Test + Dbol Cycle Design

[Cruise22]

I’ve been on Test P for about 4 months now—started at 30mg a day and just bumped it up to 60mg recently (titrated from 30 > 40 > 50 with most recent labs done at 50 mg two weeks ago). All my bloodwork looks good, except LH and FSH are totally shut down. I’ve been dying to throw in something new but couldn’t decide. I’ve been dropping weight slowly, eating at maintenance most days and dipping below 1-2 times a week. Sitting at around 185lbs, probably 12-15% BF—got a visible four-pack without flexing, plus veins popping in my legs and arms.

Not super into that super dry, hard, vascular look, so I’m thinking about adding DBol just pre-workout, like 5-10mg, to get a fuller, rounder look. My E2 was 20 pg/mL on 50mg Test P daily. Since I don’t aromatize a ton, is bumping to 60mg and tossing in DBol only on training days (pre-workout, 5-10mg, 3-4 days a week) a smart move? Or are there better “wet” compounds for that full, pumped feel? Got Primo on hand if E2 spikes too much—hoping to keep it 25-35 pg/mL on 60mg. I know DBol turns into 17α-methylestradiol instead of straight E2, so no real controlling that, which is why I’d only hit it pre-workout a few days a week.

 

[IndividualMan]

primo as short trem E2 control is stupid. wont work quick enough. get your hands on a SERM like ralox/tamox/toremifene for E2 emergencies.
dont increase dosage + add another source of E2 at the same time.

Maybe just add in 5-10 mg Dbol once a week, then up it to 2x/week if you enjoy it, then take a break until bloods/lipids are good, and then consider if you want to take it for 4-6 weeks on every training day.

also, do T cyp or E instead of prop. more stable levels even with EOD injections vs porp ED injections

 

[IndividualMan]

Also: new member intro, cant skip out on that.
Age, height, stats, diet, training, goals, etc.

 

[SmallTitsIRL]

If you want the fuller rounder look just had GH. Bio identical hormone less sides.
Or go with Nandrolone, which is also an option.
If you decide to go with the D-Bol route take some Aromasin or Arimidex.

More information here

 

[adrenalytic]

Test p.

 

[DeodatoFulci]

Test p.

Another Clav devotee perhaps? Haha.

 

[Cruise22]

primo as short trem E2 control is stupid. wont work quick enough. get your hands on a SERM like ralox/tamox/toremifene for E2 emergencies.
dont increase dosage + add another source of E2 at the same time.

Maybe just add in 5-10 mg Dbol once a week, then up it to 2x/week if you enjoy it, then take a break until bloods/lipids are good, and then consider if you want to take it for 4-6 weeks on every training day.

also, do T cyp or E instead of prop. more stable levels even with EOD injections vs porp ED injections

Thanks for the sound advice, manipulating many variables at the same time is silly. I’ll start with adding 5 mg of DBol pre WO once per week, maybe then twice a week and play with it for 4-6 weeks then pull labs.

Reason I started with Test P is to be able to pull the plug if I don’t like how I’m feeling as I started to titrate up, 30 > 40 > 50 > 60. Once I find my sweet spot I’ll likely switch to Test E. IMHO I think it’s risky to have a long acting compound if you don’t know how you’re going to react to it. I’m not trying to throw the kitchen sink at my body to address out of range markers. I think too many people overly rely on pharma ancillaries.

Anyway thanks for the sound advice.

 

[Cruise22]

If you want the fuller rounder look just had GH. Bio identical hormone less sides.
Or go with Nandrolone, which is also an option.
If you decide to go with the D-Bol route take some Aromasin or Arimidex.

More information here

My IGF-1 is decent, upper reference range for my age, 32 y/o. Have friends who have run it and complain about minor CTS and unfavorable water retention. So I rather not, at least not now. Rather dabble with another AAS, at mild dosages that are fast acting and are more anabolic. I have aromasin on hand but hoping I don’t have to use it. Although I would rather pull the Dbol.

Nandrolone has been on my mind particularly NPP, since I shoot daily. I’ll likely take 5-10 mg DBol for a spin PWO only, ideally 4-6 weeks if no clear sides surface.

Thanks for the input

 

[SmallTitsIRL]

Test p.

Another Clav devotee perhaps? Haha.

What's your issue with test P? G is pinning daily and keeping stable levels.
I use Test P and inject EOD.
Do you have anything pointing how bad test P is?

 

[adrenalytic]

What's your issue with test P? G is pinning daily and keeping stable levels.
I use Test P and inject EOD.
Do you have anything pointing how bad test P is?

It's not the ester - it's foolish reasoning for using it. P has its uses. BnC is not one of them.

For whatever reason people seem to think they can just PCT off P easier like they are somehow magically less suppressed. It might be faster to clear the hormone but rest assured you run the same risks coming off P as you do any other ester.

