Wrapping up a Test/Tren cycle

[betard_foosier]

Yo, 5th cycle here, 4 have been with tren, handle it pretty well aside from vicious bacne and occasional irritability. Wrapping week 8 of a 350 tren ace/700 test cyp cycle, and I’m trying to decide how to finish it up. I cycle mainly for strength and some growth, I eat clean, stay fairly lean and don’t have to cut often. I’ve been eating around a 500 cal surplus, added about 10 lbs, and lifts have increased about 10-15%. I’ve put on a little bit of fluff, whether it’s fat or more likely just some water from the higher test, I’d like to tailor the remaining 4 weeks of this cycle to dry out a bit. I have Var and winny on hand, I’m thinking about dropping the test to 200 and upping tren to 500 and adding either the var or winny and cutting cals back to 3000. I’m hesitant to run the winstrol because I’m not trying to get down to single digits, I’d just like to dry out and get some definition back.

Thoughts? I’ve run tren at 700 before and was shredded at the time, so I know I can handle 500. Should I just hammer through this bulk cycle then cut later, or could a guy lean up a bit in 4-6 weeks on those compounds?

Stats
39 years
6’3”
203 lbs (hardgainer)

 

[Sector]

Yo, 5th cycle here, 4 have been with tren, handle it pretty well aside from vicious bacne and occasional irritability. Wrapping week 8 of a 350 tren ace/700 test cyp cycle, and I’m trying to decide how to finish it up. I cycle mainly for strength and some growth, I eat clean, stay fairly lean and don’t have to cut often. I’ve been eating around a 500 cal surplus, added about 10 lbs, and lifts have increased about 10-15%. I’ve put on a little bit of fluff, whether it’s fat or more likely just some water from the higher test, I’d like to tailor the remaining 4 weeks of this cycle to dry out a bit. I have Var and winny on hand, I’m thinking about dropping the test to 200 and upping tren to 500 and adding either the var or winny and cutting cals back to 3000. I’m hesitant to run the winstrol because I’m not trying to get down to single digits, I’d just like to dry out and get some definition back.

Thoughts? I’ve run tren at 700 before and was shredded at the time, so I know I can handle 500. Should I just hammer through this bulk cycle then cut later, or could a guy lean up a bit in 4-6 weeks on those compounds?

Stats
39 years
6’3”
203 lbs (hardgainer)

Hard to say what the "fluff" is without pictures. A before and current would help

Definitely holding decent water on 700 test I'd imagine.

I like the low test/tren combo as well on cuts. Var or winny would work. I'm more of a winstrol fan after having run it recently but it really shines at a lower bf%, so I'm more inclined to lean towards a var reccomendation.

That said, 250-375 test/week with 350-525 tren a week would be more than enough to prevent muscle loss while cutting without needing the oral.

What's your diet looking like? Surprised you put on a lot of fluff with tren in the mix, unless it's all water weight you're referring to

At your height/Weight I'd probably reccomend dropping tren, finishing the bulk to like 220-230, then add tren back in and finish the cut down to like 205-210 or so, just based off relative numbers without any idea of your physique or bf%

Any bloodwork or idea where your estrogen is at? High estrogen can make you hold excess water and contribute to extra "fluff" that you speak of

 

[betard_foosier]

I really didn’t add a LOT of fluff, I’m just usually pretty defined and now my 6 pack is barely visible.

Getting up to 220-230 is impossible, every cycle I put on about 10 lbs then stall out. I’ve been at 203 for 4 weeks and keep adding calories. Every cycle I add another 200 cals at the top, but still stall out this cycle I’ve built up to 3500 cals, which is about 280-300g protein, 375-450g carbs (all complex, no sugar) and 40-50g fat. Chicken breasts, egg whites, rice, potatoes, lots and lots of veggies, fruit and Sugar free greek yogurt, cottage cheese, some pistachios, and my “treat” is Popcorners or plain popcorn. (I really get buck wild )i follow wendlers 5-3-1 with some more hypertrophy work after, then HIIT either prowlers or airdyne bike 3 times a week. I’ll post up pics in the morning, by end of day I’m carrying a good food baby

 

[betard_foosier]

First photo is after a 6 month cruise at maintenance, about 189. Second photo is at 201, two months on 700mg test cyp and 350mg tren a, 33-3500 cals, Cardarine ed, aromasin and letro eod, caber eod. My e2 stays in single digits. Lifts are up, squatting in the mid 400s, dead’s near 500 and benching in low 300s.

