Retatrutide: Transitioning from Cut to Reverse & Bulk

[Necessary Evil]

Hey Fellas,

I’m currently in the home stretch (last 3-4 weeks) of a 6-month cut. This has been a long road back after a traumatic shoulder injury sidelined me for 1.5 years.

I’ve been utilizing Retatrutide during the tail end of this phase. I started at 2mg/week and have titrated up to the current dose of 6mg/week. For the final push, I’m considering bumping the dose to 9mg/week.

Once the cut is wrapped up, I plan to transition into a reverse diet. The goal is to taper the Reta as calories move up and hunger becomes more manageable. Post-reverse, I’m considering keeping a low "maintenance" dose of Reta on board to help with insulin sensitivity during the blast/bulk.

Current Stack:

• Test E: 350mg/week
• Primo E: 350mg/week
• NPP: 150mg/week
• HGH: 6 IU/day

My Questions:

1. Late-Stage Titration: Do you think bumping to 9mg for the final 3-4 weeks is worth the diminishing returns, or should I hold steady at 6mg to avoid unnecessary side effects right before the transition?
2. The Taper: During the reverse diet, what’s a logical reduction protocol per week? I want to avoid a massive hunger rebound while my metabolism stabilizes.
3. Off-Season Utility: For those using GLP-1/GIP/GCG agonists during a growth phase, what dose have you found optimal for maintaining insulin sensitivity without nuking the appetite needed to grow?

Looking forward to your insights.

 

[Psychokoak]

Hi man.

For me you don't need to increase to 9mg if 6mg suits you enough. Unless you're looking to make another dip in your calorie deficit.

For your reverse, I advise you to keep the last dose of retatrutide as long as possible. This will be the last parameter to decrease when you have the calories up.
Because the exit from deficits is hell for some. Even with a surplus you can be even hungrier than in deficit. The body asks to eat as the food is there !
In my case I like to increase by 5% every 10 days and I adjust according to weight variations. And I fight hunger more than in deficit for about 4-6 weeks.
After such a long deficit you need to re-evaluate your calorie maintenance. That's your next and first goal before think protocol. You shouldn't touch more than one lever at a time if you want to avoid problems.

In Off bulk I keep a dose of 2mg of tirzepatide or 4mg of reta for 2900-3300kcal. It helps me with hunger management and seems put my blood glucose in place with 10ui of HGH.
But we're all different. Hence the idea of reducing the reta withdrawal at the end of your reverse diet and maybe a little after the beginning of your Off-Season. To see how each dose affects your blood glucose.

 

[strixsir]

you DONT need to reverse diet while on GLP1,

its done to prevent rapid weight regain and the theoretical ramping up of metabolic rate (which is a function of energy availability) but all that is taken care of via Reta,

lower the Reta dose to half without any titration and UP your calories, a week is all it takes that your functions will be upregulated again,

Agree with taking low dose Reta for insulin sensitivity, I plan on doing exactly that.

 

[RockyP]

I spent the month of January trying to reverse diet out of a long cut myself. Similar cycle. 6 Mg of Reta. Increased my calories by 800 per day. And I ended up losing another 4 lbs. feed that Reta. If for whatever reason you want to gain weight you could try lowering the Reta a little bit. I’m finally maintaining at 4200 cals at 225 lbs which is a lot of food for me at that weight. That was my intended plan so that for the next cut I can just drop to 3700 cals, which is a breeze, and not change any output. I see reverse dieting less as driving scale weight up and more about getting your metabolism revving and dealing with more food, preferably while NOT blowing up on the scale.

 

[Necessary Evil]

Hi man.

For me you don't need to increase to 9mg if 6mg suits you enough. Unless you're looking to make another dip in your calorie deficit.

For your reverse, I advise you to keep the last dose of retatrutide as long as possible. This will be the last parameter to decrease when you have the calories up.
Because the exit from deficits is hell for some. Even with a surplus you can be even hungrier than in deficit. The body asks to eat as the food is there !
In my case I like to increase by 5% every 10 days and I adjust according to weight variations. And I fight hunger more than in deficit for about 4-6 weeks.
After such a long deficit you need to re-evaluate your calorie maintenance. That's your next and first goal before think protocol. You shouldn't touch more than one lever at a time if you want to avoid problems.

In Off bulk I keep a dose of 2mg of tirzepatide or 4mg of reta for 2900-3300kcal. It helps me with hunger management and seems put my blood glucose in place with 10ui of HGH.
But we're all different. Hence the idea of reducing the reta withdrawal at the end of your reverse diet and maybe a little after the beginning of your Off-Season. To see how each dose affects your blood glucose.

