[PharmGrade]-[Compounded Test-Cyp]-[Blood work]

[zombie]

The following is blood work i had done while on compounded testosterone cypionate from a pharmacy, i have a script.

Taken at 6 weeks on

Bloods were drawn on Thursday, 05-07-2015 25 hours post injection
200 mg x 3 = 600 mg weekly(Monday/Wednesday/Friday)
HCG 500 iu x 2 = 1000 iu weekly same time as Test injection(Mon/Fri)
Arimidex 1/2 mg 3 x weekly(Monday/Wednesday/Friday) Arimidex was research chem

Total Testosterone 3879 ng/dl
Estradiol 22 pg/ml
This would be 6.46x for blood levels

I was expecting higher.
After seeing the total blood levels compared to total injected testosterone weekly i changed my injection schedule to twice weekly.

Taken at 10 weeks on
Bloods were drawn on Friday, 06-05-2015 27 hours post injection
300 mg x 2 = 600 mg weekly(sunday night/thursday morning)
HCG 500 iu x 2 = 1000 iu weekly same time as Test injection
Arimidex 1/2 mg 3 x weekly. Note on week bloods were drawn i missed one dose of Arimidex, without missed dose i figure my E2 Would have been in the low 30’s Arimidex was a research chem


Total Testosterone 5301 ng/dl
Estradiol 52 pg/dl
This would 8.8X blood levels

I find the drastic difference between the different injection frequency really interesting. A 1400 point difference is substantial for the same total amount of testosterone. Injecting weekly i probably would have hit the 10X blood levels.

The 7-10X rule seems to get a lot of controversy, i myself am not a firm believer in it. I do think most people fall into that range though but everybody is different. Most people i know don't inject once a week. Hopefully more people on PharmGrade can post their blood work and their injection schedules to help everyone get a better picture of blood levels.

 

[zombie]

Here is some old blood work but its the only other blood work i have 24 hours post injection.

The following blood work I was on compounded Testosterone Cypionate labeled 210 mg/ml. My injection schedule was 105 mg (1/2 ml) every 5th day for a total of 147 mg per week.

Blood work was taken 24 hours post injection on 04/03/2013.
HCG 500 iu x 2 = 1000 iu weekly
No arimidex at the time

Total Testosterone 1441 ng/dl
Estradiol 47 pg/dl
This would 9.8X dosage for blood levels

Note on compounded testosterone: Compounding pharmacies are not supposed to compound anything that is commercially available currently, hence the 210 mg/ml concentration. I’ve used compounded test that has had zinc added to it get around this FDA regulation.

 

[insertnamehere]

Thanks for posting @zombie

 

[super8]

Very useful thread, thank you. I always figured the dosage schedule made a substantial difference. The mg dosage of the last shot before blood work is just as important as the total weekly levels. I would be very curious to see what your bloods would look like with a single 600mg pin ~25ish hours before bloodwork.

 

[zombie]

Very useful thread, thank you. I always figured the dosage schedule made a substantial difference. The mg dosage of the last shot before blood work is just as important as the total weekly levels. I would be very curious to see what your bloods would look like with a single 600mg pin ~25ish hours before bloodwork.

I suspect that with one weekly pin 24 hrs post injection i'd be close to the 10x blood level. I wouldn't mind staying on another few weeks to find out but i'm running low on test. I'm prescribed 400 mg weekly ( I usually run 150-200) so it takes me a while to stash a bit to run at 600.

Right now i am dropping down to 200 mg per week for the next 8 weeks. I'll pin weekly and run a blood test at the end of the 8 weeks and see what kind of blood levels i reach. I don't like pinning weekly, day 6 and 7 i usually feel pretty low on energy. But there's nothing like experimenting on oneself in the name of science.

 

[roastdawg]

Yeah using the website steroidplot you can get an idea of peak levels vs injection frequency. At three times a week I'd expect about 7x from using the numbers from the plot. So you're six and a half is pretty close. Thanks for posting these.

 

[T_L]

I suspect that with one weekly pin 24 hrs post injection i'd be close to the 10x blood level. I wouldn't mind staying on another few weeks to find out but i'm running low on test. I'm prescribed 400 mg weekly ( I usually run 150-200) so it takes me a while to stash a bit to run at 600.

Right now i am dropping down to 200 mg per week for the next 8 weeks. I'll pin weekly and run a blood test at the end of the 8 weeks and see what kind of blood levels i reach. I don't like pinning weekly, day 6 and 7 i usually feel pretty low on energy. But there's nothing like experimenting on oneself in the name of science.

