MT2

[Stealth500]

I'm certainly not suggesting it's risk free. Given it's widespread, and relatively long period of use I'm not seeing any evidence it's highly dangerous either though. I've only seen a couple of cases of documented harms, and those were connected with really heavy use.

It's close relative PT-141 passed muster with the FDA which again, while no guarantee of MT-II safety, is another point in its favor.

The problem with MT-II, unlike PT-141, is that the patent expired prior to an attempt to commercialize it. If you read the history this didn't happen because it was abandoned like GW-50516, but because of convoluted business dealings and protracted court cases that went on for years fighting over who owned what. Without this patent protection, there's no financial incentive to fund full on clinical trials.

Most of the effects related to the brain involve the MC4 receptor, which MT-II activates. This declines with age. Studies in animals show neuroprotection and neurogensis, as well as enhanced intelligence with melanocortin agnonists.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0301008215300162

Aged Brains Express Less Melanocortin Receptors, Which Correlates with Age-Related Decline of Cognitive Functions - PMC

Brain G-protein coupled receptors have been hypothesized to be potential targets for maintaining or restoring cognitive function in normal aged individuals or in patients with neurodegenerative disease. A number of recent reports suggest that ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Melanocortins protect against brain damage and counteract cognitive decline in a transgenic mouse model of moderate Alzheimer׳s disease

We previously reported that melanocortins induce neuroprotection in experimental acute and chronic neurodegenerative conditions, including Alzheimer׳s…

www.sciencedirect.com

It's said to lower appetite via MC4 activation, and I've definitely experienced all of the effects in the animal study below, which are pleasurable, and immediately reminded me of what I felt in my teens and very early twenties. In my experience the "muscle stiffness" isn't cramping, but more of a "light on your feet" kind of feeling. The ability to activate muscle with less effort. I don't know if it's related, but walking pace is often used to gauge biological aging in males, and that last effect increases my walking pace, as reported by my fitness tracker:

Activation of MC4R pathway has also been associated with several non-feeding related activities, including increased yawning, muscular stiffness, stretching, and penile erections

Current Mechanistic and Pharmacodynamic Understanding of Melanocortin-4 Receptor Activation - PMC

In this work we summarize our understanding of melanocortin 4 receptor (MC4R) pathway activation, aiming to define a safe and effective therapeutic targeting strategy for the MC4R. Delineation of cellular MC4R pathways has provided evidence for ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

thanks,
there is a new fda approved drug. forgot the name but its a selective agonist that only acts on one of the receptors.

 

[Ghoul]

thanks,
there is a new fda approved drug. forgot the name but its a selective agonist that only acts on one of the receptors.

It's not something I'd comfortably recommend to acquaintances and strangers without hesitation, unlike Sema or Tirz (or even PT-141), but to someone I was close to, after explaining it's "not proven safe by the FDA(though seems low risk) and there are definite risks from heavy use" I'd help them use it properly if they asked.

 

[Stealth500]

It's not something I'd comfortably recommend to acquaintances and strangers without hesitation, unlike Sema or Tirz (or even PT-141), but to someone I was close to, after explaining it's "not proven safe by the FDA(though seems low risk) and there are definite risks from heavy use" I'd help them use it properly if they asked.

setmelanotide is the drugs name with fda approval

"sold under the brand name Imcivree, is a medication used for the treatment of genetic obesity caused by a rare single-gene mutation"

my understanding as the reason mt2 was never approved was because it was a non selective agonist that acted on several receptors and there was some potential for adverse effects.

as far as the drug being widely used it's kind of hard to guage the harm done when there are no controlled clinical trials.

 

[Ghoul]

setmelanotide is the drugs name with fda approval

"sold under the brand name Imcivree, is a medication used for the treatment of genetic obesity caused by a rare single-gene mutation"

my understanding as the reason mt2 was never approved was because it was a non selective agonist that acted on several receptors and there was some potential for adverse effects.

as far as the drug being widely used it's kind of hard to guage the harm done when there are no controlled clinical trials.

You're not wrong about the "unknown" aspect. It did gain some notoriety in recent years, so I know there have been a good number of journalists, and some medical researchers trying to chase down supporting info regarding harms, even anecdotally, to accompany the ominous warnings from docs and didn't come up with much. I'd be happier if it had a 30 year+ track record of UGL availability vs 15 or so, of course.

It's on the edge of my personal risk tolerance. I consider my use moderate.

I'd never use, for instance, SLUPP, or FLadafanil. Despite no evidence of harm so far, they're far too novel for my comfort.

 

[Stealth500]

I'd be happier if it had a 30 year+ track record of UGL availability vs 15 or so, of course.

i'd be happy with some sort of clinical trials where we had definitive answers. we can make arguements for or against all day long without proof its a lot of assumptions.

 

[nightprowler7]

You're not wrong about the "unknown" aspect. It did gain some notoriety in recent years, so I know there have been a good number of journalists, and some medical researchers trying to chase down supporting info regarding harms, even anecdotally, to accompany the ominous warnings from docs and didn't come up with much. I'd be happier if it had a 30 year+ track record of UGL availability vs 15 or so, of course.

