Jeffg353
New Member
Shit...I'm sorry to hear that. Are u in any pain? How long have u been running the GH as of now? Noticing any improvement?
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Chinese Hgh Standoff, Ansomone Vs Haiziyuan Vs 'Good' Generics?
- Thread starter Naugahyde
- Start date
Naugahyde
Member
Yes afraid so mate. Have arthritis too - on schedule 1 painkillers... So desperate to try other options. Went down alternative therapy route also - might as well have thrown money into the wind!
Fibro causes constant pain but also effects muscle recovery post exercise, negatively. It feels a bit like the day after a fight, everyday. So figured Gh is well worth a trial, what's to lose?
Expecting delivery any day now, will log progress from start to finish.
Fibro causes constant pain but also effects muscle recovery post exercise, negatively. It feels a bit like the day after a fight, everyday. So figured Gh is well worth a trial, what's to lose?
Expecting delivery any day now, will log progress from start to finish.
Naugahyde
Member
You worked out what the little freebie 'disc' with the Ansomone is yet? - that stumps a few people! nice touch. All the best
Few studies on link between Fibro & Ghd:
Growth hormone treatment for sustained pain reduction and improvement in quality of life in severe fibromyalgia. - PubMed - NCBI
Adult Growth Hormone Deficiency in Fibromyalgia
Adult growth hormone deficiency in patients with fibromyalgia. - PubMed - NCBI
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Jeffg353
New Member
Hoping those blood test results come in tomorrow...taking forever
My source for the Zptropin posted some testing he had done on them. Now this was testing done by the source not an anonymous member so have to take it for what it's worth plus it looks like it's in Russian (not 100% sure of language)
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Naugahyde
Member
I'll have to ask my Lithuanian/Russian ex flatmate to translate for you. She was totally gorgeous in an Ice Queen way! Never heard of Zptropin to be honest. Personally I'd stick with 'known' manufacturers myself but of course they could be good.
Have you an expected Igf for the Anso's? They should be accurately dosed being Pharma, so shouldn't be seeing astronomic scores like on some generics, like Godtropin. I know it's kinda nice to get extra Gh for free but personally I prefer accurate doses. Wildly overdosed vials makes me question the professionalism/purity of the manufacturing process. Someone's going to slam me now for being ungrateful for Godt's saintly generosity here, I know it!
Naugahyde
Member
Just converted my levels from nmol to Ng and it's around 150 so your levels are pretty low mate as you already suggested. I would try to get a referral to an Endocrinologist asap. If you are diagnosed with Adult GH deficiency & can get prescribed Pharma Hgh with Doctors supervision & regular hormone panels that is infinitely preferable to any DIY approach, good though the advice here can be it doesn't come close to doing it right. What have you been up to that might have 'fried' your HPTA?
Good luck!
Thanks.
2.5 years blast and cruise on steroids. I don't know if this can affect it like that.
Age 19 - IGF-1 387
Age 22 - IGF-1 288
After that some mixed lower and higher values, at age 25 (already on steroids) IGF-1 123 followed by IGF-1 252 the next month. I think this is rather caused by some other factor than GHD from a pituitary tumor.
Recent IGF-1 results in the last 6 months have been: 165, 110, 130. Fluctuates a lot.
I have noticed that my IGF-1 is lowered by these factors:
* Tamoxifen (confirmed in literature)
* Liver support drugs, for example Milk Thistle (confirmed in literature)
* Trenbolone (goes against animal tests where it actually boosts IGF-1, although I've seen some reports of it lowering it)
I think maybe long-term Exemestane and Pramipexole have affected it and shouldn't blame steroids. Those two drugs have shown to boost IGF-1, but who knows what they do in the long run.
I will try more to figure the underlying cause myself and isolate it before going to a doctor. Going to a doctor to claim GHD means that I need to get off gear and do a PCT (after 2.5 years on) because obviously they will look at a variety of hormones.
Age 22 - IGF-1 288
After that some mixed lower and higher values, at age 25 (already on steroids) IGF-1 123 followed by IGF-1 252 the next month. I think this is rather caused by some other factor than GHD from a pituitary tumor.
Recent IGF-1 results in the last 6 months have been: 165, 110, 130. Fluctuates a lot.
I have noticed that my IGF-1 is lowered by these factors:
* Tamoxifen (confirmed in literature)
* Liver support drugs, for example Milk Thistle (confirmed in literature)
* Trenbolone (goes against animal tests where it actually boosts IGF-1, although I've seen some reports of it lowering it)
I think maybe long-term Exemestane and Pramipexole have affected it and shouldn't blame steroids. Those two drugs have shown to boost IGF-1, but who knows what they do in the long run.
