The Birth of a Bro

[lmaosuine]

Hey bros,

I've been lurking this forum for the last week, looking for a good source. I pinned (heh) down what I think to be a reliable vendor, so now I'm just waiting for my pack to arrive. Based on what I've read, I don't think I'll be disappointed.

I don't really know where to start, so I'm just gonna throw it all out there. I'm 25 years old. 5'9", 150lbs. I lifted throughout high school and got pretty good natural results - 6 reps of 225 on bench press, but that was my peak (and I neglected legs). I stopped lifting consistently once I got in a steady relationship in my senior year. After that, things started to go downhill.

Over the next few years, I went to college and lifted sporadically. I got increasingly involved with drugs until I finally became a full-blown heroin addict and ended up checking myself into rehab at 120lbs.

Fast forward to today. I've been clean for about 4 months, going to the local methadone clinic daily. I'm back at school and am graduating with my BA by the end of this summer. Unfortunately I feel that the methadone is suppressing my testosterone production, and I'm growing a ridiculously disgusting gut (I'm skinny fat, and a notoriously hard gainer). Last week, I resumed going to the gym, motivated by the prospect of tapering off the methadone and being completely clean and non-dependent on any substances (except sipping on some juice of course).

A few years ago I tried a cycle of Epistane followed by Nolvadex for PCT. It was amazing - I didn't increase my calorie intake, but I made significant gains in strength and weight, and noticed I felt different while on the Nolvadex. I had a blood panel taken after PCT and my testosterone was flagged "High" at 978 ng/dl. I was so proud of that, I would have the results on my fridge if I kept the printout.

Anyway, I'm hitting the gym hard to prepare for my upcoming first "real" cycle. I ordered Test E and Arimidex (would've ordered Aromasin but it wasn't available from the source I used). I'm planning on running just test at 500mg a week, pinning 250mg twice a week, and taking the arimidex if symptoms start to occur.

The only thing I'm worried about is that I ordered a high concentration preparation of Test E - 500mg/ml, and I read (too late) that this concentration can be considerably more painful to pin. If I order sterile grapeseed oil, would I be able to draw that into the syringe in a 1:1 ratio with the amount of liquid containing 250mg of test, then shake to mix for a more comfortable experience?

Though I have a history of heroin abuse, I always stayed loyal to the foil - never graduated to the needle. I'm not scared of using needles for IM injections, though. I understand the general process, I think - insert the 1" needle hilt-deep, aspirate to ensure a vein or artery was not hit, then slowly depress the plunger.

Anyway, I've been lurking these forums because they seem to be the most un-biased community I've come across regarding this subject, and I felt like it was time I started to participate. I know I'm an unusual case because of the drug history and concurrent methadone use, so I'm open to any suggestions/criticisms specific to my situation.

I've always wanted to join the military and unfortunately, due to poor choices I made in the past, I realize this goal is likely unrealistic and unattainable. I hope that in the near future, maybe the recruiting process will change to accommodate those who have messed up in the past but have turned their lives around and are asking for a second chance. By the time any changes like this would be made, I would have multiple years of clean time, so I would actually fit the criteria for having "turned my life around".

But for now, I take full accountability for the fact that in the scheme of things, I have not been clean for a very impressive amount of time thus far, and statistically, heroin users have an abysmal rate of success in getting and staying clean. So on face value, if I were someone else looking at myself, I would fully expect nothing more than failure. But from my side, I've always considered myself to be special and someone who bucks conventions. So I'll just have to prove my worth and ambition by putting in the work, not talking about it (like I'm doing here).

So anyways, hey guys. I intend to absorb as much information as I can from the experienced members here.

 

[lmaosuine]

Here is my pre-cycle bloodwork. I asked for testosterone to be checked, but they had to send the sample to a different lab for those results, so they'll take a bit longer to be returned.