Thank you for the answer.

Definitely there is no way I'm further decreasing my calories, I'm starting to get all the negative side effects of a caloric deficit; extreme exhaustion fatigue, low libido etc.

I will keep it at 6mg as you suggested. Truth be told the increase to 6mg was done about 2 weeks ago and as such it shouldn't have reached peak blood serum levels as of yet.

I still get food noise, but I can work around it.

As far as your point about the reverse, you are suggesting to not only titrate down but to slowly increase based on biofeedback (hunger etc) right? I suspect I'm going to be exactly as you in terms of hunger. Even while on Reta I did some horrible binges some time ago (it was the reason why I increased the dose to 6mg).

In regards to caloric maintenance; I'm using Macrofactor which has a built-in expenditure tracker. I track everything on extreme detail (even vinegar or even when I binge), and I'm confident in the numbers I see. Only recently I have seen an extreme decrease in my TDEE. But yeah, adjustments will surely be made.

you DONT need to reverse diet while on GLP1,

its done to prevent rapid weight regain and the theoretical ramping up of metabolic rate (which is a function of energy availability) but all that is taken care of via Reta,

lower the Reta dose to half without any titration and UP your calories, a week is all it takes that your functions will be upregulated again,

Agree with taking low dose Reta for insulin sensitivity, I plan on doing exactly that.

So you think that if I do it's going to be counter productive? Have you tested it yourself?

What would you consider low dose Reta for bulking?

I spent the month of January trying to reverse diet out of a long cut myself. Similar cycle. 6 Mg of Reta. Increased my calories by 800 per day. And I ended up losing another 4 lbs. feed that Reta. If for whatever reason you want to gain weight you could try lowering the Reta a little bit. I’m finally maintaining at 4200 cals at 225 lbs which is a lot of food for me at that weight. That was my intended plan so that for the next cut I can just drop to 3700 cals, which is a breeze, and not change any output. I see reverse dieting less as driving scale weight up and more about getting your metabolism revving and dealing with more food, preferably while NOT blowing up on the scale.

Brother, we are exactly on the same boat. That's exactly what I'm aiming for.

As of now I'm dieting on 2300 Kcal (training days) and 1900 Kcal cardio/rest days and it's a torture; especially given the fact that my total protein is 240-270g which leads to limited food choices.

I definitely want to gain weight/clean bulk so you suggest as well to decrease the Reta as I'm reversing? If yes by how much? And for how long?

________

Lastly I would like to ask how all of you dose your Reta?

Up until two weeks ago I used to inject it 3 times per week. I recently read that less injections is better, especially for appetite suppression. And I'm now infecting two times per week. Every Monday morning and Friday Morning.

Again thanks for the replies!

 

[strixsir]

Thank you for the answer.

Definitely there is no way I'm further decreasing my calories, I'm starting to get all the negative side effects of a caloric deficit; extreme exhaustion fatigue, low libido etc.

I will keep it at 6mg as you suggested. Truth be told the increase to 6mg was done about 2 weeks ago and as such it shouldn't have reached peak blood serum levels as of yet.

I still get food noise, but I can work around it.

As far as your point about the reverse, you are suggesting to not only titrate down but to slowly increase based on biofeedback (hunger etc) right? I suspect I'm going to be exactly as you in terms of hunger. Even while on Reta I did some horrible binges some time ago (it was the reason why I increased the dose to 6mg).

In regards to caloric maintenance; I'm using Macrofactor which has a built-in expenditure tracker. I track everything on extreme detail (even vinegar or even when I binge), and I'm confident in the numbers I see. Only recently I have seen an extreme decrease in my TDEE. But yeah, adjustments will surely be made.

So you think that if I do it's going to be counter productive? Have you tested it yourself?

What would you consider low dose Reta for bulking?

Brother, we are exactly on the same boat. That's exactly what I'm aiming for.

As of now I'm dieting on 2300 Kcal (training days) and 1900 Kcal cardio/rest days and it's a torture; especially given the fact that my total protein is 240-270g which leads to limited food choices.

I definitely want to gain weight/clean bulk so you suggest as well to decrease the Reta as I'm reversing? If yes by how much? And for how long?

________

Lastly I would like to ask how all of you dose your Reta?

Up until two weeks ago I used to inject it 3 times per week. I recently read that less injections is better, especially for appetite suppression. And I'm now infecting two times per week. Every Monday morning and Friday Morning.