Go ahead and pin ever day of it makes you feel good but you will never achieve the same serum stability offered by longer esters.

And that's not taking into account the scar tissue buildup of using prop endlessly. And the PIP.

This illusion of control can blind them to real problems. It offers no meaningful advantage for a beginner and actually adds complexity.

But they feel safe because their favorite influencer said it was good. Crack on fella.

 

[SmallTitsIRL]

It's not the ester - it's foolish reasoning for using it. P has its uses. BnC is not one of them.

For whatever reason people seem to think they can just PCT off P easier like they are somehow magically less suppressed. It might be faster to clear the hormone but rest assured you run the same risks coming off P as you do any other ester.

Go ahead and pin ever day of it makes you feel good but you will never achieve the same serum stability offered by longer esters.

And that's not taking into account the scar tissue buildup of using prop endlessly. And the PIP.

This illusion of control can blind them to real problems. It offers no meaningful advantage for a beginner and actually adds complexity.

But they feel safe because their favorite influencer said it was good. Crack on fella.

He never mentioned wanting to coming off, so you're attacking him without reason.

You're right the damage is done no matter the ester.
If you want real stability you'd use Test U pinning ED. Prop is also a lighter ester so you get more test API (bullshit argument to be honest).
Test P has no PIP what kind of gear are you using? Or are you just genetically inferior (it's a joke dont get mad pookie). You're right about scar tissue, just rotate sites and all good.

I haven't seen any real influencer recommending Prop unless for the specific case where someone crashed their E2 and they recommended prop to help with aromatisation. (But then I don't even have tiktok so most of these influencers are unknown to me)

 

[adrenalytic]

He never mentioned wanting to coming off, so you're attacking him without reason.

You're right the damage is done no matter the ester.
If you want real stability you'd use Test U pinning ED. Prop is also a lighter ester so you get more test API (bullshit argument to be honest).
Test P has no PIP what kind of gear are you using? Or are you just genetically inferior (it's a joke dont get mad pookie). You're right about scar tissue, just rotate sites and all good.

I haven't seen any real influencer recommending Prop unless for the specific case where someone crashed their E2 and they recommended prop to help with aromatisation. (But then I don't even have tiktok so most of these influencers are unknown to me)

That's a lot of words to not say much. I have never used prop but it's no secret that prop PIP is pretty typical but whatever you say I won't argue. You seem very emotional over your prop.

I posted a gif lol. If that's an attack well I guess I'll call the waaahmbulance to bring some blankets and hot cocoa.

If you're in this for the long haul you should absolutely be concerned with tissue damage accrual. Don't care how many sites you have on rotation. Daily pinning forever will catch up with you.

Challenge: Show me a modern era pro that's using prop to build their physique.

 

[Cruise22]

It's not the ester - it's foolish reasoning for using it. P has its uses. BnC is not one of them.

For whatever reason people seem to think they can just PCT off P easier like they are somehow magically less suppressed. It might be faster to clear the hormone but rest assured you run the same risks coming off P as you do any other ester.

Go ahead and pin ever day of it makes you feel good but you will never achieve the same serum stability offered by longer esters.

And that's not taking into account the scar tissue buildup of using prop endlessly. And the PIP.

This illusion of control can blind them to real problems. It offers no meaningful advantage for a beginner and actually adds complexity.

But they feel safe because their favorite influencer said it was good. Crack on fella.

Coming off isn’t part of the equation, so PCT is not even on my radar. being able to slowly ramp up or down IMO has its benefits—lends itself to establishing clearer blast and cruise landmarks. Again I honestly think the stable serum levels are negligible if you shoot daily, but to each their own. What you’re absolutely right about is scar tissue but I use 27 gauge and have 8 different locations—pierce the skin like a hot knife on butter. I get the push back about the influencers, too many impressionable kids, I’m a grown ass man to blindly follow some kid bc he’s caught some traction. that doesn’t mean that he doesn’t have some redeemable POVs. People join the forum to share valuable and insightful information not to be scolded like misbehaved 5 year old. Regardless appreciate the input, was mostly looking for feedback particular first hand experience of people running DBol when being low aromatizers and not going to the typical dry/vascular/hard look. Don’t want to walk around looking like a stiff rod.

 

[Cruise22]

That's a lot of words to not say much. I have never used prop but it's no secret that prop PIP is pretty typical but whatever you say I won't argue. You seem very emotional over your prop.

I posted a gif lol. If that's an attack well I guess I'll call the waaahmbulance to bring some blankets and hot cocoa.

If you're in this for the long haul you should absolutely be concerned with tissue damage accrual. Don't care how many sites you have on rotation. Daily pinning forever will catch up with you.

Challenge: Show me a modern era pro that's using prop to build their physique.

