Nardicus69
New Member
This is actually a really good idea for OP to do
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
my igf1 is just 246 and i take 10iu gh daily??
- Thread starter Nadix
- Start date
I agree with Elektrobot and you that he determines his baseline and does a serum test to determine if his gear is bunk.
I also agree with you his bloodwork is mostly in check and he is in a bulk so that should be good too. The outlier to me is the e2. I don't know if that is the specific issue but it would be interesting to see him get his natural baseline, test his gear, and then optimize his e2 to see the results.
My understanding is too little/too high e2 will inhibit igf1. Is 120 enough to inhibit igf1 this much when you'd expect more from 10iu? I'm not sure but its well out of normal range.
Stealing more from ghoul below.
"E2 is “permissive” for the liver’s conversion of GH to IGF. A tiny bit is needed to for the process to function so:
Very low, below range E2 will inhibit IGF-1.
In range, and moderately above range, does not inhibit IGF-1.
Very high E2 will inhibit IGF-1."
Nardicus69
New Member
I agree with Elektrobot and you that he determines his baseline and does a serum test to determine if his gear is bunk.
I also agree with you his bloodwork is mostly in check and he is in a bulk so that should be good too. The outlier to me is the e2. I don't know if that is the specific issue but it would be interesting to see him get his natural baseline, test his gear, and then optimize his e2 to see the results.
My understanding is too little/too high e2 will inhibit igf1. Is 120 enough to inhibit igf1 this much when you'd expect more from 10iu? I'm not sure but its well out of normal range.
Stealing more from ghoul below.
"E2 is “permissive” for the liver’s conversion of GH to IGF. A tiny bit is needed to for the process to function so:
Very low, below range E2 will inhibit IGF-1.
In range, and moderately above range, does not inhibit IGF-1.
Very high E2 will inhibit IGF-1."
Your right that high Estrodial can play a factor in lower IGF-1 but there is far more nuance to this as well. The guy you quoted probably read the passage where is said:
"oral estrogen at 2mg administered equated to a 43% drop in igf1 over 3 months"
Source:
Effects of oral and transdermal estrogen on IGF1, IGFBP3, IGFBP1, serum lipids, and glucose in patients with hypopituitarism during GH treatment: a randomized study - PubMed
Our preliminary data indicate that different estrogen administration routes can influence IGF1 and IGFBP1 levels. These findings in patients with hypopituitarism have an impact on their response to treatment with GH, since patients receiving oral estrogen require increased GH dosage. These...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
For one Because oral estrogen lowers IGF-1 via a liver-specific first-pass mechanism, not because “estrogen is high in the blood".
This is important but to summarize where they got this info when oral estrogen was taken, becauseOral estrogen causes a large decrease in IGF-1 because it undergoes first-pass metabolism in the liver, exposing the liver to very high estrogen concentrations. Since the liver produces most circulating IGF-1 in response to growth hormone, this hepatic estrogen exposure inhibits GH receptor signaling and reduces IGF-1 synthesis, leading to a substantial drop in IGF-1 levels.
TDLR: Those studies describe estrogen acting within the liver to induce GH resistance and suppress IGF-1 production, and they are not based on serum estradiol levels. The effect depends on high hepatic estrogen exposure, which occurs primarily with oral estradiol due to first-pass metabolism. Elevated serum estradiol from non-oral sources does not produce the same IGF-1 suppression like the OP.
They basically used oral estrodial as a controllaled variable to see how people IGF-1 levels would change, but oral estrodial can interact with IGF-1 since both pass through the liver so results on a Male not using a pill make the studies near pointless as a reference and not as helpful n reliable for enhanced user's.
But overall to say his Estrogen being out of wack to be the cause of his lower IGF levels is incredibly slim due to the mechanism's on how they got that information which doesn't biologically add up unless OP is secretly taking estrogen pills under his DESK LOL.
Since no one wants to point as his HGH being fake, lets look at some possible causes on why it could be this low:
1.) He's either severely insulin resistant since IGF-1 production is very insulin dependent; but doubt that cause there would symptoms he would have mentioned and I am guessing he probs even checked for this which is usual protocol when also checking for IGF-1.
2.) He might have Elevated AST/ALT from alcohol and orals which would mean compromised liver thus causing his liver not to produce the IGF-1 at max but again I feel like OP would of checked for this as well when doing routinely blood work.
3.) He might have anti boddies fighting the HGH in his system which is incredibly fucking RARE condition.
If none of these Apply to OP, than it all goes back to pointing at the source of where he is getting the HGH.
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Igf-1 blood test result represents an average growth hormone over time rather than snapshot of when blood was drawn .,It's not going to take over a month, in fact if quite literally works within a week LMFAO,
HGH passes through --> the LIVER, the LIVER turns into --> IGF1
This is the sequence on how it works, and based on you said, this whole sequence would be thrown off if you had to wait "weeks" cause last time I checked it doesn't take "weeks" for HGH to go through the liverin fact it takes SECONDS.
View attachment 369974View attachment 369975
“It takes about 1 minute for blood to circulate throughout the entire circulatory system. The time for blood to travel from the left ventricle through the systemic circulation, back through the lungs, and back to the left ventricle is on the order of ~60 seconds (±).”
Source: ClinicalKey
Everyone is in this chat is so misleading its not even funny, OP your stuff is fake I am sorry to tell you.
There is a reason why you can see sides such as enhanced sleep and water retention the same day you use HGH, that is a sign it works right away, and the water retention comes from elevated IGF1 acting on the aldosterone system which regulates water/soduim Homeostatis.
He has basically only being on 10.iu a week..
On other hand l, serum igf-1 provides a stable intergrated messure that reflects average gh secretion over recent days
Dial It In
Member
You just said in another thread you are running 250 test. You said years of AAS and you’re 29 lmao. You are already planning a dumb blast and you’ve obviously never once did a blood test and an according to this you are already blasting. The amount of irresponsibility this forum is seeing has become astounding
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