Again thanks for the replies!

anything that lets you eat atleast recomp calories is your least effective dose for reta,


the GIP agonism for reta is 9 times the natural endogenous response so nutritional partitioning is happening even at low dosages,

Glucagon agonism requires much higher dosages (it starts at 2mg weekly significantly) due to low affinity of reta for glucagon receptors,

i plan to take just 0.5 mg weekly for bulking/recomp at 150-200 cal surplus, for 6 months,

am worried how am i going to eat 2600-2800 calories, I could barely eat 1500 before food became "Meh" on 1.5 mg weekly

Btw, your protocol of pinning 3 times a week is not bad, i too pin twice a week of a dose that will Equivalent of 1.5 mg weekly,

we want to avoid concentration peaks and down troughs, there is lesser downregulation of receptor that way.

 

[RockyP]

Thank you for the answer.

Definitely there is no way I'm further decreasing my calories, I'm starting to get all the negative side effects of a caloric deficit; extreme exhaustion fatigue, low libido etc.

I will keep it at 6mg as you suggested. Truth be told the increase to 6mg was done about 2 weeks ago and as such it shouldn't have reached peak blood serum levels as of yet.

I still get food noise, but I can work around it.

As far as your point about the reverse, you are suggesting to not only titrate down but to slowly increase based on biofeedback (hunger etc) right? I suspect I'm going to be exactly as you in terms of hunger. Even while on Reta I did some horrible binges some time ago (it was the reason why I increased the dose to 6mg).

In regards to caloric maintenance; I'm using Macrofactor which has a built-in expenditure tracker. I track everything on extreme detail (even vinegar or even when I binge), and I'm confident in the numbers I see. Only recently I have seen an extreme decrease in my TDEE. But yeah, adjustments will surely be made.

So you think that if I do it's going to be counter productive? Have you tested it yourself?

What would you consider low dose Reta for bulking?

Brother, we are exactly on the same boat. That's exactly what I'm aiming for.

As of now I'm dieting on 2300 Kcal (training days) and 1900 Kcal cardio/rest days and it's a torture; especially given the fact that my total protein is 240-270g which leads to limited food choices.

I definitely want to gain weight/clean bulk so you suggest as well to decrease the Reta as I'm reversing? If yes by how much? And for how long?

________

Lastly I would like to ask how all of you dose your Reta?

Up until two weeks ago I used to inject it 3 times per week. I recently read that less injections is better, especially for appetite suppression. And I'm now infecting two times per week. Every Monday morning and Friday Morning.

Again thanks for the replies!

I’d prob lower it by 30% or so and see how that goes.

I pin twice per week. You could do once but it could invite some side effects like the GERD / dyspepsia.

Also in my post it’s a little misleading when I said reverse diet. What I really meant was I wanted to see just how much I could eat at this dosage of Reta (as I had been on it while Cutting) and not gain any fat mass. If I wanted to bulk up I’d definitely taper down slowly to a point where a manageable amount of food at my current activity level started moving the scale up a bit.

The only side effect I have that’s noticeable is increased resting heart rate. My response to exercise and heart rate while training is unchanged. But resting HR has increased quite a bit, by at least 12 bpm.

 

[Psychokoak]

Thank you for the answer.

Definitely there is no way I'm further decreasing my calories, I'm starting to get all the negative side effects of a caloric deficit; extreme exhaustion fatigue, low libido etc.

I will keep it at 6mg as you suggested. Truth be told the increase to 6mg was done about 2 weeks ago and as such it shouldn't have reached peak blood serum levels as of yet.

I still get food noise, but I can work around it.

As far as your point about the reverse, you are suggesting to not only titrate down but to slowly increase based on biofeedback (hunger etc) right? I suspect I'm going to be exactly as you in terms of hunger. Even while on Reta I did some horrible binges some time ago (it was the reason why I increased the dose to 6mg).

In regards to caloric maintenance; I'm using Macrofactor which has a built-in expenditure tracker. I track everything on extreme detail (even vinegar or even when I binge), and I'm confident in the numbers I see. Only recently I have seen an extreme decrease in my TDEE. But yeah, adjustments will surely be made.

So you think that if I do it's going to be counter productive? Have you tested it yourself?

What would you consider low dose Reta for bulking?

Brother, we are exactly on the same boat. That's exactly what I'm aiming for.

As of now I'm dieting on 2300 Kcal (training days) and 1900 Kcal cardio/rest days and it's a torture; especially given the fact that my total protein is 240-270g which leads to limited food choices.

I definitely want to gain weight/clean bulk so you suggest as well to decrease the Reta as I'm reversing? If yes by how much? And for how long?

________

Lastly I would like to ask how all of you dose your Reta?

Up until two weeks ago I used to inject it 3 times per week. I recently read that less injections is better, especially for appetite suppression. And I'm now infecting two times per week. Every Monday morning and Friday Morning.

