FourOneDeuxFitt
Member
If signs of gyno I wouldn’t run or continue HCG. It has the ability to make it worse.
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Trying not to do the nube shuffle.
- Thread starter The ole man
- Start date
The ole man
Member
Updated...
1-12 weeks Test E 300/ml twice a week
1-4 weeks epistane 20/30/40/50
1- 12 weeks arimidex as needed
11-14weeks hcg at 500 iu twice a week
16-20 clomid at 50/25/25/25
16--20 nolva at 40/20/20/20
And If I see any high estro signs on week 11 thru 14 if not already using Adex, add small dose of Nolva...
So I need about 5000 iu of HCG..
atm its the only thing I havent procured..
I will get it purchased asap...
From what I read, it is to be used almost immediately.
How long have you held a bottle before using?
1-12 weeks Test E 300/ml twice a week
1-4 weeks epistane 20/30/40/50
1- 12 weeks arimidex as needed
11-14weeks hcg at 500 iu twice a week
16-20 clomid at 50/25/25/25
16--20 nolva at 40/20/20/20
And If I see any high estro signs on week 11 thru 14 if not already using Adex, add small dose of Nolva...
So I need about 5000 iu of HCG..
atm its the only thing I havent procured..
I will get it purchased asap...
From what I read, it is to be used almost immediately.
How long have you held a bottle before using?
The ole man
Member
Well im gonna go grab some coffee with my Daughter, and spend a little time with her.
I appreciate the fuck out of you letting me pick your brain, and learn a few things from you!
I post up the pre cycle blood work when they post it to my chart..
I'm wondering just how low my test is gonna be at 46..
I’m currently running 600mg week bc I also got test e 300 along with 40mg dbol, 30mg on my 2 off days from the gym. I don’t push an air bubble in when I inject so I do lose maybe .05-.1 in the barrel each shot. But yeah I’m going into my 3rd week of injections now. I initially bloated up from dbol, then I started taking Adex .5 on injection days and the bloat is much less. I’m up 12 lb after getting the bloat under control.
The ole man
Member
when you say you lose .05 to .1, your talking when you flip the rig upside down and tap on it, and push a little out to be positive not to inject any air?
So you figure that the dbol is what most likely caused your need for adex on injection days? So if i'm thinking correctly, the Test e plus the Dbol together would double the aromazation happening causing for adex to be used.
And if you were just running Test E there would not be as much test to be aromatized into Estro, so the need for adex would be less, or maybe not at all, depending on one's genetics..
Is that the way you understand it too?
Well the test e really hasn’t kicked in yet, the dbol aromatizes enough on its own, And I just noticed I got like insanely bloated after about a week on the dbol so after about a week and a half I just added a .5 dose of liquid adex that’s RC quality so likely to be under dosed, on injection days so that’s only maybe a milligram a week, and it’s helped the bloat and I haven’t noticed any low estrogen sides.
But yeah I’d say get some adex or aromasin and just have it on deck in case you feel you need it. I definitely waited until I had been bloated as a pig for almost a week and couldn’t take it anymore to start adex. I wanted to wait for nipple issues but I don’t think I would get that anyway, I have a small amount of prexisting gyno from puberty and using Xanax and opiates during and after puberty for years, and I’ve heard people say that the sensitivity and shit is just when the tissue initially starts to grow. Idk.
But yeah I’d say get some adex or aromasin and just have it on deck in case you feel you need it. I definitely waited until I had been bloated as a pig for almost a week and couldn’t take it anymore to start adex. I wanted to wait for nipple issues but I don’t think I would get that anyway, I have a small amount of prexisting gyno from puberty and using Xanax and opiates during and after puberty for years, and I’ve heard people say that the sensitivity and shit is just when the tissue initially starts to grow. Idk.
The ole man
Member
Well im running epistane the first 4 weeks and its anti-estrogenic. Im wondering if something is anti-estrogenic if it actually combats the estro from Test E.
Does that make sense?
But if I read this correctly, it does, but shouldnt be releid upon solely..
evolutionary.org/what-is-epistane-methylepitiostanol
What is Epistane?
Fig 1. Epistane Chemical Structure
Chemical Structure: 2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol.
Epistane has been mistaken as an anti-E at times, although it does not cause Estrogen related side effects and has been reported by users to lower Estrogen, it should not be confused as a pure AI (Aromatase Inhibitor) compound. For the Bodybuilder and trained Athlete, Epistane works as a Anabolic agent that delivers dry, lean muscle gains, and works great for cutting as well. Epistane is much more Anabolic than most people realize and is often under estimated because it is an analogue of an anti-estrogen drug used in Japan. This has caused some people to mistakenly think Epistane has the same properties, yet that is not the case.
The ole man
Member
My macros
Carbs: 309 G per day.
Protein: 206 G per day.
Fats: 76 G per day.
Should I change them for on cycle?
Carbs: 309 G per day.
Protein: 206 G per day.
Fats: 76 G per day.
Should I change them for on cycle?
The ole man
Member
Well I dont guess there gonna give me any TRT with these numbers.
FLAG
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 874 ng/dL 240 - 871 ng/dl H
FREE TESTOSTERONE CAL 13.64 ng/dL 4.7 - 24.4 ng/dL
ALBUMIN 4.4 g/dL 3.5 - 5.0 g/dL
SEX HORMONE BINDING GLOBULIN 59.0 nmol/L 11 - 78 nmol/L
874 And I flagged high,, wtf?
I did a 4 week cycle of havoc at 30 mg in dec, PCT on nolva Jan and using Liquid clen first 3 weeks in March, and nothing since then! I mean I feel great, and my energy is great too..
