Who's using insulin!?

[Dr JIM]

These citations emphasize several of the points I've only touched upon. We are fortunate bc ever since insulins discovery in the 1920s the amount of research devoted to this hormone is truly exhaustive.

To that end, the notion anyone would continue to heed the advice of another "bro scientist" based on their "experience" alone is absolutely asinine. We are also fortunate Meso at least attempts to focus on the "evidence" behind the use of PEDs rather than following yesteryears bro lore.

The essence of the OP's question is whether insulin lives up to the hype, absent supportive evidence, as it's stated on the overwhelming majority of AAS forums. The answer is absolutely NOT, especially at those doses being touted as "anabolic", based on the evidence and there is PLENTY of it, IMO!

The following is only a starter for those who want to KNOW and understand more than the hype!

-Number ONE; is a very nice REVIEW article posted by Dr S a while back

- Number TWO; involves a study design that makes an attempt to separate the influence of OTHER anabolic hormones (IGF in this instance) from that of insulin

- Number THREE; reveals insulin is primarily an ANTI-CATABOLIC hormone

- Number FOUR; documents the influence of SUPRA-PHYSIOLOGIC levels of insulin and it's effect on PS

 

[bodybuilder805]

Your comments throughout this thread have exposed your utter ignorance fella.

God forbid if your "instructing" anyone with only your "experience" to rely upon as a proof you know WTF your doing or talking about.

I would love to see what you have accomplished beside be a well known member on some board. Or better yet how about a pic, probably just grab a random pic of someone else like u so clearly do with your data. I know what I have accomplished in this game and I don't need a internet warrior questioning my knowledge.

 

[Dr JIM]

Nope that's on spot about 50 IU per day, less is required if you exercise, more if you don't or are a couch potato enjoying potato chips as a staple part of your diet

To clarify the "average" 70 KG adult male secrets roughly 50IU/ day of insulin if their dietary intake approximates 2000 Kcal.

And NO it won't "kill you" LMAO since that is what many diabetic NEED to control their hyperglycemia and the complications of DM.

Obviously this quantity is NOT used "at night time when GH levels peak" bc THAT MAY KILL YOU, but rather is titrated into split dosages and by taking advantage of the various forms of insulin with different half lives.

Moreover patients with IDDM are often required to perform periodic BS testing to ensure an OD does not occur.

The point is, unless doses of this magnitude are used, endogenous pancreatic secretion of insulin is reduced, with the net effect being NO change in serum insulin levels.
Why is this so difficult for some to understand is beyond reason since the same issue occurs with AAS.

Would anyone consider pinning less than 7mg of Testosterone a day, the baseline for most males? Why of course NOT, JIM. And why is that? Because that's LESS than natural production........DUH!

 

[Dr JIM]

I would love to see what you have accomplished beside be a well known member on some board. Or better yet how about a pic, probably just grab a random pic of someone else like u so clearly do with your data. I know what I have accomplished in this game and I don't need a internet warrior questioning my knowledge.

Why you don't and didn't need me for that fella, it was your destiny and an "accomplishment" only you would boast about.

 

[bodybuilder805]

You may have a lot of members her fooled with your copy and past but I can see right threw you. The way to try to explain insulin makes it very clear you don't know nearly half of what you try to portray. Give your dosages to someone who is not a diabetic and yes it will kill them, you can not shut down the pancreas unless of course you are a diabetic to begin with. I will not waste my time debating this with you any further all you will continue to do is put your internet search engine on over drive.

 

[Dr JIM]

You may have a lot of members her fooled with your copy and past but I can see right threw you. The way to try to explain insulin makes it very clear you don't know nearly half of what you try to portray. Give your dosages to someone who is not a diabetic and yes it will kill them, you can not shut down the pancreas unless of course you are a diabetic to begin with. I will not waste my time debating this with you any further all you will continue to do is put your internet search engine on over drive.

Have you read any of my comments or is your fund of knowledge that limited bc 50 IU is NORMALLY secreted by the pancreas on a DAILY basis, but according to you and your infinite "experience" it will "kill you" NOT. (Perhaps you should educate yourself about the function of, what are referred to as, glucose counter regulatory hormones)

The difference lies in the particulars such as: what form of insulin is utilized, how and when it's administered and why its being used etc. But that's why "bro scientists" like yourself are potentially dangerous giving advice or instructions on how mates should use INSULIN as a PED or otherwise.

To be blunt you don't know WTF you are doing and indeed YOU could "KILL SOMEONE"

 

[bodybuilder805]

Have you read any of my comments or is your fund of knowledge that limited bc 50 IU is NORMALLY secreted by the pancreas on a DAILY basis, but according to you and your infinite "experience" it will "kill you" NOT. (Perhaps you should educate yourself about the function of, what are referred to as, glucose counter regulatory hormones)

The difference lies in the particulars such as: what form of insulin is utilized, how and when it's administered and why its being used etc. But that's why "bro scientists" like yourself are potentially dangerous giving advice or instructions on how mates should use INSULIN as a PED or otherwise.