Again thanks for the replies!

For me you don't have reduce the dose of reta during the reverse diet.

From my personal experience I have more hunger suppression with tirzepatide (and this one happens faster than with reta). Maybe if the reverse becomes too hard adding some tirzepatide during this period could help.
And only after once the diet is stable and the hunger too just gradually reduce the GLPs.

Linked to food noise... It's unfortunate mentally for 90% of the time. No product can really help.
It's an eating disorder (or related to the fear of withdrawal in general. Fear of lack of money or fear of lack of relationship etc. Lack of food in the end fits into this pattern and the mind thinks only of that).

And for the injections I prefer a full dose every 5 days than to do small doses regularly throughout the week.
And every 5 days because it's from there that I feel that hunger comes back quickly (or at least the feeling of being fully linked to the gastric slowing disappears)

 

[donkey1]

how can u eat, i did 2mg and legit struggled to get down 700 cal a day

 

[RoxasShadow]

how can u eat, i did 2mg and legit struggled to get down 700 cal a day

you adjust to the dose after few weeks

 

[Necessary Evil]

anything that lets you eat atleast recomp calories is your least effective dose for reta,


the GIP agonism for reta is 9 times the natural endogenous response so nutritional partitioning is happening even at low dosages,

Glucagon agonism requires much higher dosages (it starts at 2mg weekly significantly) due to low affinity of reta for glucagon receptors,

i plan to take just 0.5 mg weekly for bulking/recomp at 150-200 cal surplus, for 6 months,

am worried how am i going to eat 2600-2800 calories, I could barely eat 1500 before food became "Meh" on 1.5 mg weekly

Btw, your protocol of pinning 3 times a week is not bad, i too pin twice a week of a dose that will Equivalent of 1.5 mg weekly,

we want to avoid concentration peaks and down troughs, there is lesser downregulation of receptor that way.

Do you think that such a low dosage is going to keep you at bay when bulking and not overconsuming calories?

I say this because you are supposed to increase the dosage as you go since you get used to it.

Or you are thinking to have it at such a dose for the other health benefits, if yes, again, will 0.5mg/week suffice?

 

[strixsir]

Do you think that such a low dosage is going to keep you at bay when bulking and not overconsuming calories?

I say this because you are supposed to increase the dosage as you go since you get used to it.

Or you are thinking to have it at such a dose for the other health benefits, if yes, again, will 0.5mg/week suffice?

yes, 0.5 mg weekly suffices for me atleast,
when bulking, i already feel relatively full and only the eating of hyperpalatable food causes issues with excessive consumption, i eat Clean during bulks to keep calories precise,
adding just 0.5 weekly reta does put my food thoughts in limit without giving "Fulll" feeling on higher dosages.


its not that you get "used to it" but receptor downregulation of receptors, this can be mitigated to some degree via avoiding concentration peaks via splitting your dosages,

You just quit your Reta for mere 30 days (5 half lives) and your receptor will be re-sensitized as receptor cycling is happening 24/7, you Dont get the "HIT" from these drugs again but they work indefinitely

At the GLP-1 receptor, tirzepatide behaves as a biased agonist that favors cAMP generation (involved in insulin secretion) over beta -arrestin recruitment, Meaning

Tirz actively avoids receptor downregulation unlike Reta and Sema,

If solely for nutritional partitionining benefits and appetite/FoodNoise supression - > Tirzp is the superior choice because for reta, you are likely not getting the glucagon agonism to any significant degree at lower dosages anyways.

 

[Kirbdawg]

Thank you for the answer.

Definitely there is no way I'm further decreasing my calories, I'm starting to get all the negative side effects of a caloric deficit; extreme exhaustion fatigue, low libido etc.

I will keep it at 6mg as you suggested. Truth be told the increase to 6mg was done about 2 weeks ago and as such it shouldn't have reached peak blood serum levels as of yet.

I still get food noise, but I can work around it.

As far as your point about the reverse, you are suggesting to not only titrate down but to slowly increase based on biofeedback (hunger etc) right? I suspect I'm going to be exactly as you in terms of hunger. Even while on Reta I did some horrible binges some time ago (it was the reason why I increased the dose to 6mg).

In regards to caloric maintenance; I'm using Macrofactor which has a built-in expenditure tracker. I track everything on extreme detail (even vinegar or even when I binge), and I'm confident in the numbers I see. Only recently I have seen an extreme decrease in my TDEE. But yeah, adjustments will surely be made.

So you think that if I do it's going to be counter productive? Have you tested it yourself?

What would you consider low dose Reta for bulking?

Brother, we are exactly on the same boat. That's exactly what I'm aiming for.