400mg weekly, which country are you from? I'm struggling to get more than 250mg every 2 weeks and I'm right at the bottom of the reference range. I envy you guys with understanding and clued up docs!

 

[lightspan]

Great thread, thanks for posting these.

 

[spj]

Great post. I been doing alot of thinking about this very thing the last few weeks. It's too bad all.the ugls that have been slammed on being bunk and underdosed when the levels have been just as high or higher than pharma grade. n I appreciate what u r doing for the community, because u would be alot better off just keeping your levels stable with more frequent injections. Thanx for the info it sheds alot of light.

 

[zombie]

400mg weekly, which country are you from? I'm struggling to get more than 250mg every 2 weeks and I'm right at the bottom of the reference range. I envy you guys with understanding and clued up docs!

I definitely don’t have a clued up doc, I use a longevity clinic. General practitioners usually don’t know much about low testosterone. 250 mg every 2 weeks is terrible, 125 mg once a week would be a lot better. The problem with longevity clinics is that you are paying for everything out of pocket. Finding a good one will take some time. I’ve gone through three clinics so far. A lot of them are pretty scammy. My last clinic kept raising prices as they built up their clientele. Just like a UGL you got to do your homework and find a decent one. Most will prescribe at 200 mg test cyp a week. There are a few gems out there that are a little more liberal with dosages, probably a better guarded secret than most people’s private sources. Nobody wants to lose their golden goose. Financially if you can afford to go out of pocket and not through insurance most clinics are better than most general practitioners. Start setting up appointments in your area with places that have free consultations. The places that charge just to talk to them to see if you meet their criteria aren’t very competitive pricing wise and there is no guarantee that you will be accepted. If there is nowhere good in your area look for longevity clinics online in Florida.

The way most online clinics work is you send in blood work, a health questionnaire, waivers about not being a professional athlete and various other forms. There is usually a phone or video conference with a doctor and a consultant. There is something in Florida’s law that let these places get around face to face appointments. I am actually planning a vacation and doctor appointment to Florida now once a year to keep everything on the up and up, just in case things change. Most places seem to be setting up a network of doctor so you can have a face to face in your own state or nearby If your doctor is not on board with how you feel and what your needs are get a new one. It takes a bit of work but in the end it’s your health and safety.

Just like UGL’s I’m always contacting a new clinic just in case my current one decides to keep raising prices. My last place raised the price of 10 ml’s of test to $180. HCG went up to $170 for 10,000 iu’s. When shit like that happens it time to find a better place.

For me the hope is with Millard's testing UGL's I can ultimately self-trt from a UGL.

 

[zombie]

So after reading the interest in seeing where i would test out on 600 mg with a once a week pin and checking on how much test-cyp I have left I've decided to run 600 for another 4-6 weeks and re-test. Honestly i keep a bit set aside just in case finances get tight or some other unforeseen problem arises.Worse comes to worse i got a few bottles of Androgel (which I've never used before) set aside that i can run for awhile. I'm pretty sure I'll be close to 10x. Last Sunday i dropped down to 200 mg but after a few weeks i don't think that will affect the total blood level much if at all.

 

[T_L]

I definitely don’t have a clued up doc, I use a longevity clinic. General practitioners usually don’t know much about low testosterone. 250 mg every 2 weeks is terrible, 125 mg once a week would be a lot better. The problem with longevity clinics is that you are paying for everything out of pocket. Finding a good one will take some time. I’ve gone through three clinics so far. A lot of them are pretty scammy. My last clinic kept raising prices as they built up their clientele. Just like a UGL you got to do your homework and find a decent one. Most will prescribe at 200 mg test cyp a week. There are a few gems out there that are a little more liberal with dosages, probably a better guarded secret than most people’s private sources. Nobody wants to lose their golden goose. Financially if you can afford to go out of pocket and not through insurance most clinics are better than most general practitioners. Start setting up appointments in your area with places that have free consultations. The places that charge just to talk to them to see if you meet their criteria aren’t very competitive pricing wise and there is no guarantee that you will be accepted. If there is nowhere good in your area look for longevity clinics online in Florida.

The way most online clinics work is you send in blood work, a health questionnaire, waivers about not being a professional athlete and various other forms. There is usually a phone or video conference with a doctor and a consultant. There is something in Florida’s law that let these places get around face to face appointments. I am actually planning a vacation and doctor appointment to Florida now once a year to keep everything on the up and up, just in case things change. Most places seem to be setting up a network of doctor so you can have a face to face in your own state or nearby If your doctor is not on board with how you feel and what your needs are get a new one. It takes a bit of work but in the end it’s your health and safety.