 

[DedLift]

There are plenty of us here that did the impossible and kicked the dope. Your clean date starts when the methadone habit stops. In the meantime, focus on eating right, hitting the weights hard and kicking the drug habit. Having a goal of getting in shape is great, taking shortcuts to get there isn't going to help you in the long run. Set 1 goal. Just 1 and make it a methadone taper and take as much time as you need to kick it. I would advise against taking steroids and doing opiates simultaneously. Have the discipline to not try to do too much at once and again I say focus on diet, training and your taper. Your training and progress in the gym will grow exponentially once your body achieves homeostasis(balances out chemically after long term drug use).
Take it from someone who's been there and stay out of the underground until you're truly ready. Stick to the other parts of meso and welcome

 

[Perrin Aybara]

Welcome to Meso.

Coming up on four years sober here. IV heroin, meth, various opiates. Wasted almost two years at a methadone clinic before having a massive relapse and trying shooting up for the first time.

My advice to you is don't do this cycle yet. Methadone and Suboxone isn't really clean, I've been there myself and it's not really. Take some time and get off everything and get your head right, get some time living life without any substances in you. Get your nutrition down, get your training down. Lean up a bit, lose the belly fat and then put some muscle on naturally. I'd recommend a year or more, set some goals and reach them, really get your training and diet nailed down before you start a cycle.

You're going to do what you're going to do and I hope you don't take that the wrong way, but that's my two cents. Stick around here and check out the wealth of information on diet, training and AAS in the meantime.

I'm not going to lie to you, you're in for a hard road. Getting off methadone was worse than heroin or any other opiates because the withdrawals linger for so long. Transitioning onto Suboxone and then weaning yourself off that would probably be easier. It for sure jacks up your hormones, I got pretty fat on methadone myself.

Anyway, good luck to you on whatever you decide. Lots of other addicts here, by the way. There's a few threads on recovery in the general discussion forum.

 

[lmaosuine]

Thank you guys for your responses. It's obviously not what I want to hear, but I knew that going into my post. It's definitely what I need to hear. Also appreciate the suggestions about the recovery threads, I'll check those out.

As fellow addicts, you likely know the urge for instant gratification and the difficulty with impulse control. Anyway, it helps to be taken seriously and not derided when I post my ambitions.

I've told a few friends IRL about my plans to start gear and I got similar responses; one thing at a time, focus on getting sober first. I guess it's time for me to stop making bad decisions, and instead listening to the advice of others who have been through it before.

I appreciate that you guys took me seriously and took the time to give your advice. It's not going to be fun, and it's going to be very hard to resist at times, but I'm going to try to follow all the advice I've received, and NOT start a cycle until I've reached my natural plateau, and more importantly, be freed of my dependence on opiates.

Thanks guys.

 

[Eman]

Welcome to meso man.

I came across your post and I considered responding but held off because I could think of two members on here that would be able to give you some very insightful advice about your situstionand thought they might stop through and I'm glad they did.

You don't want to run that test just yet but I hope you stick around for a bit because you can learn some shit while you stay natural and get straight with everything. Best of luck.

 

[Smokey McPot]

Welcome brother

 

[wedorecover]

Hey bros,

I've been lurking this forum for the last week, looking for a good source. I pinned (heh) down what I think to be a reliable vendor, so now I'm just waiting for my pack to arrive. Based on what I've read, I don't think I'll be disappointed.

I don't really know where to start, so I'm just gonna throw it all out there. I'm 25 years old. 5'9", 150lbs. I lifted throughout high school and got pretty good natural results - 6 reps of 225 on bench press, but that was my peak (and I neglected legs). I stopped lifting consistently once I got in a steady relationship in my senior year. After that, things started to go downhill.

Over the next few years, I went to college and lifted sporadically. I got increasingly involved with drugs until I finally became a full-blown heroin addict and ended up checking myself into rehab at 120lbs.

Fast forward to today. I've been clean for about 4 months, going to the local methadone clinic daily. I'm back at school and am graduating with my BA by the end of this summer. Unfortunately I feel that the methadone is suppressing my testosterone production, and I'm growing a ridiculously disgusting gut (I'm skinny fat, and a notoriously hard gainer). Last week, I resumed going to the gym, motivated by the prospect of tapering off the methadone and being completely clean and non-dependent on any substances (except sipping on some juice of course).