As of now I'm dieting on 2300 Kcal (training days) and 1900 Kcal cardio/rest days and it's a torture; especially given the fact that my total protein is 240-270g which leads to limited food choices.

I definitely want to gain weight/clean bulk so you suggest as well to decrease the Reta as I'm reversing? If yes by how much? And for how long?

________

Lastly I would like to ask how all of you dose your Reta?

Up until two weeks ago I used to inject it 3 times per week. I recently read that less injections is better, especially for appetite suppression. And I'm now infecting two times per week. Every Monday morning and Friday Morning.

Again thanks for the replies!

Thanks for sharing. I have been on reta for 24 days. started at 317lbs, down to 302lbs. started doing 2mg once per week. i didnt consider splitting it into smaller doses multi times per week. i think it has a 6 day half life and im happy to poke less often. i went up to 2.5mg in week 3 and stayed the same this week.

i had originally planned to titrate from 2mg in week 5 to 4mg, then 6-8mg weeks 8+. but im on blood pressure, adhd, and gout meds and water retention has always been harder for me. even worse on reta and bpc/tb. im also losing some muscle, which is normal but some of that is water loss. i decided to stick to 2.5mg for now and wait and see.

i will try some gh peptides once my weight is around 250lbs. Im obviously not taking any gear, or doing body building so we are in different boats. im trying to lose weight first, then worry about the rest later.

i have had a tough time eating enough calories most days. some of it is just due to not wanting to eat the wrong food or finding more of the right ones. others im not as hungry anymore. i do get random hunger cravings as well. i just try to binge healthier stuff.

Anyways, love reading about this stuff. Best of luck!

 

[Billbo98]

you DONT need to reverse diet while on GLP1,

its done to prevent rapid weight regain and the theoretical ramping up of metabolic rate (which is a function of energy availability) but all that is taken care of via Reta,

lower the Reta dose to half without any titration and UP your calories, a week is all it takes that your functions will be upregulated again,

Agree with taking low dose Reta for insulin sensitivity, I plan on doing exactly that.

100% reverse dieting is a huge waste of time made up by Layne Norton bs

 

[Necessary Evil]

100% reverse dieting is a huge waste of time made up by Layne Norton bs

I get that Layne creates a lot of drama and it's easy to write off everything he says as marketing, but if we strip away the guru branding and just look at the actual physiology, dismissing the concept entirely ignores how the body handles energy homeostasis after a famine response. For me what's quite important is the possible GI distress someone might experience after going from a deficit to maintenance; good luck finding the exact calories for maintenance in one go by the way, I will try to explain that as well.

When you have been restricting calories for a long haul, your digestive system undergoes genuine physiological downregulation where your gastric emptying rates slow significantly and your production of specific digestive enzymes drops to match the lower load. If you immediately jump to what you think is your maintenance by slamming a sudden 40% increase in food volume overnight, you are overwhelming that downregulated digestive capacity which causes severe distention, water retention, and malabsorption because your gut literally isn't primed to handle that throughput yet.

There is also the issue that your calculated maintenance on paper and your metabolic reality at the end of a cut are two completely different numbers due to adaptive thermogenesis. Your NEAT is subconsciously crushed and your mitochondrial efficiency has changed so if you jump straight to a calculator number, you are almost guaranteed to be in a surplus because your output is currently lagging behind your intake. Reverse dieting is just a way to match your intake to your metabolic recovery rate so you don't spill over into fat storage while your TDEE is still suppressed.

We also have plenty of data going back to the Minnesota Starvation Experiment showing that when the body is depleted it prioritizes restoring adipose tissue over lean tissue if calories are reintroduced too quickly, which is a phenomenon called collateral fattening. By slowly walking the calories up you are trying to mitigate that preferential partitioning of energy into fat cells and give your lean mass and glycogen stores a chance to top off first. It just seems logical to control variables coming out of a cut rather than guessing and hoping you don't rebound.

On top of the physiological stuff there is the simple reality of adherence and keeping your blood sugar stable. When you come off a hard diet your hunger hormones like ghrelin are still sky high and your satiety signals are lagging so if you just rip the band aid off and jump to maintenance it is incredibly easy to lose control and binge because your brain is still in starvation mode. Keeping a structured reverse diet acts as a psychological guardrail so you don't just open the floodgates. It also helps manage glucose load because slamming a depleted body with a sudden massive influx of carbs can lead to crazy insulin spikes and reactive hypoglycemia whereas slowly titrating up lets your insulin sensitivity actually work for you instead of getting overwhelmed.

And now you are going to tell me, that's why we have Reta, I agree and hence my original question as to how much to add on reverse.