That just seems high for 46?
Probably higher than mine pre cycle and I’m 24 lol
FourOneDeuxFitt
Member
Yeah I agree. But, shit I also wouldn’t be complaining about it at 46 either!!!
The ole man
Member
Ya I cant be upset about them numbers! Actually pretty stoked,,
but that was way off from what I was expecting!
Damn I was thinking TRT was a done deal...
Well does me having good levels say anything about how my body is gonna react to AAS? Or PCT?
Actually it says my Nolva is of damn good quality, Im gonna think.. That I could get my levels back up to that.
But also I only did a 4 week cycle of epistane, so my shutdown wasnt very hard or very long....
Ok well, guess we are coming down to my first aas cycle...
I got like Buck fever in my tree stand!
The ole man
Member
Question???
So my thyroid stim hormone level came back low, and now my Dr is requesting I do additional tests.
1. Do you think that my Pct effected that?
Or my Liquid clen?
2. I started taking the epistane 2 days ago, and will there blood test show that and should I wait to get bloods for a few days to let it clear from my system?
TSH 0.146 mIU/L 0.300 - 5.000 mIU/L Low
So my thyroid stim hormone level came back low, and now my Dr is requesting I do additional tests.
1. Do you think that my Pct effected that?
Or my Liquid clen?
2. I started taking the epistane 2 days ago, and will there blood test show that and should I wait to get bloods for a few days to let it clear from my system?
TSH 0.146 mIU/L 0.300 - 5.000 mIU/L Low
The ole man
Member
Nevermind.. A quick google search told me all I needed...
Liquid clen is the culprit.... It was about a week after a 3 week cycle that I had bloods taken...
Yes. Clen has a similar effect to ephedrine.
It's mode of action is through the Beta-2 adrenoreceptors. It's a selective Beta-2 agonist.
Stimulation of this receptor causes more T4 to be converted to T3 in your thyroid by the de-iodinase enzyme. (80% of your bodies cicrculating free plasma T3 is converted from T4). i.e. Free T3 in your body = T3 produced by your thyroid(20%) + The T3 converted from the T4 produced by your thyroid via the de-iodinase enzyme, which basically just cleaves off an iodine molecule(80%).
Now, after about 2 weeks of Clen ED( results will vary acording to dosage and physiology, but I would say 2 weeks at 100mcgs/day for a 180lb male will translate to 2 weeks plus/minus 2-3 days), your T4 (that's being producedby the thyroid) that's being converted to the metabolically active T3(Which is what is chiefly responsible for your increase in Metabolic rate, and which is being produced in quantities: 20% by your thyroid and 80% by the T4-T3 conversion I mentioned above) will start being converted to rT3 (reverse T3), the molecular mirror-image of T3 that's metabolically inert. At that moment Clen's stops working and your Plasma T3 levels drop, your rT3 levels go up, and your T4 levels stay about roughly the same. All this basically adds up to to a drop in your metabolic rate until your de-iodinase enzyme can basically re-charge itself back to normal levels, and start back up converting thyroid produced T4 to T3 again via the cleaving of an iodine molecule.
As mentioned, L-taurine ( A very cheap, colorless, and virtually tasteless amino acid. 300g goes for $10 or less) in the 6-10g range..in 2 split dosages AM and PM, can stop this T4-rT3 conversion for another one week or two through cell voluminization.
The ole man
Member
So updated....
1-12 weeks Test E 300/ml twice a week
1-4 weeks epistane 30/40/40/50
1- 12 weeks arimidex as needed
5-10 Mk-2866 Ostarine
11-14weeks hcg at 500 iu twice a week
16-20 clomid at 50/25/25/25
16--20 nolva at 40/20/20/20
I started off a week of 20 mg epistane last week, and will start week 1 Wed night with my first Pin
1-12 weeks Test E 300/ml twice a week
1-4 weeks epistane 30/40/40/50
1- 12 weeks arimidex as needed
5-10 Mk-2866 Ostarine
11-14weeks hcg at 500 iu twice a week
16-20 clomid at 50/25/25/25
16--20 nolva at 40/20/20/20
I started off a week of 20 mg epistane last week, and will start week 1 Wed night with my first Pin
The ole man
Member
Decided Tuesday night was just as good as any..
Lol you do get a lil buck fever the first pin..
Was simple and quick. Never felt a thing...
Lol you do get a lil buck fever the first pin..
Was simple and quick. Never felt a thing...
Sk8man101
Member
Holy shit there are some patient motherfuckers in this thread.
@Eman @Spooby @Burrr
@FourOneDeuxFitt
And good thing too cause you guys saved this guy from a fucking trainwreck and he didn’t even seem appreciative about it.
@Eman @Spooby @Burrr
@FourOneDeuxFitt
And good thing too cause you guys saved this guy from a fucking trainwreck and he didn’t even seem appreciative about it.
FourOneDeuxFitt
Member
Well, guess we all have to learn somewhere. I have no problem sharing my learning experience and personal experience (not that I’m some type of guru by any means) with someone who seems to be willing to do some research and learn for themselves firstly and accept constructive criticism from others with a bit more knowledge and experience secondly. Some people are so damn hard headed it’s ridiculous. Don’t know why half of them even bring it up in this forum when they already know what’s best for them, their diet is “spot on”, and can’t have a more comprehensive training plan than what they’ve been stuck on for the last x amount of months maybe even years ya know. All good though. I was once that guy as well a few years back and to this day still learn something new damn near every day reading through this forum, based off of others experiences, and my own trial and error.
The ole man
Member
Thank You brother!
The ole man
Member
Well first thing I learned is that no pip the day of, has no bearing on the days after...