A few years ago I tried a cycle of Epistane followed by Nolvadex for PCT. It was amazing - I didn't increase my calorie intake, but I made significant gains in strength and weight, and noticed I felt different while on the Nolvadex. I had a blood panel taken after PCT and my testosterone was flagged "High" at 978 ng/dl. I was so proud of that, I would have the results on my fridge if I kept the printout.

Anyway, I'm hitting the gym hard to prepare for my upcoming first "real" cycle. I ordered Test E and Arimidex (would've ordered Aromasin but it wasn't available from the source I used). I'm planning on running just test at 500mg a week, pinning 250mg twice a week, and taking the arimidex if symptoms start to occur.

The only thing I'm worried about is that I ordered a high concentration preparation of Test E - 500mg/ml, and I read (too late) that this concentration can be considerably more painful to pin. If I order sterile grapeseed oil, would I be able to draw that into the syringe in a 1:1 ratio with the amount of liquid containing 250mg of test, then shake to mix for a more comfortable experience?

Though I have a history of heroin abuse, I always stayed loyal to the foil - never graduated to the needle. I'm not scared of using needles for IM injections, though. I understand the general process, I think - insert the 1" needle hilt-deep, aspirate to ensure a vein or artery was not hit, then slowly depress the plunger.

Anyway, I've been lurking these forums because they seem to be the most un-biased community I've come across regarding this subject, and I felt like it was time I started to participate. I know I'm an unusual case because of the drug history and concurrent methadone use, so I'm open to any suggestions/criticisms specific to my situation.

I've always wanted to join the military and unfortunately, due to poor choices I made in the past, I realize this goal is likely unrealistic and unattainable. I hope that in the near future, maybe the recruiting process will change to accommodate those who have messed up in the past but have turned their lives around and are asking for a second chance. By the time any changes like this would be made, I would have multiple years of clean time, so I would actually fit the criteria for having "turned my life around".

But for now, I take full accountability for the fact that in the scheme of things, I have not been clean for a very impressive amount of time thus far, and statistically, heroin users have an abysmal rate of success in getting and staying clean. So on face value, if I were someone else looking at myself, I would fully expect nothing more than failure. But from my side, I've always considered myself to be special and someone who bucks conventions. So I'll just have to prove my worth and ambition by putting in the work, not talking about it (like I'm doing here).

So anyways, hey guys. I intend to absorb as much information as I can from the experienced members here.

My clean date is 06/26/12 next month I will have 4 years I shot speed daily and spent lots of time in jail cells there is more to life brother taper off for sure and find a meeting walk in there and tell them the truth about where you are at if you reach out they will help you learn to stay clean one day at a time

 

[Roger rabbit]

Thank you guys for your responses. It's obviously not what I want to hear, but I knew that going into my post. It's definitely what I need to hear. Also appreciate the suggestions about the recovery threads, I'll check those out.

As fellow addicts, you likely know the urge for instant gratification and the difficulty with impulse control. Anyway, it helps to be taken seriously and not derided when I post my ambitions.

I've told a few friends IRL about my plans to start gear and I got similar responses; one thing at a time, focus on getting sober first. I guess it's time for me to stop making bad decisions, and instead listening to the advice of others who have been through it before.

I appreciate that you guys took me seriously and took the time to give your advice. It's not going to be fun, and it's going to be very hard to resist at times, but I'm going to try to follow all the advice I've received, and NOT start a cycle until I've reached my natural plateau, and more importantly, be freed of my dependence on opiates.

Thanks guys.

Former millitary here: 95 bravo United States Army

You can actually still get in. Stay clean for a few years, do some community programs to show you want to help your community etc. make a paper trail of how you are turning your life around and then start hanging out with recruiters Maybe doing volunteer work etc. remember they can wave anyone into the army, marines or Air Force.

You just have to put the work in to prove that's what you really want.

