Has the board been invaded by congenital morons?

[readalot]

U

I havent been active here for that long, but ive been around on other forums for quite a while, and this isnt just a meso issue, in response i offer the following devils advocate.



is it really an issue with ignorance or lack of AAS//PED usage? or is it an influx of unteachable jackasses and nobodies just here to suck off source cock.
I havent been here as a contributing member for long, but this is what i see in most posts.


At what stage do you write off these types of individuals as validation seeking as they seem?

I get and agree with your sentiment. Some of the people i enjoy helping/interacting with are TEACHABLE noobs or beginners. the people that are authentically here or on other forums to better themselves and learn.
But on the same card, i think its just as important to make it crystal clear that the unteachable ones that continue their ineffective or self destructive behavior be clearly and loudly called out on it, not for their sake, but for other members sake that may not post themselves, but may read the thread in question in the future.

to really be focused on best safe practices, efficacy, and harm reduction in the AAS/PED world there needs to be a balance of patience for those just learning, and intolerance for those that are just seeking validation.
Sometimes which youre dealing with isnt always readily apparent, and in those cases i believe benefit of the doubt is a good rule of thumb, but only to a certain degree.
some people are in fact idiots and are following objectively bad practices, some people deserve "bullying" for the good of any lurkers reading the thread so that what is expected as harm reduction/best practices is fully understood.

 

[MindlessWork]

I havent been active here for that long, but ive been around on other forums for quite a while, and this isnt just a meso issue, in response i offer the following devils advocate.



is it really an issue with ignorance or lack of AAS//PED usage? or is it an influx of unteachable jackasses and nobodies just here to suck off source cock.
I havent been here as a contributing member for long, but this is what i see in most posts.


At what stage do you write off these types of individuals as validation seeking as they seem?

I get and agree with your sentiment. Some of the people i enjoy helping/interacting with are TEACHABLE noobs or beginners. the people that are authentically here or on other forums to better themselves and learn.
But on the same card, i think its just as important to make it crystal clear that the unteachable ones that continue their ineffective or self destructive behavior be clearly and loudly called out on it, not for their sake, but for other members sake that may not post themselves, but may read the thread in question in the future.

to really be focused on best safe practices, efficacy, and harm reduction in the AAS/PED world there needs to be a balance of patience for those just learning, and intolerance for those that are just seeking validation.
Sometimes which youre dealing with isnt always readily apparent, and in those cases i believe benefit of the doubt is a good rule of thumb, but only to a certain degree.
some people are in fact idiots and are following objectively bad practices, some people deserve "bullying" for the good of any lurkers reading the thread so that what is expected as harm reduction/best practices is fully understood.

Well said and this phenomenon isn't all that new and has been happening all over.

 

[Millard]

I get and agree with your sentiment. Some of the people i enjoy helping/interacting with are TEACHABLE noobs or beginners. the people that are authentically here or on other forums to better themselves and learn.
But on the same card, i think its just as important to make it crystal clear that the unteachable ones that continue their ineffective or self destructive behavior be clearly and loudly called out on it, not for their sake, but for other members sake that may not post themselves, but may read the thread in question in the future.

to really be focused on best safe practices, efficacy, and harm reduction in the AAS/PED world there needs to be a balance of patience for those just learning, and intolerance for those that are just seeking validation.
Sometimes which youre dealing with isnt always readily apparent, and in those cases i believe benefit of the doubt is a good rule of thumb, but only to a certain degree.

I couldn't have said it better. I would to emphasize this part of you assessment in particular: "Sometimes which youre dealing with isnt always readily apparent, and in those cases i believe benefit of the doubt is a good rule of thumb".

As far as "bullying" members is concerned, I don't think we should encourage it because the agenda isn't to attack the individual but to call out the ineffective, counterproductive, or harmful behaviors. Too many members use a poster's single bad idea, poor behavior as an excuse to continually harass, stalk, denigrate, and/or insult that poster for every subsequent post they make no matter how innocuous it may be.

As far as all the source fan boys are concerned - fan boy being my euphemism for source sycophants and dickriders - I don't understand the lack of self-awareness they show for what they are doing.

If they need more than one or two posts to sum up your experience - whether negative or positive - with a source, then they're a dickrider. There are plenty of them and dickriders of popular sources are not really any better than the dickriders of unpopular sources.

