R
readalot
Guest
???
Surely you are messing with us.
Do you understand how your fT result was generated and what it tells you?
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Determining if I need TRT
- Thread starter G0ld
- Start date
Surely you are messing with us.
Do you understand how your fT result was generated and what it tells you?
G0ld
Banned
To be more accurate, 100 milligrams, which is a therapeutic dose, is supposed to give a testosterone level within the normal range, which is between 300 and 1,000 ng/dL.
With only 100 milligrams, it's impossible to go significantly beyond the natural range. There is a limit to how much testosterone the body can produce out of a single milligram of (synthetic) testosterone.
G0ld
Banned
What do you mean? It was generated from the analysis of a blood sample...
JC Grifter
Member
100% incorrect. I don’t do bloodwork 48 hours after an injection. I’ve always be more concerned where I’m at at the end of a week vs the peak 48 hours after an injection. If I do 100mg on a Sunday and draw blood on Friday, I’m over 1,000. So 48 hours drawn later would have me above the normal range. Stop all the guess work and just get started. It’s the only way you will know for sure. Granted that’s not the norm, but without bloodwork I’d have no idea how I respond to testosterone
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R
readalot
Guest
This is a direct IA fT assay. 28.83 is not in the low bottom of the 15 - 50 range. Your actual fT when converted from immunoassay would be 28.83 × approx. 7 or ~ 20 ng/dl (maybe a little less 15 to 20 ng/dl). A perfectly solid FT level.
More reading material here in case you are interested (but I know you already are well versed in all this):
Free test measurement units/format?
Got this value on free test a few months ago, I've seen free test displayed in various formats in multiple places on the internet but never understood what's the most common way to observe it. Also, feel free to give me your thoughts on the value itself. Is it of any significance without...
thinksteroids.com
clearheaded
Member
lol do I need TRT? answer no.... sooo im gunna do steroids now anyway.. ????
why take testosterone to get to same level you are at or possibly drop it? you know there is more involved than just test? your shutting down other hormones that keep you healthy aswell mentally healthy and will help your brain develop and become smarter.
your aromatization rate is variable man, it will depend on diet, sleep stress etc.
your body fluctuates T throughout the day. right before you wake up you may be 900, and afternoon 450..
your aromatization will be FAR better on your natural pulsatile test levels. plus you won't loose your libido or your fertility. whole host of other secondary neurosteroids some we dont even know about that you will be depriving your growing brain of..
dude, you know how many people on here did a cycle in there 20s only to regret wasting that cycle or how many guys did a cycle in 20s only to suffer mental health issues for years?
I bet 100mg will actually lower your test levels over the week period.
dude take some herbals/nutricuticals and see how high you can get your test.. heck take some high dose zinc and see if can hit upper range just from that..
what time of day did u get your blood taken?
you may have awesome genetics where u can maintain high test until your 45yo.. but if start pushing limits just to figure out if you are a high aromatize is a very stupid reason to start steroids.
I know tik tok and media make it seem like a great idea but alot of folks struggle with trt and some can never dial things in and have to quit and some never recover... heck I know several guys who started young and half are emotional wrecks, super sensitive, but also randomly aggressive, and have to take antidepressants. I mean there is a reason UGL often carry antidepressants.
are you prepared to damage your endocrine system? are you aware most people do stupid shit in there 20s thinking they know everything? Do you think 40 years of a needle and pills is good for your health? esp when you are not even in your prime yet and can do ALOT naturally still. some folks peak around 30 some even 35yo and then it starts going down..
Think maybe your lady may want kids more than muscles?
Do research for AT LEAST 3 years. talk to guys in 30s and 40s who started AAS early at your gym and see what they say. do everything naturally till then.
I mean its stupid to start steroids before your 26yo, youngest should be 32ish yo.
promise you will regret it.. take some more blood work over a couple years and see how high you can get your natural test. We can tell by how your talking you have no idea what your doing.
just know its more complicated than testosterone and taking AI to help estrogen (remember AI are toxic can cause eye damage etc).. MANY guys will develop ED from "pushing levels".. do you want to risk having a limp dick and taking more pills to try and figure it out in ur 20s?
and again remember a reason why anabolic stores sell antidepressants, acne and dick pills...
why take testosterone to get to same level you are at or possibly drop it? you know there is more involved than just test? your shutting down other hormones that keep you healthy aswell mentally healthy and will help your brain develop and become smarter.
your aromatization rate is variable man, it will depend on diet, sleep stress etc.
your body fluctuates T throughout the day. right before you wake up you may be 900, and afternoon 450..
your aromatization will be FAR better on your natural pulsatile test levels. plus you won't loose your libido or your fertility. whole host of other secondary neurosteroids some we dont even know about that you will be depriving your growing brain of..
dude, you know how many people on here did a cycle in there 20s only to regret wasting that cycle or how many guys did a cycle in 20s only to suffer mental health issues for years?
