Surprising TRT bloodwork...

[ToastEater]

Met my endo Friday.
120mg Test E/wk
On TRT about 6 mos

Albumin: 43
SHBG: 61
Test: 42.5 nmol/L
Free Test: 722 pmol/L
E2: 222

She’s trying me on adex starting this week.
She asked me if I’ve been emotional. Told her I always am lol.
She wants to see my test at 1200. I was stoked to hear that.

What should my E2 be?

 

[CompoundLifts31]

Met my endo Friday.
120mg Test E/wk
On TRT about 6 mos

Albumin: 43
SHBG: 61
Test: 42.5 nmol/L
Free Test: 722 pmol/L
E2: 222

She’s trying me on adex starting this week.
She asked me if I’ve been emotional. Told her I always am lol.
She wants to see my test at 1200. I was stoked to hear that.

What should my E2 be?

I think the range is from 22 to 60ish.
Your estrogen is sky high.
No estrogenic sides?!?

 

[ToastEater]

I think there’s a unit difference in Canada.
I just converted that E2 # from pmol/L to pg/ml and the number is 60.
That makes more sense.
Still high though. Most guys like ~25, right?

 

[RunTrenFckTens]

Over 1200 ng/dl damn, you're lucky. My E2 ref range is 0-146pmol/L and I sit around 120pmol/L on 100mg/wk. What is your test dose? Your E2 is definitely high.

Edit* never mind I read you're on 120mg/wk. I hit about 1100 on 100mg/wk with injections 2x a week. Maybe do more frequent injections to lower estrogen rebound. 20-30pg/mL is ideal. Some like a bit higher. I wouldn't start an AI unless absolutely necessary. Hard on your lipids. Maybe reduce test dose. I'm not sure if you'll notice a difference between 1000ng/dL and 1200ng/dL.

 

[Whopperflopper]

Lucky bastard. My doc has me at 200mg Cyp every 2 weeks. My T is less than 300 and she is fine with that. I had to be under 150 just to get a script. She still warns me about Prostate issues I don't have because of trt. I'm 48. Trying to get diabetes under control most important issue.

 

[RunTrenFckTens]

Lucky bastard. My doc has me at 200mg Cyp every 2 weeks. My T is less than 300 and she is fine with that. I had to be under 150 just to get a script. She still warns me about Prostate issues I don't have because of trt. I'm 48. Trying to get diabetes under control most important issue.

200mg every 2 weeks is normal. How the hell is your total test under 300?

 

[ToastEater]

200mg/wk is higher from what I’ve been reading. I think 120mg/wk is about the max they like to prescribe. My doc says she’s gonna get me there with pellets. Anyone done that?

 

[Whopperflopper]

200mg every 2 weeks is normal. How the hell is your total test under 300?

I know for sure it was 147 before prescribing, and missed my testing date a couple maybe 10 days? So it was like 24 days from last inject. Next labs in July will be spot on. Their policy wants me between 150 and 500.

 

[RunTrenFckTens]

I know for sure it was 147 before prescribing, and missed my testing date a couple maybe 10 days? So it was like 24 days from last inject. Next labs in July will be spot on. Their policy wants me between 150 and 500.

200mg/2wk is the same as 100mg/wk so you should be around 1000ng/dL. 24 days since your last injection? I thought you were doing an injection every 2 weeks. You should get your blood taken halfway between your injection times. So if you are doing 1 shot every 2 weeks, that means your blood should be tested 7 days after your injection. Ask her to switch you to once a week, then you would have blood tested 3.5 days after injection. If you go to 2 injections a week you would have your blood tested 1.75 days after injection. It's also based on symptoms, so the range can be quite subjective as to whats suitable for one person. IE. 300ng/dL can be fine for some guys and they will experience no low T symptoms. Meanwhile someone else at that level will have all the symptoms.

 

[Eman]

200mg/2wk is the same as 100mg/wk

No, that's not correct.

 

[RunTrenFckTens]

No, that's not correct.

I'm not sure I understand why it wouldn't be? His levels will peak higher sure. In my understanding his 7 day post injection blood work would be the same as a 100mg/wk person's 3.5 day post injection blood work.