This is not promoting harm reduction. This is not holding the sources accountable. This is promoting the sources' agenda.

They need to stop. Just don't.

 

[Amgiji]

I get the whole elitist tendency for people to eliminate people from a community who disagree with them or who aren't "smart enough" to use AAS/PEDs.

I think many people explicitly want MESO to be an exclusive elite community. They don't want to have to deal with people with varying degrees of ignorance about AAS/PED use.

On the other hand, if MESO is really going to be about harm reduction, the elitist approach doesn't work. You don’t insult and harass and chase off those you disagree with. You don't exclude and eliminate those who make mistakes, ignore advice, and do "stupid" things. You must continually educate them about the potential harm of their behaviors and what can be done to reduce that harm. But most importantly, when they don't heed your advice and make mistakes, you must be patient and keep trying to help them see the truth.

Do you think harm reduction clinics reject and eliminate clients who do "stupid" things or make mistakes or don't heed advice? Does AA/NA tell people who fall off the wagon to fuck off and die, to never come back, insult them and tell them how stupid and weak they are. Of course not. That's not harm reduction.

If MESO really wants to be taken seriously as a harm reduction community, we can't take the elitist approach.

as a new person my experience has been

" just a bunch of old heads that don't want to deal with the people that start out at zero"

I've seen maybe 2 people above member level try to be helpful.

as apparently asking questions like what's the most common starting dose of "x" and if you need to fast or do anything special (you know all the things you need to know to do it safely)


is apparently spoon-feeding you and just intuit how to use a substance I have no knowledge of or experience with you know the antithesis of your stated message.

quote "There is no chemist genius master mind whos gonna spoonfeed you a magic recipe" you should have been able to intuit that yourself. and if there was what makes you think they would help? pity?" unquote

that's even if you can get a coherent message out of them, the rest of the time is reddit level insults, or holier than thou jerking off.

tl:dr you need to put the fear of God in everyone above member rank or just clean house at this point, if you want your website to resemble your description.

 

[Astartes]

as a new person my experience has been

" just a bunch of old heads that don't want to deal with the people that start out at zero"

I've seen maybe 2 people above member level try to be helpful.

as apparently asking questions like what's the most common starting dose of "x" and if you need to fast or do anything special (you know all the things you need to know to do it safely)


is apparently spoon-feeding you and just intuit how to use a substance I have no knowledge of or experience with you know the antithesis of your stated message.

quote "There is no chemist genius master mind whos gonna spoonfeed you a magic recipe" you should have been able to intuit that yourself. and if there was what makes you think they would help? pity?" unquote

that's even if you can get a coherent message out of them, the rest of the time is reddit level insults, or holier than thou jerking off.

tl:dr you need to put the fear of God in everyone above member rank or just clean house at this point, if you want your website to resemble your description.

Mmmmm… This is a bit skewed to say the least. “Old heads” have been around a long time. As a result they have answered 100s to 1000s of questions from “new heads”.

It becomes exhausting. When folks don’t take the time to use the search key prior to asking basic questions that are easily distinguishable as uneducated to at least a minor level…it very understandably irritates them.

I did it. They did it. Why should you be entitled to expect them to take the time out of their day to answer a question they have perhaps answered 20 times in the last two years?

I think the issue is that you get younger generations (as a very general statement… many of the young guns here have pride and capability, indeed _doing their research_) who have been allowed to become entitled and perceive themselves as the societal exemption.

As a rule, that really doesn’t fly here. You will be called out regardless of age, status, etc. (By the young guys too. They won’t put up with what they view as laziness either) The community is basically checking you and redirecting you. If you respond flippantly or with arrogance gloves come off.

Short of that this community is exceptionally accommodating and candidly quite informative.

 

[DECLAN]

as a new person my experience has been

" just a bunch of old heads that don't want to deal with the people that start out at zero"

I've seen maybe 2 people above member level try to be helpful.

as apparently asking questions like what's the most common starting dose of "x" and if you need to fast or do anything special (you know all the things you need to know to do it safely)


is apparently spoon-feeding you and just intuit how to use a substance I have no knowledge of or experience with you know the antithesis of your stated message.

quote "There is no chemist genius master mind whos gonna spoonfeed you a magic recipe" you should have been able to intuit that yourself. and if there was what makes you think they would help? pity?" unquote

that's even if you can get a coherent message out of them, the rest of the time is reddit level insults, or holier than thou jerking off.

tl:dr you need to put the fear of God in everyone above member rank or just clean house at this point, if you want your website to resemble your description.