 

[Cyp180]

I really didn’t add a LOT of fluff, I’m just usually pretty defined and now my 6 pack is barely visible.

Getting up to 220-230 is impossible, every cycle I put on about 10 lbs then stall out. I’ve been at 203 for 4 weeks and keep adding calories. Every cycle I add another 200 cals at the top, but still stall out this cycle I’ve built up to 3500 cals, which is about 280-300g protein, 375-450g carbs (all complex, no sugar) and 40-50g fat. Chicken breasts, egg whites, rice, potatoes, lots and lots of veggies, fruit and Sugar free greek yogurt, cottage cheese, some pistachios, and my “treat” is Popcorners or plain popcorn. (I really get buck wild )i follow wendlers 5-3-1 with some more hypertrophy work after, then HIIT either prowlers or airdyne bike 3 times a week. I’ll post up pics in the morning, by end of day I’m carrying a good food baby

Up your Kcals if you want to gain. 3500Kcals is no heavy gain.
189cm tall ?(6' 3")
Up your fat also. 40-50g fat a day is for cutting, not gaining

 

[betard_foosier]

Yep 6’3”, I’m a tall narrow bastard I’m just trying not to put on fat, I’ve always done really cautious bulks because I am so self conscious about body image

 

[Cyp180]

You get fat when your total Kcals is to much. 3500Kcals and just 40-50g fat is
not for gaining. ~ 3300kcals is your maintain value. If you get stuck on 201-203 eat more fat. 500 surplus is around 3800Kcals. If you gain to fast a week increase. al what you eat and drink extra in your stomachs also counts at the scale.

 

[Xplicit]

Yep 6’3”, I’m a tall narrow bastard I’m just trying not to put on fat, I’ve always done really cautious bulks because I am so self conscious about body image

I erased my other post, to quote this instead, as it highlights the main issue.

You are undereating and wasting the AAS, let alone your time in the gym. 5th cycle but you look like you are in your first 6 months of natural lifting. It's a tall thing, I know, in person I am sure you would be more impressive, we don't take pictures well.

But my guy, that is not "floof" in the second picture and certainly doesn't warrant shifting your cycle goals. Up the calories, or spin your wheels, up to you.

The training.. 5-3-1 Wendler program... Thats a beginner strength training program no? Are you a beginner, on your 5th AAS cycle? Are you training for strength? Or size? Might be time to make a change there.

 

[betard_foosier]

Strength, I have been running 5-3-1 forever for about 7 years. It’s far removed from the beginning weight training program, I’m squatting 450, pulling around 500 and benching about 320. My bench has always been down because my arms are so long. You are correct about spinning my wheels due to under eating, I’ve always known this because I have body image dysmorphia, is see myself as fatter than I really am. Thanks for the responses, I really appreciate it!

 

[Xplicit]

Strength, I have been running 5-3-1 forever for about 7 years. It’s far removed from the beginning weight training program, I’m squatting 450, pulling around 500 and benching about 320. My bench has always been down because my arms are so long. You are correct about spinning my wheels due to under eating, I’ve always known this because I have body image dysmorphia, is see myself as fatter than I really am. Thanks for the responses, I really appreciate it!

Your lifts are impressive for sure, I shouldn't be so quick to say "wasting your time in the gym". But, lets get the food rolling, with you being as strong as you are, as lean as you are and as tall as you are... Hit a hard long bulk this fall/winter when you are willing to lose the abbs for a bit, bet your body is primed to grow just needs the calorie push.

I think a lot of us has some body dysmorphia so you are in good company. I can be 10-12%, put on some water and think I ruined my entire cut. Just to lower carbs and cals, clean out and bam no damage done at all. I just try to embrace both looks now and enjoy the pros of each while I am in the moment.

 

[Sector]

I agree with @Xplicit about hitting to food harder.

Most of us have body dysmoprhia. It kind of comes with bodybuilding, but there's no point of pounding the AAS if you're not eating enough. You'll just stall out at the same weight and your progress will be limited.

I also agree you just need to commit to the bulk. 3500 calories isn't all that high for a bulk, just up your calories and commit to it

 

[betard_foosier]

Thanks guys! I’m going to hit another month on this plan and throw on some more calories then reevaluate