Monero (XMR)

Discussion in 'Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency' started by master.on, Jul 14, 2016.

  1. 23inch

    23inch Member

    I was not refuting any argument, just complementing my statement. But I see why you would say that.

    Not right now, and probably not until people get caught, but eventually they might.

    Think about it, LE agent buys from a source and saves the bitcoin address.
    Upon further analysis they can either bust the source's depending on how good is the OPSEC or, they can let the source run their business while they keep tracking everyone who sends bitcoins to the bitcoin address.
    They could then trace the address back to the exchange (has happened before) or, if you're storing the bitcoins in a local wallet, they could easily get the IP associated with the transaction.

    Obviously LE doesn't read this forum as much as people make it to be, but that may change in the not so distant future. I have been watching them closely and I can assure you they are getting pretty good at this game, It's just a question of time.
  2. Millard Baker

    Millard Baker Member

    I completely agree but my point is that the sources still won't be doing it in response to overwhelming consumer demand. They are doing it to cover their ass. They are doing it because it is the smart thing to do. In other words, they are doing it because it is in their best interests independent of the benefits to the consumer.
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    Last edited: Nov 25, 2017
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  5. 23inch

    23inch Member

    Perhaps, but it doesn't hurt to try.

    Either way, bitcoin will fail sooner or later and people will switch to Monero, so get your hands on it while you still can and enjoy the profits!

    Interesting read: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising
    Millard Baker likes this.
  6. Mr.Perfect

    Mr.Perfect Member

    Do you think bitcoin will fail in the sense of its poor anonymity or you mean fail in general? And if you mean fail in general, I'm interested to know why you think that?
  7. master.on

    master.on Member

    Wannacry virus ransoms were transferred from Bitcoin to Monero for anonymity
    WannaCry's bitcoins were converted to Monero, researchers say - CyberScoop
    IMO that's the beginning of the end for Bitcoin

    When you see viruses demanding ransoms in Monero (or any other untraceable currency) that's the sharp turning point for Bitcoin.
    sinewave3 likes this.
  8. rpbb

    rpbb Member Supporter

    Where can you buy monero
  9. 23inch

    23inch Member

    As bitcoin is going mainstream, a lot of people are getting to know about the wonderful world of cryptocurrencies and the valuable investments that comes along.

    The bitcoin price will most likely still rise quite a lot for the next 2 years until it eventually stops.

    Reason is that people see bitcoin as an investment (more likely speculation) and not really as a payment method.
    The recent hard fork attempts prove how the community is split and can hardly come to any kind of agreement, the bitcoin is having major issues within its structure on being able to handle such an influx of transactions and that is why the fees are VERY high as of now. Still, you see the bitcoin price rising like never before, does that even make sense? Does it sound like a long term investment? Unfortunately it does not.

    Monero on another hand has much lower fees, way faster transaction times and is the only truly anonymous cryptocurrency, it has been growing stably.

    People are starting to see that and are slowly investing on Monero too, as you can see it is still growing as we speak and eventually it will reach a price that will force bitcoin investors to move in, otherwise they will lose their profits.

    -- EDIT - -
    On the bright side, those who choose to keep using BTC for ilegal actions, will serve as low hanging fruits. :D
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
    master.on likes this.
  10. 23inch

    23inch Member

    I buy Monero directly from Kraken Exchange (no need to buy BTC and exchange it for Monero later).

    EU users have SEPA deposit available, which is free.
    Deposits are also free for Canadians, however US citizens have to pay a 5$ fee per domestic deposit.
    master.on likes this.
  11. rpbb

    rpbb Member Supporter

    Can I leave the monero right in the kraken exchange, till I figure out the wallet thing for monero
  12. 23inch

    23inch Member

    I have done it many times, but I don't recommend it.

    About the wallet thing, take a look here, very helpful and easy to understand:
    Monero GUI Wallet Guide
  13. master.on

    master.on Member

    IMO cryptos are only good for sources
    since they only need one fake ID for an account that serves hundreds, even thousands of customers.

    Compare to the hundreds of flesh-and-bone money receivers WU/MG requires.
    Check Truefighter leak on Naps money receiver names. for example.
  14. 23inch

    23inch Member

    So, with the current HUGE fees of BTC, do you still believe in this theory of yours?
    The consumers will stop using BTC eventually, because it is simply not usable anymore, so eventually they will be forced to drive vendors into altcoins such as Monero, or they may as well leave the cryptocurrency's world as a payment method.