Not everyone who gives you the "spoonfeeding" term is doing it out of superiority, laziness or just plain insult. If you have been on forums long enough, you will get tired of answering the same question over and over again.

There are so many new guys who jump into a cycle or buy peds without even knowing about compounds or have done the most basic research then come on here create a thread asking for help when they encounter bad side effects.

I will say 99% of any of the newbie questions can be answered by reading old posts, every topic is on the archives if you use the most basic function the board has. Yet, we still see critique my first cycle post everyday. What does that say?

We can see who are those guys willing to learn and those who just jump here to get gear or leech the information they need not planning to be part of the community. So when they say, use the search button, it doesn't mean they don't want to help you, it is the equivalent of "give a man a fish and he's going to eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he's gonna eat for a lifetime".

 

[dafqu1]

noone on this forum has the answers you're looking for amgiji I told you what the most masculinizing drugs are, thats all anyone knows. Noone knows a magic recipe to grow your cock or increase your height or give you a sharper jawline. You're better off going to a F2M forum and pretend to be a dyke and ask them for tips

 

[RiceNKimchi]

as a new person my experience has been

" just a bunch of old heads that don't want to deal with the people that start out at zero"

I've seen maybe 2 people above member level try to be helpful.

as apparently asking questions like what's the most common starting dose of "x" and if you need to fast or do anything special (you know all the things you need to know to do it safely)


is apparently spoon-feeding you and just intuit how to use a substance I have no knowledge of or experience with you know the antithesis of your stated message.

quote "There is no chemist genius master mind whos gonna spoonfeed you a magic recipe" you should have been able to intuit that yourself. and if there was what makes you think they would help? pity?" unquote

that's even if you can get a coherent message out of them, the rest of the time is reddit level insults, or holier than thou jerking off.

tl:dr you need to put the fear of God in everyone above member rank or just clean house at this point, if you want your website to resemble your description.

Go into this guy's profile. Just read the bullshit.

 

[Amgiji]

Not everyone who gives you the "spoonfeeding" term is doing it out of superiority, laziness or just plain insult. If you have been on forums long enough, you will get tired of answering the same question over and over again.

There are so many new guys who jump into a cycle or buy peds without even knowing about compounds or have done the most basic research then come on here create a thread asking for help when they encounter bad side effects.

I will say 99% of any of the newbie questions can be answered by reading old posts, every topic is on the archives if you use the most basic function the board has. Yet, we still see critique my first cycle post everyday. What does that say?

We can see who are those guys willing to learn and those who just jump here to get gear or leech the information they need not planning to be part of the community. So when they say, use the search button, it doesn't mean they don't want to help you, it is the equivalent of "give a man a fish and he's going to eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he's gonna eat for a lifetime".

relying on the search function has 2 major flaws.

1 no standardization.
for example, say you want to learn about how growth hormone works better while fasting what do search?

"GH" or "growth hormone" or "growthhormone" ? "when to take GH"?
"growth hormone fasting"? "growthhormone timing"?

do you sit there and try to think of every permutation someone might have asked before? or is it more efficient to just ask again?

2 you don't know what you don't know.

the search function works well for cross-referring what you already know you need to figure out, but does not help in any way for finding that information in the first place.

 

[DECLAN]

relying on the search function has 2 major flaws.

1 no standardization.
for example, say you want to learn about how growth hormone works better while fasting what do search?

"GH" or "growth hormone" or "growthhormone" ? "when to take GH"?
"growth hormone fasting"? "growthhormone timing"?

do you sit there and try to think of every permutation someone might have asked before? or is it more efficient to just ask again?

2 you don't know what you don't know.

the search function works well for cross-referring what you already know you need to figure out, but does not help in any way for finding that information in the first place.

Like I said, for the most basic questions the old threads with discussions cover thus. For intricate topics with details only experts would know, that's where you can make a new thread for it. But generally, almost all topics have been discussed already, you only need patience to read.

On the issue of only knowing what you know, I do not understand what you mean. If I don't know how to brew, I head over to the homebrew section and start with the stickies. If there's recipes for a certain compound I use the search function for it. If the compound is exotic and barely anyone makes it, then I would make a thread and hope someone with experience chimes in.

