Test Prop: 'Active Life' vs. 'Half Life"

[youngBuilder]

I am looking for find out the truth about Test Prop so I know when my test levels drop below "normal" where one would be expecting to be on PCT...

Half Life
I've seen websites that say it's 3 days. So if thats true, and I theoretically injected 200mgs of Test-Prop, then 6 days later I would be at the equivalent of 50mgs/day. At day 12, I would still be at the equivalent of 12.5mgs/day. If below normal means below the TRT replacement dose of 100mgs/week, or the equivalent of 14.3mgs/day....then it takes almost 2 weeks for serum test levels to drop below normal. From experience, this cant be right...

Active Life
Again, research online shows that there is only enough "active" levels of Test-prop (I am assuming this means serum test levels) for only 3-4 days.

So which is it?

I am doing Bill Roberts' 2-week cycles of T-prop and I dosed 150mgs EOD. I stopped on day 8 and its now day 15. I noticed a slight dip in energy, but libido is raging. I have been taking 40mgs of Nolva since day 10, so I'm wondering if I already passed the "hump" and natty test levels are already rebounding nicely... Or am I full of shit and still feeling the residual test from days 1-8???

 

[hmart]

I think you are doing it wrong. On a 2-on/4-off cycle post-cycle begins at day 15 with a frontload of SERMs. If you are dosing at 150 mg EOD your last injection should have been on day 11. Why would you even begin using Nolva on day j10????

To quote Bill Roberts, for recovery to begin the exogenous test should drop to the equivalent of 200 mg/week or lower. An injection on day 11 of 150 mgs should be less than 70 mg by Day 15, allowing recovery and a nice transition between exogenous test to recovered endogenous production.

Roid Calculator - half lifes steroids ester half-life

 

[youngBuilder]

Well, you might be right. I started Nolva early for a couple reasons:
1. I thought that the Test Prop stayed "active" longer than 5-7 days so I figured I'd have to stop on day 8 to get under the "normal" natty levels
2. I also started getting paranoid about gyno - I thought I was feeling sensitivity but I think it was just muscle aches from the Var pumps
3. Lastly, if I started the Nolva early (5-day half life) I wouldnt have to front load into PCT.


Are you saying that Test Prop drops fast enough to begin PCT on Day 15 if last dose was Day 11?

 

[hmart]

You don't have to wait for testosterone to go nil to start PCT.
Yes, a TProp dose on day 10 or 11 is ok, given your dose.

As a matter of fact I just finished my first 2-weeker and I used 100 mgs or TProp on day 11. I'll let you know later about my recovery.

 

[youngBuilder]

Nice, how did you like it?

Im on day 16 (8 days since last inj) and up 4.6lbs on a cutting diet.

 

[Donzi]

Nice, how did you like it?

Im on day 16 (8 days since last inj) and up 4.6lbs on a cutting diet.

Given ur diet and rather low dose. U must have ran sum good gear. [)]

 

[youngBuilder]

Must be!

[)]

 

[Donzi]

Got a Cyp 350mg.. Just Breaking hearts..

 

[Stretch]

You don't have to wait for testosterone to go nil to start PCT.
Yes, a TProp dose on day 10 or 11 is ok, given your dose.

As a matter of fact I just finished my first 2-weeker and I used 100 mgs or TProp on day 11. I'll let you know later about my recovery.

It is pointless, even counter-productive, to begin SERM application until exogenous T has cleared ur system.

Dr. Scally dealt with this in depth in a thread titled "doc and bbc" newbie23 was the author of that thread. I just reposted a link to it somewhere.

 

[Pericles]

It is pointless, even counter-productive, to begin SERM application until exogenous T has cleared ur system.

Dr. Scally dealt with this in depth in a thread titled "doc and bbc" newbie23 was the author of that thread. I just reposted a link to it somewhere.

That is (in part) why I like to run pretty large amounts of HCG starting at about 5 days after last shot of long acting test ester. My access to HCG is limited to large amounts. I have a script, but doc and compounding pharm don't have smaller dosage HCG (a 10k IU unit, that is high priced to begin with, and the only other option is a relatively well priced 25K unit). If I had access to a low priced HCG in smaller amounts I would run on cycle.

Yes there are some ugls that have 5k units, but a $200 min, and to be honest I only want to deal w/ one ugl (who does not carry HCG...but has otherwise been very good to me).

So, starting at day 5, I will run 2k iU's eod for 10 days. I am on trt, but back when I was not, my last shot of HCG would be 15 days after last shot of T E, so then I could start my pct (Nolva and Clomid).

 

[youngBuilder]

It is pointless, even counter-productive, to begin SERM application until exogenous T has cleared ur system.

Dr. Scally dealt with this in depth in a thread titled "doc and bbc" newbie23 was the author of that thread. I just reposted a link to it somewhere.

Hey bud,

I agree that it may be "pointless" but what do you mean "counterproductive?" Counterprdoctive to what? The PCT? Or gains on cycle?

Also, what about those of us who may be predisposed to gyno? In the past I've run .5mgs Adex ED and 10mgs/Nolva EOD as insurance...

 

[Stretch]

Hey bud,

I agree that it may be "pointless" but what do you mean "counterproductive?" Counterprdoctive to what? The PCT? Or gains on cycle?

Also, what about those of us who may be predisposed to gyno? In the past I've run .5mgs Adex ED and 10mgs/Nolva EOD as insurance...

Well, running that many E blocking drugs is overkill IMO. But their ur tits...errrr pecs.

And as far as my statement about applying SERM's too early being counterproductive; BOTH is the answer to your question. It is counterproductive to the restart of your HPTA. Thereby counterproductive to PCT, and thereby counterproductive to the gains achieved while previously on cycle.

