pro hormone question

[Millard]

Actually the whole reason the DASCA was done was because BSN, ON, and some other suplement companies were upset this stuff was getting sold and took away from there profits. They got together and sponsored the bill.

I don't recall seeing anything to indicate that BSN or ON openly supported DASCA in any way.

I know dietary supplement lobbying groups like CRN and UNPA aggressively supported and pushed DASCA. But they hate the sports nutrition segment because its decade-long blatant disregard for DSHEA threatens the $30 billion mainstream supplement industry.

They had no problem throwing bodybuilding supplement companies under the bus to preserve DSHEA. And who can blame them? Bodybuilding supplement companies deserved it.

 

[Millard]

im also willing to bet that maybe...just maybe prohoromones having stronger or equal effects to already illegal substances and being readily sold everywhere might have had something to do with the bill as well

Yes, the "prohormones" and other synthetic steroidal products sold as dietary supplement were really just another word for "steroids". They had many of the same of muscle-building effects and side effects as traditional steroids.

But I've yet to see any convincing evidence of their superiority to traditional anabolic steroids. Sure, some had short-lived special use cases to avoid detection in drug-tested events e.g. methytrienolone, THG, etc. And others were known for their potency e.g. DMZ, superdrol, etc. Nonetheless, all things being equal, there was no reason to prefer to less-researched prohormones over traditional AAS.

Of course, those associated with the supplement companies who sold tens of millions of dollars in prohormones over the past several years, there were a lot of financial incentives to hype and misrepresent the benefits and superiority of prohormones.

Retail stores often convinced consumers that (1) synthetic steroids were just "prohormones", (2) synthetic steroids were legal and DSHEA-compliant; (3) synthetic steroids were not really the same as anabolic steroids; (4) synthetic steroids lacked the side effects of traditional steroids; (5) synthetic steroids were safe (or safer than traditional steroids); and/or (6) synthetic steroids were suitable for teenagers.

By no means was everyone guilty of this. There was a lot of honest, objective and informative discussions about the prohormones/synthetic steroid category. But the discussions were often corrupted by the masses who tended to parrot the talking points and sales sheets promoted by supplement company reps.

 

[insertnamehere]

there is no budget for scientists to randomly conduct studies with pro hormones lol...however many many cycle reviews you can find on many reputable bodybuilding websites have pics of bloods....no ones gonna go out of their way to scientifically prove shit to you, if you think hundreds of posts of gains from prohormones are somehow fake than thats you, and its then obvious you are biased against them.

The whole reason the government signed in the Prohormone Act of 2014 was because everyone was aware they were legitimate steroids being sold legally. read up

If by "reputable bodybuilding websites" you're referring to elitefitness, you must be joking or delusional. Does elitefitness even have any real members? That board is filled with reps, pimps, and infinite mod/administration alters all pushing products.

 

[antipcman]

there is no budget for scientists to randomly conduct studies with pro hormones lol...however many many cycle reviews you can find on many reputable bodybuilding websites have pics of bloods....no ones gonna go out of their way to scientifically prove shit to you, if you think hundreds of posts of gains from prohormones are somehow fake than thats you, and its then obvious you are biased against them.

The whole reason the government signed in the Prohormone Act of 2014 was because everyone was aware they were legitimate steroids being sold legally. read up

It's obvious that you have no regard for apostrophes and differentiation between than/then. However, you name all of these "reputable" bodybuilding sites and their "objectivity." I was once part of several communities so I'm very familiar with how it works. Because I know how it works, there's one site that I trust: this one.


Most of the logs you speak of that are so much more reputable than peer reviewed data are logs using PH's from that site's sponsors. Many times the sponsor gives a kickback to the site itself. That's in case you did not know that. So [insert snake oil supplement here] pays [insert elitephysique's "reputable" bodybuilding site here] to run logs of their gear and somebody gains this 15 pounds of LBM just by taking this supplement. There's been no change of diet, no incorporation of other anabolic compounds, and this person is gaining 15 pounds of LBM. I'm not sure the concept of LBM is one you're very familiar with.

The men here at Meso are very familiar with how the conflict of interest works. If I had to guess, I'd say that 95% of the logs you speak of, have this conflict of interest. The only link you've provided included somebody who was taking test with their PH. I do agree that some PHs do work. I think most of us do. However, the lack of longitudinal peer reviewed studies makes one worry. You claim that "no company has enough budget to prove their claims medically." You may be correct. But shouldn't that concern me? Shouldn't that concern me that XYZ company does not find my liver or dick important enough to perform real studies? The men who've been dominating you in this thread, and probably many folks on Meso, would disagree with your assertions. Of the 5% of prohormones that do work, many are extremely toxic. Many would be hard-pressed to find any with a risk:reward worthy of our consumption. If I'm going to take chances with my liver, I'm doing Halo, ADrol, or Dbol, not some horsecrap that a "reputable" bodybuilding website is peddling. I most certainly am not taking "logs" from some shill as the end all be all. I bet you that a simple browse will show you some medical journals discussing the hepatoxicity of prohormones. However, I don't need to debate you because most people here no how inaccurate your statements are. But maybe I'll be bored and show you; who knows? But if you want to trust that "objective, reputable" bodybuilding site with your dick and liver, by all means, have at it bro.