The pattern is you do not go asking for a hand out directly if you have not used the resources available in the open. That is what the board archives are for, this way clutter is kept at a minimum too.

 

[Astartes]

On the issue of only knowing what you know, I do not understand what you mean.

Too lazy to think critically for one’s self. Research leads to inquiry down additional roads. “I don’t know what I don’t know” … like everyone else… Translation… Lazy

 

[dafqu1]

relying on the search function has 2 major flaws.

1 no standardization.
for example, say you want to learn about how growth hormone works better while fasting what do search?

"GH" or "growth hormone" or "growthhormone" ? "when to take GH"?
"growth hormone fasting"? "growthhormone timing"?

do you sit there and try to think of every permutation someone might have asked before? or is it more efficient to just ask again?

2 you don't know what you don't know.

the search function works well for cross-referring what you already know you need to figure out, but does not help in any way for finding that information in the first place.

with just a simple search for "gh, hgh" 5 mins I found an experienced athlete on here talking about growth hormone and how he takes it about 40 minutes before a meal. He was taking it in the morning before breakfast and 40 mins before meal after workout. hes huge so thats probly how ur supposed to do it. Another post says u should split up hgh doses if you're taking more than 5-6 iu at a time. The thing is ur not going to find the information you want if you're looking up something like "growth hormone needed to grow to 6,4???". You have any other noob questions u want me to look up real quick for you while im on here babe??

 

[Amgiji]

Too lazy to think critically for one’s self. Research leads to inquiry down additional roads. “I don’t know what I don’t know” … like everyone else… Translation… Lazy

found in a 20 second google search.
"The phrase “you don’t know what you don’t know” is a simple, intentionally-redundant phrase that points to the fact that we can only work with the information that we have, and therefore, the information we don’t have, we don’t know about."

in other words, how do you know to look up a chemical, situation, process by name if you don't know it exists.

it's related to the "people don’t know what they want until you show it to them" problem

where focus testers found out you can't just ask people what they want as they'll just ask for the same thing they already have, as they don't know anything else.

you can't google words you don't know. for example try to find what "degranulation" is without using it as a search term. let me know when/if you can find it.

 

[RiceNKimchi]

found in a 20 second google search.
"The phrase “you don’t know what you don’t know” is a simple, intentionally-redundant phrase that points to the fact that we can only work with the information that we have, and therefore, the information we don’t have, we don’t know about."

in other words, how do you know to look up a chemical, situation, process by name if you don't know it exists.

it's related to the "people don’t know what they want until you show it to them" problem

where focus testers found out you can't just ask people what they want as they'll just ask for the same thing they already have, as they don't know anything else.

you can't google words you don't know. for example try to find what "degranulation" is without using it as a search term. let me know when/if you can find it.

This guy is your vibes.

 

[Astartes]

found in a 20 second google search.
"The phrase “you don’t know what you don’t know” is a simple, intentionally-redundant phrase that points to the fact that we can only work with the information that we have, and therefore, the information we don’t have, we don’t know about."

in other words, how do you know to look up a chemical, situation, process by name if you don't know it exists.

it's related to the "people don’t know what they want until you show it to them" problem

where focus testers found out you can't just ask people what they want as they'll just ask for the same thing they already have, as they don't know anything else.

you can't google words you don't know. for example try to find what "degranulation" is without using it as a search term. let me know when/if you can find it.

Correct… my statement then is corroborated…

That by the way, is how learning works… how human beings discover….

…..and yet you missed the simple meaning behind my post….

You are right…. Research is not for you. Stick to color by number books ….

 

[Amgiji]

Correct… my statement then is corroborated…

That by the way, is how learning works… how human beings discover….

…..and yet you missed the simple meaning behind my post….