Not sure why I would answer that, when you call me "bud" which I read in a patronizing tone.

Did you bother to do your own research?? Did you even read the thread
I spoke of in my original post?? I gave you the thread, and author of an EXCELLENT read on the topic from Doc, I also posted a link to it, in another thread, I'm just too stupid to remember where it was

 

[Stretch]

Oh...I just found where I posted the link. In case anyone wants it

It was in response to a question someone asked about timing PCT

VAR AND PCT was the title..of the thread I replied to.

1)Question is asked....
2)I respond with the link
3)you respond with partially poor....and partially sound advice
4)Doc calls ur advice bad...and corrects you.


Screw it....I'm reviving the thread....and all of you who have PCT questions should read it.

 

[youngBuilder]

Well, running that many E blocking drugs is overkill IMO. But their ur tits...errrr pecs.

And as far as my statement about applying SERM's too early being counterproductive; BOTH is the answer to your question. It is counterproductive to the restart of your HPTA. Thereby counterproductive to PCT, and thereby counterproductive to the gains achieved while previously on cycle.

Not sure why I would answer that, when you call me "bud" which I read in a patronizing tone.

Did you bother to do your own research?? Did you even read the thread
I spoke of in my original post?? I gave you the thread, and author of an EXCELLENT read on the topic from Doc, I also posted a link to it, in another thread, I'm just too stupid to remember where it was

Not sure why you would read it in a patronizing tone, as I intended to use it in a polite tone - but hey... We are all sensitive to different things I guess.

Yes, I did bother to do my research (using Bill Robert's protocol on 2-on/4-off) and NO, I did not read the article/link you provided earlier.

 

[Stretch]

Not sure why you would read it in a patronizing tone, as I intended to use it in a polite tone - but hey... We are all sensitive to different things I guess.

Yes, I did bother to do my research (using Bill Robert's protocol on 2-on/4-off) and NO, I did not read the article/link you provided earlier.

Fair enough. Not sensitive at all...that's why I specified: "I read with a patronizing tone". Because there is no vocal inflection on text its a common misnomer to assume you KNOW how someone intended their comment to sound.

Glad ur here.

You should read the thread, you might learn something. I know I did.

 

[youngBuilder]

Hey no worries Stretch - I know how things get misrepresented sometimes online.

Glad to be here - took a hiatus for about 5 years and it seems the "protocols" have evolved a bit, so I got a bunch to learn/read. I used to run Bill Robert's 2-on/4-off and follow his PCT protocol and it's always been a breeze. In fact, my natty T-levels averaged over 2-times higher after these cycles than before any AAS. Even 5 years later with absolutely no AAS since! Imust have been doing something right.

I just ran my first 2-on/4-off since my hiatus and I am going to perform labs through PCT and beyond and post them to the forum, along with my two labs before AAS as a baseline...

I am halfway through that thread/link you sent and Doc and others are still saying that starting Nolva/Clomid too early may be a waste - but not counterproductive as long as you run it long enough, after T-levels bottom out, to bring natty levels back. I'll keep reading and post questions....

 

[Stretch]

Yup. You're absolutely right. I read the ENTIRE thread over again, and it looks as though I revived the wrong thread. Or perhaps I confused the facts, I have been on a hiatus myself, but I would have bet my house that he said that.

So, it is pointless but not counterproductive is all we can verify for now. Which is quite different than what I originally posted. Hopefully we can find an answer soon. I will keep searching the forums looking for the answer....it seems to me Scally once said, that SERM's (if applied too early) would prolong suppression although I can't think of the mechanism by which they would do so.

Perhaps they would slow the fall of T levels back to the 375ng/dl number where the HPTA will attempt to restart, and thereby prolonging suppression.

I am going to ask for his input, I hate asking for him to re-answer questions, but I don't see a logical alternative in this circumstance.

 

[Pericles]

Dr Scallywagster has laid this topic out w/ complete answers several times. Instead of looking at his original posts which were extensive, you call him on the carpet for not writing, AGAIN the answers that you seek.

So, instead of doing a little and very, very easy research, you insult him and characterize his response as nebulous.

Kind of like a student who misses the whole semester and then gets angry because the prof won't tell him what is on the final.

 

[Stretch]

Dr Scallywagster has laid this topic out w/ complete answers several times. Instead of looking at his original posts which were extensive, you call him on the carpet for not writing, AGAIN the answers that you seek.

So, instead of doing a little and very, very easy research, you insult him and characterize his response as nebulous.

Kind of like a student who misses the whole semester and then gets angry because the prof won't tell him what is on the final.

Hahaha.....lmfao....

You somehow read one thread and replied to another....no one said scally was nebulous in this thread...how did u manage that?

 

[youngBuilder]

Dr Scallywagster has laid this topic out w/ complete answers several times. Instead of looking at his original posts which were extensive, you call him on the carpet for not writing, AGAIN the answers that you seek.

So, instead of doing a little and very, very easy research, you insult him and characterize his response as nebulous.

Kind of like a student who misses the whole semester and then gets angry because the prof won't tell him what is on the final.

Pericles, you're out of line here - Stretch didn't do 1% of what you are accusing him of doing. I am amazed at your "know-it-all" attitude in making others feel like they dont do simple searches or read, yet you didn't read this thread clearly yourself. I am equally amazed at what you have seemingly comprehended while 'skim-reading' this thread to arrive your conclusion that he is insulting Dr. Scally."

Can you even find 1 sentence where anyone on this thread is insulting Doc? Seriously, pick any sentence and copy/paste it.