To be blunt you don't know WTF you are doing and indeed YOU could "KILL SOMEONE"

oh very nice exactly how I expected you to answer. Took you long enough to gather that Intel. As I said I can see right threw you. I did my research long before your favorite little tool was available (net) I had the ability to get medical journals both on insulin and hgh even before they were pubilished. It does not matter to me if you believe me or not. The fact is I been doing this since the early 90's. Tell that to the guys I have seen compete at the national level and a few pros. Go on and tell them my insulin protocols are useless.

 

[Dr JIM]

oh very nice exactly how I expected you to answer. Took you long enough to gather that Intel. As I said I can see right threw you. I did my research long befor your favorite little tool was available (net) I had the ability to get medical journals both on insulin and hgh even before they were pubilished.

Golly gee I am in the midst of a legend, a legend in his own mind, LMFAO!

 

[Demondosage]

I can tell you practically anything you wanna know about it. Long acting, short, metformin, duration, peak, "insulin stacking" whatever. Go google "insulin 101" and you can read my article on slin

 

[Dr JIM]

Yea but DD your not at all like most Meso members, especially our noobs for variety of reasons.

 

[bodybuilder805]

What's the matter no more goggle date u want to throw around to come off as this know it all on meso? You do it over and over i am surprised I'm the first to throw it at you. Ok you can live in your fantasy land here on the forums and I'll live in mine

 

[bodybuilder805]

I can tell you practically anything you wanna know about it. Long acting, short, metformin, duration, peak, "insulin stacking" whatever. Go google "insulin 101" and you can read my article on slin

this is the problem with these forums all over the net. You get guys like Jim here who run around reading these articles and all of a sudden they are experts. The problem is you get these noobs just starting and they take there words as gold. I get it all the time young kids running these insane dosages and when I try and put them on real dosages they look at me like I'm crazy. It always comes down to so so from this forum says to run it this way.

 

[CensoredBoardsSuck]

this is the problem with these forums all over the net. You get guys like Jim here who run around reading these articles and all of a sudden they are experts.

I find it telling that you haven't attempted to refute Jim's positions with anything more substantial than bro lore. You've posted no data to support your position, and you have ignored the citations posted. I think the reason is pretty clear.

Comparing Meso to other forums is a mistake. Meso is an evidence based forum (evidence being what you refer to as "cut and paste"), the forums you're used to are bro science based.

It always comes down to so so from this forum says to run it this way.

Funny, that's EXACTLY what you're doing.

I'm not discounting the value of personal experience but when you rely solely on anecdotes to inform your decisions about pharmacology while rejecting the scientific literature as "cut and paste," you end up with BS theories like hCG desensitization, E2 rebound following AI cessation, and my personal favorite, tren gyno and the need for caber when running 19-nors.

My point is that things get repeated in the bro lore until they become accepted as fact and no one questions the validity of these ideas anymore. Insulin use is no exception.

 

[bodybuilder805]

I simply refuse to waste my time with such minscule arguments. You talk about scientific literature? Everything Jim has posted can easily be found with a simple Google search. I did my time, not only did I read medical jurnals but I implemented my finding in real time. I know the onset of different types of insulin, depending on half life, type of administration and body fat. I know how long it takes to become active. Look I'm not here to try and impress with my knowledge but I seriously doubt Jim or most members here have taken it as far as I have. Meso is like all other boards, it's the same book just a different cover.

 

[WMSuperSport]

I simply refuse to waste my time with such minscule arguments. You talk about scientific literature? Everything Jim has posted can easily be found with a simple Google search. I did my time, not only did I read medical jurnals but I implemented my finding in real time. I know the onset of different types of insulin, depending on half life, type of administration and body fat. I know how long it takes to become active. Look I'm not here to try and impress with my knowledge but I seriously doubt Jim or most members here have taken it as far as I have. Meso is like all other boards, it's the same book just a different cover.

Anytime someone in the "click" is challenged or argued with, the cavalry comes running with several past quotes and shit talking, even tho no productivity ever comes out of it. Just shit talking and "backing up" their buddy.
Everybody knows insulin is powerful and builds muscle. DrJim always has to start a pissing contest that does nobody any good usually, except to TRY to make himself look smarter than everyone else. Only a few people fall for it, most get annoyed by how he talks down to people and talks like an asshole.
But don't let these few turds ruin forums for you, I just ignore certain people and you can get advice and other good info from plenty of other good guys here.
Annnndddd....here comes CBS with my past quotes and trying to convince me how awesome he and Jim are.

 

[A-a-Ron]

"17 IU is what works best for me, right before bed when GH is high"

Just to add my own two cents in case some inexperienced member is reading this, insulin before bed time is a VERY bad idea. I'll let everyone else argue the finer points.

 

[xupc]

Random question. In my gym a kid that I train with wants to hit an all time record at 242. He is cruising at 1g test 600mg deca and wants to add 30-40iu insulin a day for 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. From 1 to 10 how retard is his decision?

He just became 21 to be honest.

 

[alphastrength50]

cruising at a g? dayumm

 

[xupc]

cruising at a g? dayumm

Yes and I know that he is saying the truth. He is a beast. But I think that he will have issues at the near future..

 

[brutus79]

Random question. In my gym a kid that I train with wants to hit an all time record at 242. He is cruising at 1g test 600mg deca and wants to add 30-40iu insulin a day for 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. From 1 to 10 how retard is his decision?

He just became 21 to be honest.

The answer is- you are a schill dipshit. Shut the fuck up.