Just like UGL’s I’m always contacting a new clinic just in case my current one decides to keep raising prices. My last place raised the price of 10 ml’s of test to $180. HCG went up to $170 for 10,000 iu’s. When shit like that happens it time to find a better place.

For me the hope is with Millard's testing UGL's I can ultimately self-trt from a UGL.

Thanks for the detailed reply....... Unfortunately though, I'm in the UK

I'm sure a lot of others can benefit from that info though! We are so far behind in the UK when it comes to all this. I'm seeing a specialist on friday, so I'll see then what my new dosage will be.

 

[rpbb]

Great post. I been doing alot of thinking about this very thing the last few weeks. It's too bad all.the ugls that have been slammed on being bunk and underdosed when the levels have been just as high or higher than pharma grade. n I appreciate what u r doing for the community, because u would be alot better off just keeping your levels stable with more frequent injections. Thanx for the info it sheds alot of light.

I haven't believed in the X10 rule in a long time. Way too much evidence to the contrary.

 

[zombie]

Thanks for the detailed reply....... Unfortunately though, I'm in the UK

I'm sure a lot of others can benefit from that info though! We are so far behind in the UK when it comes to all this. I'm seeing a specialist on friday, so I'll see then what my new dosage will be.

Good luck to you. Most of what i've read on the forums about trt in the uk didn't seem positive at all. I'm actually surprised they have you on 250 mg. Read about a lot of guy being on 150 - 200 every 2 weeks.

 

[T_L]

Good luck to you. Most of what i've read on the forums about trt in the uk didn't seem positive at all. I'm actually surprised they have you on 250 mg. Read about a lot of guy being on 150 - 200 every 2 weeks.

Thanks. It seems very dependent on the area you live, or how lucky you get with a knowledgeable doc. I'm actually on 1000mg undecanoate at the moment, every 10 weeks, but I'm below range after just 4 weeks. This is why I want to switch back to Sust or try Enanthate.

Anyway, sorry for the thread hijack! Good job on what you're doing!

 

[zombie]

I haven't believed in the X10 rule in a long time. Way too much evidence to the contrary.

I'm not much of a believer on the 7-10x rule either. I think a decent amount of people fall into that category but many do not. I actually read a study the other day that show older men had a lower testosterone clearance rate than younger men. I'll see if i can find the study again and post a link. It would definitely explain why Dr. Scally has seen more people in the 7-10X range, as i would assume his average client is older. The study showed that younger men clear testosterone at a much faster rate than older men. It was a pretty interesting read. So many factor come into play age, weight, body type etc. I suspect that guys that have a lot of intramuscular fat have a slower absorption rate and lesser of a peak. Part of the reason why I did this was just to see how injection frequency affected peak levels. Part of the problem is who actually pins once a week. I know some do but most pin 2x or more depending on the ester.

Anyhow I'm enjoying the experiment. I'll see if my clinic will prescribe test-prop this next round just to add to the data. Once summer is over and things cool down, experimenting will be over; I've been sitting on some pellet tren for a couple of months now. Summer is not a good time for me, even with AC i'm hot and irritated all the time. As much as i want to do my first tren run i can't imagine i'd react well in the summer time.

 

[zombie]

Thanks. It seems very dependent on the area you live, or how lucky you get with a knowledgeable doc. I'm actually on 1000mg undecanoate at the moment, every 10 weeks, but I'm below range after just 4 weeks. This is why I want to switch back to Sust or try Enanthate.

Anyway, sorry for the thread hijack! Good job on what you're doing!

What hijack? It's all related to what the community needs to know. If it's helpful to someone, all conversation is encouraged. I don't think i'd like Test-Undecanoate, i look forward to pinning. What were your peak levels on T-U?

 

[T_L]

What hijack? It's all related to what the community needs to know. If it's helpful to someone, all conversation is encouraged. I don't think i'd like Test-Undecanoate, i look forward to pinning. What were your peak levels on T-U?

I never had a peak test actually, just a few tests at the 4 week mark. I was at 12nmol and 13nmol (346 & 374ng/dl) both times 4 weeks after 1000mg. oestradiol was 112pmol (90-190) with no AI so I'm not sure why it's so low.

Undecanoate is meant to build up over time, but I've seen plenty of results over the reference ranges taken at the same time as mine. Occasionally you do see people that really struggle with it though. It's as if some people can't absorb or break down the ester.

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/consistently-low-test-results.134366109/

Have a look at that thread if you get some time, hopefully explains my situation a bit better.

 

[grey]

Getting my own test for this same thing today. Will see how my results compare to yours. I am on a lower dose but should be intriguing.

 

[Wunderpus]

Thanks Zombie! Nice post.