Edit* by 200mg/2wk I mean 200mg injected once every 2 weeks.

 

[Eman]

I'm not sure I understand why it wouldn't be? His levels will peak higher sure. In my understanding his 7 day post injection blood work would be the same as a 100mg/wk person's 3.5 day post injection blood work.

Edit* by 200mg/2wk I mean 200mg injected once every 2 weeks.

The blood levels would be very different. Take a look...

Here's a 14 day pinning rotation with 200mg:



Here's 100mg every 7 days:



Do they look comparable at all?

 

[RunTrenFckTens]

The blood levels would be very different. Take a look...

Here's a 14 day pinning rotation with 200mg:

View attachment 130964

Here's 100mg every 7 days:

View attachment 130965

Do they look comparable at all?

The release of mg/day is at 10 give or take for halfway between injections for the 200mg every 14 days and for the 100mg every 7 days. I'm not sure what you're getting at.

 

[Eman]

The release of mg/day is at 10 give or take for halfway between injections for the 200mg every 14 days and for the 100mg every 7 days. I'm not sure what you're getting at.

You said that both protocols are the same, what I'm getting at is that they aren't. Different peaks, different troughs, different everything. They result in nothing close to the same outcome in blood levels... They're just different.

 

[RunTrenFckTens]

You said that both protocols are the same, what I'm getting at is that they aren't. Different peaks, different troughs, different everything. They result in nothing close to the same outcome in blood levels... They're just different.

Even if taken at the correct time(halfway between injections) you think the blood levels would vary that much. I guess there are many other contributing factors to how it gets metabolized and the speed depending on the person. I figured most people switched to 100mg/wk to get less peaks and more stable levels.

 

[Whopperflopper]

You said that both protocols are the same, what I'm getting at is that they aren't. Different peaks, different troughs, different everything. They result in nothing close to the same outcome in blood levels... They're just different.

Thanks Eman, I'm going to start splitting the doses up. She said I could do 100 a week. So maybe an eod experiment will be in the works.
I want to avoid the big spikes, and any exogenous suppression that may be occurring. The every 2 week deal has an effect that tapers off after several days based on what I feel.
I blasted too much too long to put myself in this position. I was doing 300mg every Sunday Thursday for about 3 years. I know, that was not a cruise but a cycle. Hard Lesson learned.

 

[Eman]

Thanks Eman, I'm going to start splitting the doses up. She said I could do 100 a week. So maybe an eod experiment will be in the works.
I want to avoid the big spikes, and any exogenous suppression that may be occurring. The every 2 week deal has an effect that tapers off after several days based on what I feel.
I blasted too much too long to put myself in this position. I was doing 300mg every Sunday Thursday for about 3 years. I know, that was not a cruise but a cycle. Hard Lesson learned.

I would definitely opt for 100mg per week, if I were in your shoes. I don't think cyp should be used less than one pin per week. I prefer twice a week personally but it's barely noticeable after a while for me.

The exogenous suppression is happening though... That's not going to be avoided. If you're on TRT, this shouldn't really be a concern though because there is nothing or very little to suppress.

 

[Dr JIM]

Far to much emphasis is placed on "TRT" labs, rather then the improvement of OBJECTIVE low T signs and symptoms.

And OBJECTIVE signs and symptoms do not include an erection on command.

 

[Eman]

And OBJECTIVE signs and symptoms do not include an erection on command

No no no, that's the first sign that you need to double the dose... Isn't that like the first thing they cover in Endocrinology 101?

 

[Dr JIM]

No no no, that's the first sign that you need to double the dose... Isn't that like the first thing they cover in Endocrinology 101?

For those that are TRT self prescribers absolutely, but why not add a little Drol, and call it a CYCLE ----- next comes the AI to control E-2, ----- crap my testis have shrunk ---- how about some HCG ----- bitch tits --- no problem add a SERM ---hair falling out --- got cha covered ---- time for a "DHT blocker" ---- but need to check LABS, LABS and more LABS ----- WOW and all this for an erection on demand.

Much like yourself I've followed many of those who are experimenting with "TRT" and IME, with few exceptions, the ends do not justify the means.

Regards
JIM