I will try more to figure the underlying cause myself and isolate it before going to a doctor. Going to a doctor to claim GHD means that I need to get off gear and do a PCT (after 2.5 years on) because obviously they will look at a variety of hormones.
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Jeffg353
New Member
Jeffg353
New Member
Protocol for testing...10iu IM in delt at 2hrs and 45 min before blood drawl. Injection at 7am blood taken at 945am.
There was about 30 min difference between this test (Ansomone) and previous test for greys (3 hrs and 15 min after injection) so perhaps I peak at or after 3hrs.
There was about 30 min difference between this test (Ansomone) and previous test for greys (3 hrs and 15 min after injection) so perhaps I peak at or after 3hrs.
Jeffg353
New Member
Speaking of grey tops...3 kits from TP finally landed. A few weeks late and a minor misunderstanding but better late than never.
Your in Europe someplace? I was trying to figure out what it means if you're on Schedule 1 painkillers? If you were in the states you would be self medicating with street drugs like heroin, methaqualone, or lsd. Or, you were being prescribed weed for your pain because weed is the only schedule 1 in the states that is prescribed by Dr's.
Schedule 1 drugs have no medical use which has weed being an anomaly. What drugs are schedule 1 where you are @Naugahyde?
Naugahyde
Member
In the UK mate, you are correct I've got my schedules mixed up here!
We use the same expression 'scheduled' or 'controlled' drugs, but there are some differences with the USA. To clarify I'm on UK schedule 2 Doctor prescribed MST ( Opiate based slow release painkillers). In addition to other low/non scheduled meds. No schedule 1, my mistake.
No self medication either - apart from a short Deca run if that counts!
As you probably know steroid possession is legal here. Importation too, but only for personal use and only what you can physically carry through the border. Turkey is a popular BB destination from here. Ordering steroids online/by mail is actually illegal...but loosely enforced.
UK doesn't sanction medical marijuana. It's technically illegal, but again rarely enforced for possession.
Jeffg353
New Member
Opiates will decrease ur testosterone levels. And theres a direct correlation to test levels and pain sensation. There's no official studies of their effects on GH or IGF levels but they believe that chronic use leads to reductions in both. No studies performed on GH-replacement therapy in opioid dependent adults.
Naugahyde
Member
Unfortunately I'm allergic to NSAID painkillers, so that doesn't leave me a helluva lot of options...
Remember it was the pain that came first, and came strong. It wasn't a consequence of opiate use..though you are correct they can further reduce pain thresholds over time/hyperalgesia syndrome. Doc reckoned this wasn't an issue with my current dosage.
Since Trt I've also reduced dosages so there is definitely a hormonal/hpta component here. I'm hoping that GH may be another part of the puzzle that 'puts me back together' again. I'm trying to be proactive in my treatment rather than just accepting this. I don't think I have anything to lose to be honest. The alternative going forward of a lifetime of chronic pain/toxic meds isn't really an attractive one!
Thanks for the advice though, it's always appreciated
Naugahyde
Member
Rather than trying to do that yourself with all the guesswork and potential blind alleys that might involve, maybe just try to find the 'right' Doctor you can be honest with about your use of anabolics & who lets face it is best placed to diagnose you?
Good luck anyways whatever you decide I hope you get it sorted.
Jeffg353
New Member
With all the science and technology we have available there should be something to help. Now that opiates are finally getting the negative publicity/attention maybe the pharma companies will investigate new therapies. I know there's not much money to be made in curing a disease which is why big pharma focuses on treating the symptoms. But public perception is starting to change so they'll be forced to change with it.
Jeffg353
New Member
Perhaps being on cycle for so long has shut down ur hypothalamus which controls ur pituitary which in turn controls growth hormone production which could result in decreasing/fluctuating igf
Naugahyde
Member
Finally....! I think I saw a 17 serum with same protocol on Ansos recently. So...a little lower than expected but not too bad right ?
Now just waiting on those Igf results...
I do think opiates do have an indispensable place in chronic intractable pain.The big problem is with massively excessive prescribing, and abuse.
Though Big Pharma is now turning away from Opioids to an extent, bad press but also because the patents have long expired to generics so they can only now make the big money with innovative delivery systems/slow release etc. It does mean they are R/D'ing new pain treatments, which can only be a good thing I agree.
Jeffg353
New Member
We've been talking about this in so many different threads can't remember half of them. Anyway, here they are...
Ansomone GH serum and IGF-1 results.