I bet 100mg will actually lower your test levels over the week period.
dude take some herbals/nutricuticals and see how high you can get your test.. heck take some high dose zinc and see if can hit upper range just from that..
what time of day did u get your blood taken?
you may have awesome genetics where u can maintain high test until your 45yo.. but if start pushing limits just to figure out if you are a high aromatize is a very stupid reason to start steroids.
I know tik tok and media make it seem like a great idea but alot of folks struggle with trt and some can never dial things in and have to quit and some never recover... heck I know several guys who started young and half are emotional wrecks, super sensitive, but also randomly aggressive, and have to take antidepressants. I mean there is a reason UGL often carry antidepressants.
are you prepared to damage your endocrine system? are you aware most people do stupid shit in there 20s thinking they know everything? Do you think 40 years of a needle and pills is good for your health? esp when you are not even in your prime yet and can do ALOT naturally still. some folks peak around 30 some even 35yo and then it starts going down..
Think maybe your lady may want kids more than muscles?
Do research for AT LEAST 3 years. talk to guys in 30s and 40s who started AAS early at your gym and see what they say. do everything naturally till then.
I mean its stupid to start steroids before your 26yo, youngest should be 32ish yo.
promise you will regret it.. take some more blood work over a couple years and see how high you can get your natural test. We can tell by how your talking you have no idea what your doing.
just know its more complicated than testosterone and taking AI to help estrogen (remember AI are toxic can cause eye damage etc).. MANY guys will develop ED from "pushing levels".. do you want to risk having a limp dick and taking more pills to try and figure it out in ur 20s?
and again remember a reason why anabolic stores sell antidepressants, acne and dick pills...
clearheaded
Member
yup and I bet if took at 7-8am prob would be upper range. or if had a good sleep prior to next test. something like 30% of folks that test even low T(which this kid is not) won't have low T after second test.This is a direct IA fT assay. 28.83 is not in the low bottom of the 15 - 50 range. Your actual fT when converted from immunoassay would be 28.83 × approx. 7 or ~ 20 ng/dl (maybe a little less 15 to 20 ng/dl). A perfectly solid FT level.
More reading material here in case you are interested (but I know you already are well versed in all this):
Free test measurement units/format?
Got this value on free test a few months ago, I've seen free test displayed in various formats in multiple places on the internet but never understood what's the most common way to observe it. Also, feel free to give me your thoughts on the value itself. Is it of any significance without...
and just for OP, normal amount of test produced per day is around 7-10mg, so 70mg is technically TRT doses.
I feel a major crackdown coming for test not only because of trans, but also because kids see Joe rogan talk about how great TRT is and somehow think a 50yo going on trt is the same as 23yo...
The OP doesn't even have a reason for wanting to go on trt and or steroids.. get muscles to pick up chicks(risking getting soft dick and mess with libido, the RIGHT amount of AI doesn't fix this btw).. anyway, I feel another rant coming. so just will say wait till you at least peak naturally to consider steroids, If dont have discipline to wait or work harder, chances are you just will take more and more gear so dont have to work for it.
AGAIN, no matter how smart u thin u are or the hours of tik tok s you watched you are not capable of making a decision at 23yo. That along with the fact you haven't even peaked naturally as far as muscles, its something to be avoided.
R
readalot
Guest
Corrected with full units explanation.
28.83 pg/ml x 7(correction factor vs FT by equilibrium dialysis) ÷ 10 [(pg/ml)/(ng/dl)] = ~ 20 ng/dl
Last edited by a moderator:
narta
Member
Jin23
Member
You have to equate for ester weight. 70mg's of natural testosterone does not equal 70mg of Te. And as absorption is also a relevant factor with exogenous testosterone administration, as is the cleavage of testosterone from the ester by enzymes, comparing mg's of naturally produced test to mg's of injected test makes little sense.
