

Hw was a trifle long winded and convoluted..but basically right

But what I admire most was two things..the best back ever and he took care of Ray for years before he died.

 

[smoker]

Dave Draper, Reg Park!

That is old school Swale... I recently met Dave on a book signing tour, great guy.

 

[BigRagu]

But what I admire most was two things..the best back ever and he took care of Ray for years before he died.

no1 is beating dorian's back.................

 

[prot]

I disagree

no1 is beating dorian's back.................

Mentzer's bac was completely symmetrical..incuding his arms and delts in pose...I am not talking bulk but the way his back pose looked...

 

[ciobl]

no1 is beating dorian's back.................

who's the brain behind dorian's success ?

I can't hear it ? say that again ? louder please.....

High-volume crowd writers and authors wannabes: they have written more than what they have read.

always read more than write unless you want to be a pathetic high-volume writer.

take care bros.

 

[Bob Smith]

Dorians approach didnt really follow Mentzers HIT, so whats the arguement?

Mentzers HIT or Arnolds high volume. Big deal, I think both are far from optimal for the majority of people. If you want some real knowledge on training, read some articles by Bryan Haycock or Christian Thibeadeau or the posts on Meso by JohnSmith.