[PURPLE PANDA LABS] [TESTOSTERONE ENANTHATE RAWS] - [BLOODWORK] - [06/14/2017]

[XmadXscientist]

Okay, I want to be the first human with a TT of 100,000 recorded... I'll shoot 10,000mg's and let you guys know how it goes

Beast mode. I wonder if you will turn into the hulk?

 

[Wunderpus]

Beast mode. I wonder if you will turn into the hulk?

I'd never actually try it... I mean, I would, what am I saying...? But, the most test I've injected in a week, I think, was 2500mg's.... Honestly, not worth it. Constantly fucking with your E2 and shit is a nightmare.

 

[Dr JIM]

Yes see above but also like you stated there is a point of diminishing return and that's all in case with the individual.

mands

Agreed @mands

The benefits of TT, like ANY DRUG, become limited and adverse effects begin to predominate the clinical picture at very high dosages.

The optimal anabolic dose of TT is largely unknown but IME the adverse effects become problematic once the dose exceeds roughly 1gm / week.

That's not to posit there's no benefit at higher dosages bc there probably is, but compound whatever benefit there may be with the multitude of side effects at such high dosages and
the risks will OVERTLY exceed the benefit IMO.

 

[Dr JIM]

By and large it is going to be sliding scale. This only went to 600mg/week but the results were predictable to that point...

Bhasin S, Woodhouse L, Casaburi R, Singh AB, Bhasin D, Berman N, Chen X, Yarasheski KE, Magliano L, Dzekov C, Dzekov J, Bross R, Phillips J, Sinha-Hikim I, Shen R, Storer TW. Testosterone dose-response relationships in healthy young men. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2001 Dec;281(6):E1172-81.

FYI
This study like most "TT dose/response" citations, cites mean nadir rather than peak levels, and depending upon the testing specifics, the latter generally approximate twice that of mean values.

 

[ChestRockwell]

FYI
This study like most "TT dose/response" citations, cites mean nadir rather than peak levels, and depending upon the testing specifics, the latter generally approximate twice that of mean values.

I'm fully aware, however the point was to illustrate dose response curve as opposed to peak levels, as can be seen by the post I quoted.

 

[Marcus]

Yes see above but also like you stated there is a point of diminishing return and that's all in case with the individual.

mands

I was under the impression that yes, there is a point of diminishing returns in terms of what can be achieved on higher doses of testosterone. However, I thought there was a direct linear correlation between dosage and serum blood levels?

Maybe I'm not understanding. Set me straight

 

[mands]

I was under the impression that yes, there is a point of diminishing returns in terms of what can be achieved on higher doses of testosterone. However, I thought there was a direct linear correlation between dosage and serum blood levels?

Maybe I'm not understanding. Set me straight

There is to a point. As you can see in the study the linear correlation up to 600mg.

In my experience as the dosages increase this linear correlation decreases in comparison if that makes sense.

mands

 

[Marcus]

There is to a point. As you can see in the study the linear correlation up to 600mg.

In my experience as the dosages increase this linear correlation decreases in comparison if that makes sense.

mands

That's what I've found subjectively as well... but for some reason I thought I read otherwise elsewhere.

 

[penche]

I'd never actually try it... I mean, I would, what am I saying...? But, the most test I've injected in a week, I think, was 2500mg's.... Honestly, not worth it. Constantly fucking with your E2 and shit is a nightmare.

2.5g yea that's a big number . That's bout the time ya switch from adex to letro maybe lol? I've done 1.5g and used letro 3x a week along with adex. Dam that letro hurts the bones like no other though.

 

[ChestRockwell]

Just a friendly reminder that using estrogen suppression techniques on a growth phase, in particular, is not wise as it relates to hypertrophy potential...among other things.

Fun fact - the GH/IGF axis is largely stimulated by aromatase derived estrogen. Thought exercise - does it make sense to purposefully suppress your GH/IGF axis during a growth phase?

 

[Dw725]

Just a friendly reminder that using estrogen suppression techniques on a growth phase, in particular, is not wise as it relates to hypertrophy potential...among other things.

Fun fact - the GH/IGF axis is largely stimulated by aromatase derived estrogen. Thought exercise - does it make sense to purposefully suppress your GH/IGF axis during a growth phase?

I'm very much late to the party @ChestRockwell ,
But do you recommend letting aromatization take it's natural course, rather than keeping it within typical reference ranges? During growth phase, as you stated, of course.

Or are you only referring to OVERLY suppressing estrogen as being counterproductive?

 

[ChestRockwell]

I'm very much late to the party @ChestRockwell ,
But do you recommend letting aromatization take it's natural course, rather than keeping it within typical reference ranges? During growth phase, as you stated, of course.

Or are you only referring to OVERLY suppressing estrogen as being counterproductive?

Correct, I much prefer trying to control estrogen via proper stack design as well as how one introduces compound doses into their body.

We must remember, that as males, we require aromatization to stimulate GH secretion and this effect is solely via estrogen derived from this process. In other words, GH secretion is not stimulated by systemic estradiol levels.

Fun fact, non-aromatizing compounds do not stimulate GH secretion.

 

[redbull3906]

Those levels look within range for that dose to me. I'd say that you'd need to run for a solid month before even reaching a saturation point to go by.

 

[PIZZABOY]

Correct, I much prefer trying to control estrogen via proper stack design as well as how one introduces compound doses into their body.

We must remember, that as males, we require aromatization to stimulate GH secretion and this effect is solely via estrogen derived from this process. In other words, GH secretion is not stimulated by systemic estradiol levels.

Fun fact, non-aromatizing compounds do not stimulate GH secretion.

Control that estradiol at end of cycle, when test levels are starting to drop. Its the ratio that causes problems. High E2 is fine with high test. Test levels go down, then get that e2 down. Moniyor it, dont let it get to high, but many worry about it too much