PCT Plan and Questions

[IncorrectName]

Alright boys. I'm almost half way through my cycle so I want your thoughts on what my PCT should look like.

Cycle (10 weeks) is:
test sust 250 500mg a week
Masteron 300mg a week
Also had a little dbol left that I used the first two weeks at 20mg daily. Probably a waste to be honest but in any case.

HCG at the 6th or 7th week until the end of the cycle at 250iu three times a week. Hopefully it's not going to be in ampules.

PCT:
Clomid 100/100/50/50. Four weeks in total.
Nolvadex 40/40/40/20/20. Five weeks in total.
I'll have either Arimidex or Aromasin in hand to use it just in case.

Does the dosage in HCG sound good? What about the weeks and dosages in the PCT?

 

[Pineapples4Puss]

Imo no reason to do clomid that high. The side effects where very apparent to me. I kept my clomid around 75 mg for 1 week then 50 for 3-4 weeks. Then nolva at 25 mg daily for 4 weeks. I did this without hcg came back pretty well.

Hcg sounds good to me too I’m including hcg at 500 ius a week for the duration of my next cycle. Probably up it when coming off pre pct.

But keep it as is or lower everything slightly and keep the same protocol.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

I’d run nolva an extra week, cut clomid in half. Start HCG ASAP to allow time to see if it’s enough or if you’ll have to “mega” dose it to kickstart since it wasn’t on your whole cycle.

 

[IncorrectName]

Cut the dose on clomid, add an extra week on nolva and start hcg sooner. Gotcha.

I'll probably have the hcg next week. Hopefully all will be well, even though I doubt that I'll have any issues.

 

[master.on]

Alright boys. I'm almost half way through my cycle so I want your thoughts on what my PCT should look like.

Cycle (10 weeks) is:
test sust 250 500mg a week
Masteron 300mg a week
Also had a little dbol left that I used the first two weeks at 20mg daily. Probably a waste to be honest but in any case.

HCG at the 6th or 7th week until the end of the cycle at 250iu three times a week. Hopefully it's not going to be in ampules.

PCT:
Clomid 100/100/50/50. Four weeks in total.
Nolvadex 40/40/40/20/20. Five weeks in total.
I'll have either Arimidex or Aromasin in hand to use it just in case.

Does the dosage in HCG sound good? What about the weeks and dosages in the PCT?

Is that HCG 250 IU 3x/week = 750 IU/week, correct?
If so, that's to high a dose
so unless you're really shutdown already, that HCG dosage is guaranteed to skyrocket estradiol.

 

[Gbunk]

I’d run nolva an extra week, cut clomid in half. Start HCG ASAP to allow time to see if it’s enough or if you’ll have to “mega” dose it to kickstart since it wasn’t on your whole cycle.

So I’ve seen this going around the forum and I’m confused. I heard that there is no point taking hcg on cycle because the steroids will shut you done regardless. The logic that steroids will shut you down and hcg will basically be useless because the steroids are shutting you down the hole time. I also know a coach who trains pro’s and he recommends hcg after cycle. Just curious to know why people on this forum recommend it while on?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

So I’ve seen this going around the forum and I’m confused. I heard that there is no point taking hcg on cycle because the steroids will shut you done regardless. The logic that steroids will shut you down and hcg will basically be useless because the steroids are shutting you down the hole time. I also know a coach who trains pro’s and he recommends hcg after cycle. Just curious to know why people on this forum recommend it while on?

There’s two methods.

Yes taking steroids shuts down your natural production. HCG use on cycle is proven to maintain testicular function though.

So either you do ~250iu 2x per week or you mega dose it in PCT.

Note that “a coach who trains pros” probably has an old school knowledge base and is resistant to change. That’s just a fact of the industry.

 

[Gbunk]

I thought what I heard from a knowledgeable and older amateur is that the brain gets two signals, one from hcg and another from the hormone already in your blood or something that kinda amount to no gain from the hcg. Do you have a study you can provide Since you claim it is proven?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

I thought what I heard from a knowledgeable and older amateur is that the brain gets two signals, one from hcg and another from the hormone already in your blood or something that kinda amount to no gain from the hcg. Do you have a study you can provide Since you claim it is proven?

Plenty of this stuff posted here on Meso. Don’t keep this stuff handy, sorry.

 

[IncorrectName]

Is that HCG 250 IU 3x/week = 750 IU/week, correct?
If so, that's to high a dose
so unless you're really shutdown already, that HCG dosage is guaranteed to skyrocket estradiol.

I see. So 150 IU or 200 3x/week?

I thought what I heard from a knowledgeable and older amateur is that the brain gets two signals, one from hcg and another from the hormone already in your blood or something that kinda amount to no gain from the hcg. Do you have a study you can provide Since you claim it is proven?

I get this from older people as well. They prefer hcg after the cycle.


Edit: Thanks for moving the thread. Completely forgot about this section.