    Of course, while most people on this forum prefer comfy over security, it will take a while, but the time will come.

    BTC is dead on darkweb and it was darkweb who basically made Bitcoin grow, so take that as a sign.
  15. Millard Baker

    Millard Baker Member

    So, I see you subscribe to my theory now :) Just like they've been dragged kicking and screaming from WU/MG to BTC, they will be dragged from BTC to XMR precisely because they prefer "comfy over security".

    If you're familiar with darkweb markets, you know that those markets are nothing like AAS marketplaces - they are light years ahead. But from reading bodybuilding forums, you'd never know that.
  16. 23inch

    23inch Member

    I don't think you got my point at all.

    Vendors like bitcoin because it is an investment, they have no reason to change right now.

    Customers like bitcoin because it was first advertised as being anonymous, having lower fees and fast transactions.

    We don't see any of those advantages anymore, bitcoin reached a point where it is nothing more than an investment and this has been made clear by the corporation that took over bitcoin and changed its role from the one originally written by Satoshi Nakamoto.

    Using bitcoin as a payment method right now is a disadvantage to costumers, so they will have to change sooner or later to another altcoin, if not for privacy then for cheaper transactions. Or, leave crypto world altogether.
  17. Millard Baker

    Millard Baker Member

    I understand your point better than you do. I've been warning members about the lack of anonymity of Bitcoin on this forum for years before you signed up and highlighting possible solutions for improving upon Bitcoin's shortcomings including the use of alternate cryptocurrencies. So you have no disagreements from me on Bitcoin's disadvantages.

    I'm not sure why you insist on strawman arguments - you're preaching to the choir. I hope this becomes increasingly obvious to you as you become more familiar with my postings on the topic.

    There is only one very specific point of contention... and that is who is most motivated to drive transition to / addition of alternate cryptocurrency payment options (such as Monero) in the AAS marketplace - consumers or vendors?

    This ^^^ couldn't be more wrong. The AAS vendors have a far greater incentive than consumers to change and conduct business using a truly anonymous cryptocurrency like Monero when it comes to AAS.

    Blockchain analysis has advanced so that it is far easier for law enforcement agencies to monitor Bitcoin transactions particularly with regard to off-ramp actions.

    There is an overwhelming apathy when it comes to anonymity, privacy and security in the AAS internet consumer marketplace. But they can usually get away with it. Vendors can not.

    So yeah, I stand by my assertion that it will be vendor self-preservation that will drive more secure and anonymous technologies in the AAS marketplace and not overwhelming consumer demand.

    Both sides will obviously benefit but vendors have more incentive. Of course, it is kinda pointless for a vendor to offer an option like Monero if there is little consumer demand. So consumer demand needs to develop. But most likely it will be vendors offering 20-30% discounts as incentives -- like they did/do with Bitcoin -- to create that consumer demand.
  18. 23inch

    23inch Member

    I'm not even pointing privacy anymore as the main concern, I'm saying that consumers have no use for BTC as it does not provide any advantage over Fiat currency, if anything it has become more expensive.

    The reason I say sources may not want to change to other cryptocurrencies is because they currently can make huge profits on it and we, as consumers, are the ones to lose.
    As a source you can trade BTC for Monero thus breaking the blockchain track, easily making you anonymous, but as a costumer that's an extra step, which means less comfy and more fees.

    My initial post was intended to support what you have been stating regarding bitcoin's privacy and hopefully make customers come to their senses and try to convince sources to use Monero or another secure altcoin, but if sources choose to do it themselves, better yet.
    Who will or will not do it will hardly make a difference, action needs to be taken.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017
  19. Millard Baker

    Millard Baker Member

    That's true and I applaud you for trying to educate and inform. I don't doubt it will happen. It's just why is it taking so long. The apathy over these issues and the luddism is frustrating.
    23inch likes this.
  20. sinewave3

    sinewave3 Member

    Planned on trying Kraken but in USA they now ask for social security number before they will accept deposits from a bank account. What will they do with that info, give straight to tax man if we make any profits?

    Looks like bitcoin can still be deposited at Kraken with basic info though.