 

[Leprechaun]

The bill was drafted because pro hormones allowed individuals to legally acquire steroids without prescriptions which ate in to the profits of the organizations that lobbied for the bill.

It had nothing or very little to do with the potency, side effects, or benefits of the products.

That's my opinion.

 

[jaymaximus]

I don't recall seeing anything to indicate that BSN or ON openly supported DASCA in any way.

I know dietary supplement lobbying groups like CRN and UNPA aggressively supported and pushed DASCA. But they hate the sports nutrition segment because its decade-long blatant disregard for DSHEA threatens the $30 billion mainstream supplement industry.

They had no problem throwing bodybuilding supplement companies under the bus to preserve DSHEA. And who can blame them? Bodybuilding supplement companies deserved it.

Ill have to check. I couldve sworn I read somewhere that some of the companies put some money into the whole thing, but I could be mistaken*.

*Chances are if Im wrong i wont admit it though

 

[Damnham]

Ive been doing a lot of reading about aas but it seems the risk of just trying to purchase out weighs everything so im considering trying pro hormones my question is are they still the same as years ago (no where near as effective as real gear and with way worse sides) or have they improved at all thanks.

Check out bigdansfittness.com best prohormones available.

 

[jaymaximus]

Heres a link i found. I cant find the old one and truthfully I dont know how reliable it is. But it tells how the DASCA was "supported" by multiple listed nutrition companies.

Designer Anabolic Steroid Control Act 2014 - Prohormone Podcast

 

[Millard]

Heres a link i found. I cant find the old one and truthfully I dont know how reliable it is. But it tells how the DASCA was "supported" by multiple listed nutrition companies.

Designer Anabolic Steroid Control Act 2014 - Prohormone Podcast

Thanks for this!

One additional thing of note is that the Supplement Industry Associations supporting this bill are composed of many of your favorite supplement companies. You could write these companies or just stop supporting them if you disagree with their support of this bill. Keep in mind they are large companies and probably don’t what a group of prohormone users think.

Notable companies include:

• NOW Foods
• Chemi Nutra (phosphatidic acid)
• Country life vitamins
• Gencor (testofen/fenugreek)
• Optimum Nutrition
• The Vitamine Shoppe
• EAS

Big ones that don’t care about you (but would probably sell complete crap to your mother):

• Avon
• Amway
• Bausch and Lomb
• One a Day
• Car gill
• Herbalife
• Novartis
• Pfizer
• Proctor and Gamble

 

[ergomaniac]

That's correct and it's also why I don't take any oral whatsoever. Perhaps people with healthy livers and who don't already have a pre-existing condition can get away with orals but my body let's me know right away when something is toxic.

so how does it let you know? and right away. wow.
alcohol is also liver "toxic", but it usually gives me a buzz .
liver stress not being liver damage, id say the hepatotoxicity of orals steroids may be exaggerated in some cases. especially if youre taking too large a dose of "prohormones".

my biggest concern with oral steroids, which I rarely see mentioned, is negative shift in lipid profiles. not looking for cvd or heart attacks. but that's just me.

 

[DedLift]

so how does it let you know? and right away. wow.
alcohol is also liver "toxic", but it usually gives me a buzz .
liver stress not being liver damage, id say the hepatotoxicity of orals steroids may be exaggerated in some cases. especially if youre taking too large a dose of "prohormones".

my biggest concern with oral steroids, which I rarely see mentioned, is negative shift in lipid profiles. not looking for cvd or heart attacks. but that's just me.

I have a previous liver condition. I don't drink and try not to take anything hepatoxic. I tried a 20mg dbol because I wanted to kick start a cycle with it and stopped after the very first pill because I got sharp, shooting pains in that area within a half hour. For most healthy people this isn't a problem especially if they're taking liver support but my body tends to let me know right away. It sucks because I have a stash of dbols that I can't use. Hopefully, my issue will get taken care of soon. It is curable in a sense but the cost is staggering and insurance companies are...less than caring or honest

 

[warlordishere]

I don't know why you put pro hormones 90% of the so called pro hormones on the market are designer steroids or old steroids what never gained traction here in the USA. Shit dymethazine and superdrol has been around since the 60s. Dymethazine was used in multiple countries in the 60s and 70s in the medical field.