 

[The Terminator]

Is that HCG 250 IU 3x/week = 750 IU/week, correct?
If so, that's to high a dose
so unless you're really shutdown already, that HCG dosage is guaranteed to skyrocket estradiol.

750iu/wk is a low dose, high dose would be >5000iu/wk. There was a study I read where men were givin 5000iu eod or 3/wk w/o AI and the average E level was in the 120’s, so I’d guess 750 wouldn’t cause much problems with many.

So I’ve seen this going around the forum and I’m confused. I heard that there is no point taking hcg on cycle because the steroids will shut you done regardless. The logic that steroids will shut you down and hcg will basically be useless because the steroids are shutting you down the hole time. I also know a coach who trains pro’s and he recommends hcg after cycle. Just curious to know why people on this forum recommend it while on?

I thought what I heard from a knowledgeable and older amateur is that the brain gets two signals, one from hcg and another from the hormone already in your blood or something that kinda amount to no gain from the hcg. Do you have a study you can provide Since you claim it is proven?

Not sure what your body is talking about, roids will suppress you because the hypothalamus will sense elevated androgens and estrogens, leading to suppressed GnRH which leads to less LH/FSH. hCG is an LH analogue that acts directly on the testicles, it’s basically taking over for the P in the HPGA, minus the FSH. So it’ll still work but I do believe hCG’s affect is even more potent without the presence of roids but I’d use it during the cycle and after leading up to serms.

 

[IncorrectName]

I got this 250iu 3x/week from here hCG Profile

Ι honestly have no idea about it. I noticed shrinkage but not too much, maybe because I'm almost half way through. Do I keep it 250iu 3x/week or 250iu eod?

 

[The Terminator]

I got this 250iu 3x/week from here hCG Profile

Ι honestly have no idea about it. I noticed shrinkage but not too much, maybe because I'm almost half way through. Do I keep it 250iu 3x/week or 250iu eod?

250iu/eod resulted in only a 7% drop in ITT (intra-testicular testosterone) levels, 500iu/eod resulted in an ITT increase of 26%. Now this really isn’t important since you’re not on trt, I’d do 250/3x wk which is basically like eod minus 1 shot every 14 days. When I was on trt I’d do 250-350iu mwf.

Indications for the use of human chorionic gonadotropic hormone for the management of infertility in hypogonadal men

 

[IncorrectName]

250iu/eod resulted in only a 7% drop in ITT (intra-testicular testosterone) levels, 500iu/eod resulted in an ITT increase of 26%. Now this really isn’t important since you’re not on trt, I’d do 250/3x wk which is basically like eod minus 1 shot every 14 days. When I was on trt I’d do 250-350iu mwf.

Indications for the use of human chorionic gonadotropic hormone for the management of infertility in hypogonadal men

So thus far:

Hcg 250iu 3x/week for 3-4 weeks. Maybe a higher dose if needed.

Then PCT no more than 14 days after
Clomid 50/50/25/25
Nolvadex 40/40/40/20/20/20

How does it look?

 

[The Terminator]

So thus far:

Hcg 250iu 3x/week for 3-4 weeks. Maybe a higher dose if needed.

Then PCT no more than 14 days after
Clomid 50/50/25/25
Nolvadex 40/40/40/20/20/20

How does it look?

I’m assuming you’re gonna do the hCG after your last T shot? If so I might go a bit higher but you can try that dose and see if it works. Also I’d wait at least 3 weeks from your last shot of T before starting the serms and the hCG during that time.

 

[IncorrectName]

I’m assuming you’re gonna do the hCG after your last T shot? If so I might go a bit higher but you can try that dose and see if it works. Also I’d wait at least 3 weeks from your last shot of T before starting the serms and the hCG during that time.

Towards the end of the cycle. My girlfriend freaked out about the gear and wants me to end it now. Isn't the recommended time after the last injection around 2 weeks for sustanon? And also, shouldn't hcg be used before the serms?

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Towards the end of the cycle. My girlfriend freaked out about the gear and wants me to end it now. Isn't the recommended time after the last injection around 2 weeks for sustanon? And also, shouldn't hcg be used before the serms?

Sust has a massively long ester in it....

3-4 weeks before starting HCG, can slightly overlap HCG and SERMs.

 

[IncorrectName]

Sust has a massively long ester in it....

3-4 weeks before starting HCG, can slightly overlap HCG and SERMs.

The long ester I got.

Maybe it's because English isn't my native language, would you mind elaborating about slightly overlapping hcg and serm? Shouldn't I run hcg before the serms?

 

[The Terminator]

Towards the end of the cycle. My girlfriend freaked out about the gear and wants me to end it now. Isn't the recommended time after the last injection around 2 weeks for sustanon? And also, shouldn't hcg be used before the serms?

That 14 day rule is out of date, and the hCG can be used in the 3ish weeks you’re waiting for the steroids to clear.

 

[IncorrectName]

Think I got it covered now. Thanks guys.