It's on the edge of my personal risk tolerance. I consider my use moderate.

I'd never use, for instance, SLUPP, or FLadafanil. Despite no evidence of harm so far, they're far too novel for my comfort.

Glad to have you back on the forum!

 

[Ateam2023]

You're not wrong about the "unknown" aspect. It did gain some notoriety in recent years, so I know there have been a good number of journalists, and some medical researchers trying to chase down supporting info regarding harms, even anecdotally, to accompany the ominous warnings from docs and didn't come up with much. I'd be happier if it had a 30 year+ track record of UGL availability vs 15 or so, of course.

It's on the edge of my personal risk tolerance. I consider my use moderate.

I'd never use, for instance, SLUPP, or FLadafanil. Despite no evidence of harm so far, they're far too novel for my comfort.

good your back, You didn't miss much ,,,,

 

[Ghoul]

i'd be happy with some sort of clinical trials where we had definitive answers. we can make arguements for or against all day long without proof its a lot of assumptions.

I came across a phrase in some medical journal that I think is more accurate in this case, "Management of unknown risks". This exists in a lot of medicine. Take 3 drugs at the same time, 2 well established. and a third that was just introduced in the last year, and there's always a chance some interaction could be carcinogenic. After all, even with clinical trials, they can't establish what every potential combination of meds could lead to. Many drugs, surgical procedure are withdrawn years after their introduction because of some awful, unforseen consequence.

In this case we aren't dealing with no information. Plenty of lab rats out there. We can check off certain risks as a result, Does MT-II induce strokes with the first year of use? Extremely unlikely as there'd be some "signal" of that by now.

Will it triple the risk of skin cancer over 20 years of regular use? Cause thyroid nodules to form in 10% of users over 10 years of use? Maybe.

I'm certainly going to keep my ears perked for risks with this or ANY melanocortan receptor agonist for clues. So far I haven't seen anything alarming.

I don't object to your skepticism and caution. It's necessary as becoming complacent is too easy. A reminder that typically, risks of almost all drugs are dependant on dose and frequency, and it's wise, if engaging despite the risks, to use in moderation to at least reduce potential harm. A much better attitude than "haven't lost an ass cheek so it's fine" we see with AAS and the filtration debate. It's also important to keep an open mind toward the possibility that potential risks may not materialize. And even a chance, however small, of net benefit (a low UV tan may in balance reduce risk of skin cancer, for instance, or neurogenesis may reduce the risk of alzheimers).

 

[Ghoul]

Glad to have you back on the forum!

good your back, You didn't miss much ,,,,

Thanks brothers!

 

[Stealth500]

I came across a phrase in some medical journal that I think is more accurate in this case, "Management of unknown risks". This exists in a lot of medicine. Take 3 drugs at the same time, 2 well established. and a third that was just introduced in the last year, and there's always a chance some interaction could be carcinogenic. After all, even with clinical trials, they can't establish what every potential combination of meds could lead to. Many drugs, surgical procedure are withdrawn years after their introduction because of some awful, unforseen consequence.

In this case we aren't dealing with no information. Plenty of lab rats out there. We can check off certain risks as a result, Does MT-II induce strokes with the first year of use? Extremely unlikely as there'd be some "signal" of that by now.

Will it triple the risk of skin cancer over 20 years of regular use? Cause thyroid nodules to form in 10% of users over 10 years of use? Maybe.

I'm certainly going to keep my ears perked for risks with this or ANY melanocortan receptor agonist for clues. So far I haven't seen anything alarming.

I don't object to your skepticism and caution. It's necessary as becoming complacent is too easy. A reminder that typically, risks of almost all drugs are dependant on dose and frequency, and it's wise, if engaging despite the risks, to use in moderation to at least reduce potential harm. A much better attitude than "haven't lost an ass cheek so it's fine" we see with AAS and the filtration debate. It's also important to keep an open mind toward the possibility that potential risks may not materialize. And even a chance, however small, of net benefit (a low UV tan may in balance reduce risk of skin cancer, for instance, or neurogenesis may reduce the risk of alzheimers).

true there could be unknown interactions with other drugs that nobody knows. circling back to my point i made in the other thread was that many people using MT2 could also be using various other substances.. whether they be recreational narcotics or cigarettes or even popping nsaids on the regular.. All of these are things that could contribute to renal function.

you said a stroke thats interesting because ive also read that renal infarction could be caused by a stroke yet there is no history of stroke being cause by overstimulation of the melanocortin receptors. but again it is still somewhat unknown.

Anyone taking any Drug needs to research and weigh the risks/rewards of taking it. I couldn't in good conscience recommend it to anyone. I reckon eventually some company will come in make a few minor tweaks and seek FDA approval. Sadly the price will then go through the roof as seen with the afamelanotide being completely unaffordable.