 

[lmaosuine]

@Roger rabbit Man, you don't even know how excited that makes me. All the research I've done so far, both online and by visiting recruiting offices, seems to say anyone with my kind of drug history is automatically and permanently DQ'ed.

But that just doesn't make sense to me - for people who can prove that they've turned their lives around, the military has the capability to provide (especially for people such as myself) a system of discipline that encourages self growth and personal responsibility, and also, if it's anything like fraternity hazing (which I've heard it's like extreme version 2.0 of), it importantly creates a sense of comraderie and brothership between guys who are going through it together and relying on each other to have their backs.

I've had well paying office jobs but I wanted to kill myself because the work days were so tedious. I want adventure, and to explore the world. I want to tell my kids, when I have them, that their father believed in something and committed his life to it, which I think would not only set a good example for them, but give me an amazing opportunity of a lifetime along the way.

Thank you for your post, brother. Sometimes I get discouraged and start entertaining the prospect that I may just have to set my sights lower and settle for less, something more mediocre that I'm not passionate about. But hearing things like what you said in your post gives me a tremendous amount of hope and reassurance that if I clean my life up and do everything straight and by the books, I still have a shot at my dream. Thank you so much for relating your experience because it could not be any more relevant to my life and you may have been a stranger along the way who gave me a little push in the right direction to go for my goal and not give up- however many years it takes, however many waivers I have to fill out, it will all be 100% worth it if I just keep moving forwards and don't let the statistics discourage me.

So I just want to emphasize again just to release a bit of raging positive energy I found your information invaluable, and my dream of serving in the armed forces may not be so unattainable after all. Again, I can't thank you enough for your first-hand experience and input.

 

[lmaosuine]

Well, I just had a visit with the methadone doctor. I insisted that we begin tapering down my dose at 10mg per week. I know it will be uncomfortable, but I'm completely absorbing myself in the gym.

The doctor put up quite a resistance to me proposing to taper off the 'done. He suggested if my blood test comes back showing low T, I might be able to do TRT - but first of all, the school health center is very conservative and I don't think they would get behind that for someone my age, and second, I have plans on doing my own TRT after I'm cleared from the methadone, lol. Will keep you guys updated on the taper if anyone's interested. It's certainly not going to be pleasant, but I'm motivated and at a point in my life where relapsing and falling back into that tangled web of pain and sorrow is NOT appealing nor is it an option for me anymore. I'm slowly but surely escaping the clutches of the 'done, and I just know I'll be a happier person when I'm completely off of it.

 

[Perrin Aybara]

Methadone Clinics are evil, they don't want to taper you off because they want you paying them every week.

I had an actual prescription for over a year and 120 40's at CVS was $36. When I went to the clinic it was $13/day regardless of dose. Clinics are there for profit, plain and simple.

If you can switch over to Suboxone at some point and taper it down it'll be much less unpleasant. I've kicked both cold turkey and Suboxone wasn't even a fraction of what methadone was suffering wise.

 

[lmaosuine]

I agree 100%, it's all about the money for them. I understand they're a business, but it's just a grey area I guess.

I've probably had more experience with Suboxone than I have methadone. The plan so far with my doctor is to get me down to 30mg as fast as possible, then switch me over to suboxone because I'm likely going on a research trip to Peru this summer funded by my university, and there sure as hell aren't any methadone clinics down there, (it's also in such a short amount of time from now that there's no way I'll completely kick the methadone by then) so what I'm planning is to get a months worth of Suboxone before my summer trip that I can just take with me and use while I'm down there. Then when I get back to the US, I can jump off the Suboxone and be done with it. (I've cold turkeyed off 16mg Subutex per day and it was semi hellish but it was bearable. I know I can do it again). I'm just tired of this shit getting in the way of my life and things I want to do. What's the point of being sober if you can't enjoy any hobbies or engage in activities you find make life worth living?

Edit: PS, that's good to know about the Suboxone kick being more tolerable than the methadone kick. I've experienced the Suboxone kick at its worst and I'm still here to talk about it, so I would have no problem doing it again.