On TRT for past year, feel tired and irritable...

[digphish]

I am 34 and was diagnosed last year with secondary hypogonadism due to a small pituitary tumor (Test was 174). After searching for the right doctor, I found an endocrinologist that would allow me to proceed with Dr. Crisler's protocol: 100mg Test weekly and the two shots of HcG 250IU the days before. I felt much better after about 6 weeks and tests came back with my Test at 600 the day of the shot (before the injection).

Well I felt great for a while and started getting a lot of back acne. After researching, I felt that maybe it would be a better idea to split my dose of Test into two 50mg shots, with the HcG shot coming the day before. I did this for 2 months, and it helped the acne, but I didn't feel as well. Then I came across the every 3 days routine. So I decided to go that route: I do 40mg Test every 3 days with a 250Iu HcG shot the day before. I've been doing this for about 2 months now. However, I don't feel good. I feel tired and irritable all of the time. I hate feeling like this especially around my young kids.

I just had blood work done and everything came back relatively normal:
Cortisol 15.3 normal 2.3-19.4
Estradiol 36.9 normal 7.6-42.6
Vitamin D 45.5 normal 32-100
Testosterone 700
Free Test 25.7 normal 8.7-25.1
DHT 30
DHEA 226 normal 31-701
Glucose 93 normal 65-99
Creatinine 1.16 normal .76-1.27
sodium 146 normal 135-145
Bilirubin 3.1 normal 0-1.2
CBC was normal

I did not include all of the metabolic tests as they were all midrange normal. I know I need to have my thyroid checked still. Any thoughts on why I feel the way I do?

Thanks in advance

 

[benrock]

ok hear me out i had a similar problem , i would try just hcg for a few weeks to see how you feel , i was on test injections for 8 yrs and felt like shit always after 6 months on , then i would stop and restart .

anyway new doc gave me 1000iu eod of hcg and i feel the best i ever have in 8 yrs .

it cant hurt to try , plus your estrodiol looks on the high side , you want it around 20 .

maybe you need some arimedex or aromasin to lower it and that might work for you

 

[digphish]

Thanks for the reply. I have thought about going with the HcG Monotherapy, but I've read that it would cause high Estrogen levels and/or cause burnout of my Leydig cells. Have you had any issues? How is your blood work now that you are on the HcG only?

Also, I didn't think my Estrogen was high...according to the lab normals. Is there a way to bring it down without taking medication?

Thanks

 

[benrock]

as far as the leydig cells , im not sure , but if you look at it this way , trt is for life so u have to do whats right for you. i mean its not like your test is going to bounce back by itself , so whats the need for those cells .and with a pitutary tumor who knows.

just try it i promise you will love it , i refers a bunch of people to hcg mono and they all are doing great. test is great in the begining but for some reason we crash after 6 months . i personally think its because our body dosent produce it anymore and thats what the hcg is suppose toi be for but 250iu is a very low dose to do anything . some people have good luck on that though so it varies person to person.

as far as thre estrogen you can try DIM or Indole-3-carbinol . or get some ldex from our sponser.

just remember everone is different , what works for me might be the worst for you , so you have to experiment .

good luck my man

 

[sotired45]

You may want to try lowering your E2.
Everyone is different.

I get irritable and cranky with E2 levels above 15.

E2 cranks me out real fast. But thats me. Most people do best with 20-30.
But maybe you are like me.

I feel better with E2 as low as 5, than I do with E2 at 30.

Low E2 is associated with bone loss though, so I wouldnt try to lower it too much, just do an experiment and see if there is a significant effect.

 

[Tyler81]

I basically feel the same way on testosterone - tired and irritable.

It always starts out good, the first few weeks and even month i feel better. Then I start to feel sort of "blue" and irritable.

Not sure why, but i think replacing our natural testosterone shuts down other important hormones such as preg and DHEA? Other factors could include estrogen or cortisol? I have also read that testosterone replacement can reduce thyroid function.

I'm not really sure why I feel worse (mood wise) on testosterone but after having started and stopped thrice over the past few years, its a pattern i have definetly noticed.

The longest strech I was "ON" was about 6 months and around 5months, i wasnt feeling good at all even alongside 300mg wellbutrin! And if i didnt take the wellbutrin, i felt awful!

When I came off testosterone, i was able to drop my wellbutrin dose to 150mg and i felt good!

So testosterone replacement is tricky for me.

I will most likely have to be on testosterone @ some point (i really cant live with sub 300 levels for too long) but i will have to figure out how to FEEL GOOD while on testosterone.

Otherwise whats the point?

 

[1erCru]

You have to at least address estrogen as a potential cause for less than optimal TRT. There are many guys who dont function well with estrogen levels over 30. That piece of information alone should tell you something.

 

[foreveryoung]

You have to at least address estrogen as a potential cause for less than optimal TRT. There are many guys who dont function well with estrogen levels over 30. That piece of information alone should tell you something.

but do those guys find perfection in taking arimidex, or is it still a difficult struggle and compromise

 

[1erCru]

You mention perfection. Unfortunately I dont think this is possible for most people who are healthy. When focusing on health issues via the manipulation of hormones it becomes very easy to get wrapped up in the " I dont feel so great, it must be the treatment " mentality, therefore resulting in continous attempts to " correct " the real or perceived imbalance.
Im just saying it would be ashamed to walk away from TRT forever, without even trying to modulate variables that are within the patients control such as estrogen.

 

[DragonRider]

Estradiol 36.9 normal 7.6-42.6
Free Test 25.7 normal 8.7-25.1
I did not include all of the metabolic tests as they were all midrange normal. I know I need to have my thyroid checked still. Any thoughts on why I feel the way I do?

Thanks in advance

Did you have SHBG checked?
Benrock already pointed it out. Your E2 is too high. It is very important you don't go by ranges while on TRT. Experience on the board will tell you most of us function best under 30pg/dL and 15 to 20 is usually the best. I know I have problems at 37pg.
Your free test indicates that your SHBG is low and for those of us with low SHBG, we seem to need an E2 level that is very close to the SHBG number.

 

[biceps72]

as pointed out

your E2 is too high

i would rather have a lower total test than a too high E2,

btw, irritable and being tired go hand in hand with me,

eat well and sleep 8 hrs every 24 hours, good crisp wokouts, some cardio and a very regular schedule helps me with feeling tired.

I am boring as hell, i eat about the same time every day, sleep the same amount every day, workout at the same time every day, etc. I still feel tired now and then. I actually think that TRT does this to many men (but not all obviously). Not sure this is a real phenomenon nor can I think of a [hysiological explanation for getting tired from taking testosterone??