You are right…. Research is not for you. Stick to color by number books ….

no, how learning works is when someone asks a question (now stay with me this will sound crazy) you give them the answer.

if you enroll in a university's chemistry class if you have a question the professor does not give you an unsorted stack of 1,000'S of Research Papers and says figure it out.

you voluntarily joined a group dedicated to gathering knowledge with the stated goal of harm reduction (strongly implied) if not outright stated that this goal will be accomplished via sharing the gathered information.

and yet you and many others here are baffled?/insulted? at the concept you might need to teach a new person something they don't know for them to understand it.

you can keep the coloring books you and your friends need them a lot more than me.

the whole "there was nothing on the internet so back in the day I almost died figuring out how to dose dbol by myself so you do too"

mentality goes against everything millard has said here
(if I got that wrong millard and I am putting words in your mouth please let me know)

 

[4Drago]

found in a 20 second google search.
"The phrase “you don’t know what you don’t know” is a simple, intentionally-redundant phrase that points to the fact that we can only work with the information that we have, and therefore, the information we don’t have, we don’t know about."

in other words, how do you know to look up a chemical, situation, process by name if you don't know it exists.

it's related to the "people don’t know what they want until you show it to them" problem

where focus testers found out you can't just ask people what they want as they'll just ask for the same thing they already have, as they don't know anything else.

you can't google words you don't know. for example try to find what "degranulation" is without using it as a search term. let me know when/if you can find it.

Wow, you've over come your dyslexia again
Good for you bud
Are you still crying and waiting for your source info and protocol?

 

[Amgiji]

Wow, you've over come your dyslexia again
Good for you bud
Are you still crying and waiting for your source info and protocol?

nah I'm not looking to argue anymore. I've figured out no one is going to tell me anything useful.

just lurking around waiting for someone else to ask a relevant question in a way you people actually answer.

that happens somewhat often the gh timing question was one example, another was someone asking for training.

just here to point out my experience has been the complete opposite of everything this intended

I get the whole elitist tendency for people to eliminate people from a community who disagree with them or who aren't "smart enough" to use AAS/PEDs.

I think many people explicitly want MESO to be an exclusive elite community. They don't want to have to deal with people with varying degrees of ignorance about AAS/PED use.

On the other hand, if MESO is really going to be about harm reduction, the elitist approach doesn't work. You don’t insult and harass and chase off those you disagree with. You don't exclude and eliminate those who make mistakes, ignore advice, and do "stupid" things. You must continually educate them about the potential harm of their behaviors and what can be done to reduce that harm. But most importantly, when they don't heed your advice and make mistakes, you must be patient and keep trying to help them see the truth.

Do you think harm reduction clinics reject and eliminate clients who do "stupid" things or make mistakes or don't heed advice? Does AA/NA tell people who fall off the wagon to fuck off and die, to never come back, insult them and tell them how stupid and weak they are. Of course not. That's not harm reduction.

If MESO really wants to be taken seriously as a harm reduction community, we can't take the elitist approach.

and as he owns the website he might want to know that.

 

[Astartes]

no, how learning works is when someone asks a question (now stay with me this will sound crazy) you give them the answer.

if you enroll in a university's chemistry class if you have a question the professor does not give you an unsorted stack of 1,000'S of Research Papers and says figure it out.

you voluntarily joined a group dedicated to gathering knowledge with the stated goal of harm reduction (strongly implied) if not outright stated that this goal will be accomplished via sharing the gathered information.

and yet you and many others here are baffled?/insulted? at the concept you might need to teach a new person something they don't know for them to understand it.

you can keep the coloring books you and your friends need them a lot more than me.

the whole "there was nothing on the internet so back in the day I almost died figuring out how to dose dbol by myself so you do too"

mentality goes against everything millard has said here
(if I got that wrong millard and I am putting words in your mouth please let me know)

Yep. Degree in virology, microbiology, minor in Criminalistics and graduated top of class in military ATC. Recruited for nuke program, studying for LSAT now because I want to…. Sure snowflake… I’m all wet on this one. Everything is against you. You are going to excel at life.

 

[Astartes]

and as he owns the website he might want to know that.

We aren’t hammering you because you aren’t smart enough. You probably are.

We are hammering you because you are a smart mouth Jack wagon who wants to argue with your sources of information. Repeatedly.

You haven’t shown the self wisdom or assessment or capability of realizing you are wrong, nor the humility of resetting and trying a different direction.

So keep beating yourself against the stone wall of the community. That has worked well for 100,000 years in society.

You have shown zero emotional intelligence and you are lazy. That is our pick point.

We get plenty of new guys asking silly questions. We raz them a bit and in doing so generally point them the direction they need, while making a point.

Those guys are wise or humble enough to reset, realize we are right and generally do some research. Usually they are welcomed when they begin asking questions again.

Not you though right? Gonna double down on your entitlement….and victim status