The modern pros argument is a decent one, reference forbears to understand what’s worked and what hasn’t. But I think it’s mostly from a price, convenience, and production issue. When you’re at that level money is not concern so pharma grade is easily accessible—prop isn’t readily available and shooting daily some people do not enjoy. Regardless, Test is test. So long as your biomarkers are within range and you are not exhibiting any deleterious symptoms, then to each their own.

Shoot I’m even considering dabbling with TNE, before DBol but that’s another discussion, maybe too radioactive for you or this forum. Trust me I care about my health so pulling labs goes without saying before turning any dials or introducing any new variables.

Again appreciate the insight but you came out swinging, joke or not, so just want to clear the air. Maybe this can help someone who decides to dabble with DBol as a low aromatizer in the long haul. I plan on updating this post once I get started at the end of the month. Will be pulling bloods at 60 mg daily since I started that 2 weeks ago and my DBol doesn’t arrive for another week.

 

[adrenalytic]

The modern pros argument is a decent one, reference forbears to understand what’s worked and what hasn’t. But I think it’s mostly from a price, convenience, and production issue. When you’re at that level money is not concern so pharma grade is easily accessible—prop isn’t readily available and shooting daily some people do not enjoy. Regardless, Test is test. So long as your biomarkers are within range and you are not exhibiting any deleterious symptoms, then to each their own.

Shoot I’m even considering dabbling with TNE, before DBol but that’s another discussion, maybe too radioactive for you or this forum. Trust me I care about my health so pulling labs goes without saying before turning any dials or introducing any new variables.

Again appreciate the insight but you came out swinging, joke or not, so just want to clear the air. Maybe this can help someone who decides to dabble with DBol as a low aromatizer in the long haul. I plan on updating this post once I get started at the end of the month. Will be pulling bloods at 60 mg daily since I started that 2 weeks ago and my DBol doesn’t arrive for another week.

Look, I get it, no one likes to be told their baby is ugly but that was not me swinging. I make it very apparent when the gloves are off.

It's not a cost issue. It's strategy. When you’re pushing mass for 20–30+ weeks injection burden matters, tissue health matters, stability matters. There’s no performance advantage to prop once levels are steady.

Prop becomes advantageous closer to prep (I did concede that it has its uses) so quick adjustments can be made but this is short term. Tissue accrual is better supported by long esters.

 

[Cruise22]

Look, I get it, no one likes to be told their baby is ugly but that was not me swinging.

lol I really like that, I’m gonna have to borrow that. First time hearing it.

 

[adrenalytic]

Look, I get it, no one likes to be told their baby is ugly but that was not me swinging.

lol I really like that, I’m gonna have to borrow that. First time hearing it.

Haha borrow away, I think I picked it up from someone around here myself.

 

[SmallTitsIRL]

That's a lot of words to not say much. I have never used prop but it's no secret that prop PIP is pretty typical but whatever you say I won't argue. You seem very emotional over your prop.

I posted a gif lol. If that's an attack well I guess I'll call the waaahmbulance to bring some blankets and hot cocoa.

If you're in this for the long haul you should absolutely be concerned with tissue damage accrual. Don't care how many sites you have on rotation. Daily pinning forever will catch up with you.

Challenge: Show me a modern era pro that's using prop to build their physique.

I have used prop from multiple vendors. Never had any pip so I'm just build different clearly. Not emotional at all, you can't just be talking out of your ass.

I said you're right about the tissue, but then injecting ED prop or enan the tissue will build up either way.

Iain Vailliere has said multiple times he used 100mg prop daily when on prep. I'm sure he is not the only one.

 

[adrenalytic]

I have used prop from multiple vendors. Never had any pip so I'm just build different clearly. Not emotional at all, you can't just be talking out of your ass.

I said you're right about the tissue, but then injecting ED prop or enan the tissue will build up either way.

Iain Vailliere has said multiple times he used 100mg prop daily when on prep. I'm sure he is not the only one.

So I made it up? K.

There is no need to inject those esters ED.

I didn't say anything about prep. I said "built their physique". I already said prep use is common but you're not adding tissue at that point, you're maintaining.

 

[SmallTitsIRL]

So I made it up? K.

There is no need to inject those esters ED.

I didn't say anything about prep. I said "built their physique". I already said prep use is common but you're not adding tissue at that point, you're maintaining.

I'm not saying it's made up. But there's no pip in prop.

But don't you want stable levels? Then you inject every day. Test is test, no matter the ester, are you able to understand that part? Yes, it's more volume, but still test.

It's not a cost issue. It's strategy. When you’re pushing mass for 20–30+ weeks injection burden matters, tissue health matters, stability matters. There’s no performance advantage to prop once levels are steady.

Even cost, E or C even Sust are cheaper mg/$. And I gave you that one about tissue, that was never something I was trying argue.