Great point.
R
readalot
Guest
What is TRT and What is NOT TRT
What is TRT For the curious minds or folks seeking a better understanding, TRT stands for Testosterone Replacement Therapy. The R stands for replacement, not enhancement, or elevation. Sometimes there seems to be some confusion between the TRT and pharma section. Note, after discussion with...
forums.t-nation.com
For those that may be interested. I'd welcome comments/feedback and perhaps can publish a revised version here some time.
Down further in the thread I incorporate absorption rate constant as well as the typical apparent elimination rate constant. Would be good to incorporate other concepts also explored later on down in the thread (flip flop kinetics, natural diurnal variation, dose response, free T details). At some point would need to be a small book.
MrUniverse
Member
what???
G0ld
Banned
When a group of people uses a specific synthetic testosterone dose, for example, 100 milligrams, different people will get different results (T levels ; ng/dL), since metabolization rate vary.
But it doesn't matter how good you metabolization rate is, there is a specific T level you can never surpass, since any finite dose can provide only a finite amount of testosterone.
A single milligram of T can give different levels (ng/dL) to different people, but there is a specific upper limit the dose can't surpass, no matter how potent the person's metabolism is.
clearheaded
Member
sorry I should of mentioned that is with ester removed ie 6mg-7mg of test no ester a day or around 70mg of cyp or 10mg of cyp if I am not mistaken..
I do think it prob takes more brut force test levels when you shut off your AXIS to make up for loss of other 'hormones'. but that is just a guess.
R
readalot
Guest
Show me how you would estimate that upper limit.
Say 97.5 percentile or 99 if you'd like.
@G0ld you better get some sperm frozen just in case your wife/gf wants kids in the future. You also need to save money for hair transplant in case you are prone to MPB.
Make a savings account for gyno surgery just in case. Register with red cross so you can donate blood if you have erythrocytosis, if they won’t accept you for any reason, you have to learn to drain your own blood.
I hope you have telmisartan and nebivolol in hand for high blood pressure and to prevent lvh.
Oh I forgot, get some accutane too. Your chest and back might get peppered with acne you can’t show off your gains.
There are more but these are the basic ones you have to prepare for.
Make a savings account for gyno surgery just in case. Register with red cross so you can donate blood if you have erythrocytosis, if they won’t accept you for any reason, you have to learn to drain your own blood.
I hope you have telmisartan and nebivolol in hand for high blood pressure and to prevent lvh.
Oh I forgot, get some accutane too. Your chest and back might get peppered with acne you can’t show off your gains.
There are more but these are the basic ones you have to prepare for.
G0ld
Banned
That's my idea, actually. I want what is the maximum testosterone my body can get from a specific synthetic testosterone dose.
I'm starting with a TRT dose to see how my body reacts to exogenous testosterone. The dose will be slowly increased with time, with blood tests done after the end of the half-life of the dose.
I will do it that way because I want to see how far I can go without AIs and to measure my aromatization rate.
G0ld
Banned
The vial dosage I got is 250mg T per 1 ml of solution.
I can't estimate it because I don't know what it is. But I know fur sure there must be a limit to how much testosterone the body can get from 1 milligram synthetic testosterone. Any finite dose can provide only a finite amount.
G0ld
Banned
I don't have wife or gf, so frozen sperm is not needed.
I'm not genetically predisposed to baldness.
As for gynecomastia, I will use tamoxifen.
Most studies i see show the average man produces about 5-10 mg of T pure day. So at the median that means about 50mg/week for most guys.The body will use/breakdown every mg of T that is introduced naturally or from the outside. The only thing is how fast that happens.The amount enzyme that cleaves the ester from the test molecule varies from person to person. The more enzyme the faster it gets in and out of the blood stream. When i inject 100 mg TC which is actually about 70 mg of pure T minus the ester weight. I peak at around 1100 on a blood test 48 hours after i inject then am at just over 400 before the next injection 7 days post inject. And these are numbers from a steady state after weeks of injecting. Others will have higher of lower peaks and troughs depending on their own metabolism/enzyme production. When i inject the same weekly amount(100mg/week) but do daily injections of about 14-15 mg/day my numbers stay right around 800 day after day. Injection frequency has an impact just as dose does.
