Giant Semaglutide Thread (and other GLP-1 / GIP agonists)

[Doodle]

Wanted to create a thread where everyone can post their experiences with different sourced Semaglutide.

Who are you using?
Pharma vs non?
Dosage?
How long have you been taking it?
What are your thoughts?
Have you lost weight?
Side effects?
Oral vs injection?
Tests?

 

[Nidus]

It’s been about two weeks into my first run with Tirz at 1mg EOD (3.5mg per week).

I haven’t experienced any appetite suppression, though that’s not my primary reason for taking it. I also haven’t noticed any improvements in my blood glucose levels at this dosage.

The only notable change is that I’ve completely lost the urge to eat junk food, even during my off-season/push phase. I used to snack between meals and enjoy the occasional sweet, but that desire is entirely gone. Additionally, my sleep quality has significantly improved since starting Tirz.

I plan to stick with 1mg every other day until I begin cutting, as I don’t want to suppress my appetite too much. I also have Reta on the way, which I’ll likely incorporate during the second half of my cut phase.

What is the usual starting Protocol with Tirz? Isn't it 2.5mg per Week and then taper up?

 

[Juiced_lizard]

What is the usual starting Protocol with Tirz? Isn't it 2.5mg per Week and then taper up?

2.5
5.0
10
15
Every 4 weeks you go up is pharmaceuticals protocol.

 

[Sampei]

2.5
5.0
10
15
Every 4 weeks you go up is pharmaceuticals protocol.

I would increase by 2.5mg after 5mg, to avoid harsh side if one ramps up too fast. Especially if you are a Bodybuilder and not trying to kill your appetite

 

[Nidus]

2.5
5.0
10
15
Every 4 weeks you go up is pharmaceuticals protocol.

I would increase by 2.5mg after 5mg, to avoid harsh side if one ramps up too fast. Especially if you are a Bodybuilder and not trying to kill your appetite

Thank you guys! Going to start tomorrow with my Tirz journey.

 

[Juiced_lizard]

Thank you guys! Going to start tomorrow with my Tirz journey.

I would increase by 2.5mg after 5mg, to avoid harsh side if one ramps up too fast. Especially if you are a Bodybuilder and not trying to kill your appetite

I did do 5.0 then 7.5 myself and stopped at 10mg. But if I go up I might do 12.5mg just because. Nothing wrong with going slow at all.

 

[SubparMarioBro]

2.5
5.0
10
15
Every 4 weeks you go up is pharmaceuticals protocol.

I’m pretty sure pharma protocol is
2.5
5
7.5
10
12.5
15

 

[Juiced_lizard]

I’m pretty sure pharma protocol is
2.5
5
7.5
10
12.5
15

Is it? Then I could be wrong. Seems like you only hear about 2.5 which isn’t really a dose. More so a starter to get acclimated. Then going to 5,10 and 15 but I could be wrong. Either way I don’t see the problem going up 2.5. Again nothing wrong with going slow. I see no problem in staying at 5mg if it works. Who cares if it’s been 4 weeks. If it works then keep going.

 

[anon55]

why not after getting at the full dose of tirzepatide (15mg or more) adding a low dose of survodutide to get additional GLP1 and Glucagon agonism wich lacks with tirzepatide? Glucagon agonism is especially beneficial for bone and liver health, and improve metabolism efficiency.

 

[Luke391]

It’s helpful to understand what “lean mass” is. Our friends at Altimmune helpfully provided MRI scan data for body composition changes with Pemvidutide. Maybe other pharma companies could do the same, that would be nice. MRIs provide quite nice specificity about that.

Altimmune is comparing their MRI scan data to DEXA scan data. DEXA scans are cheap and easy, but they’re also not nearly as specific about what they’re seeing when assessing body composition. Everything gets lumped into three categories: bone mass, fat mass, and lean mass. Lean mass is a category where they shove everything they can’t put in the first two categories.

So let’s look at things you might not expect to be in the lean mass category.

Liver fat is a great example to start with. While DEXA scans can identify subcutaneous fat and visceral fat, they can’t separate liver fat from the lean mass of the liver. So your liver fat is “lean mass”. So when you take a drug like Reta that causes a 90% reduction in liver fat you and then do a DEXA scan that gets recorded as “lean mass loss”. But when you take a drug like Pemvidutide that also causes significant reduction in liver fat and then do an MRI scan, that gets recorded as “fat loss”. Same issue with pancreatic fat. Same issue with cardiac fat.

Ever have a nice steak with all the marbling? That’s intramuscular fat. Aka “lean mass” according to DEXA. So when we reduce the amount of intramuscular fat and take a DEXA scan that’s “lean mass loss” but if we reduce the amount of intramuscular fat and take an MRI scan that’s “fat loss”.

There’s several more types of fat that DEXA lumps into the “lean mass” category. But let’s go back to liver fat and think about how our friends at Altimmune are comparing their obesity trial to a Reta diabetes trial. Diabetics have screwed up metabolisms and as a result tend to have pronounced issues with fatty liver. So you’d expect more “lean mass loss” by eliminating that fat in a diabetic patient than you’d get by eliminating it in a non-diabetic one.

What about other things that aren’t fat and aren’t muscle in the lean mass category? Water is a big one. It turns out that when you’re type 2 diabetic and have issues with chronic hyperglycemia, you retain a lot of water due to osmotic gradients from the glucose elevation. You retain even more water because you also have chronic hyperinsulinemia. An MRI can distinguish water from skeletal muscle but on a DEXA scan it’s all just “lean mass”. So when you’re a type 2 diabetic and you take a fancy diabetes drug, fix your insulin resistance, and revert to normoglycemia, all of that water retention goes away. Hooray. And if you’re on Reta and take a DEXA scan, that’s the dreaded “lean mass loss” but if you’re on Pem and get the complimentary MRI scan it’s just water reduction.

You’ve also got a bunch of water in your muscles, right? The easiest way to goose your DEXA scan results is to not take creatine for your baseline scan and start taking it afterwards. Woohoo, instant lean mass gains. If you’re on a mild diuretic drug like Reta or Pem, you might expect some fluid loss there as well. And if you’re on an anorectic like Reta or Pem you might expect a decrease in your muscular glycogen (mostly water) stores. And if you’re on a GCGRA like Reta or Pem you might expect a decrease in hepatic glycogen stores. If you do a DEXA scan that’s “lean mass loss” but the MRI just sees a fluid shift.

So that’s what I mean when I say this is a completely worthless comparison and Altimmune should be ashamed to even make it. Hopefully they got the stock pump they were after.

Amazing explanation. It always kills me whenever all the "doctors" and health gurus online make videos about GLP1x saying shit like "peope are loosing weight but they are actually loosing all muscle!!!".
Some time ago I came across a video about dr ken berry about glp1s and it was the most ridiculis shit I've ever heard. tons of people not only misinterpret data, but also make up side effects that don't exist to make glp1s seem like a bad drug. The more I get into these the more I see them as true miracle drugs and my experience with tirz is starting to conferm this. GLP1s are amazing

 

[Luke391]

View attachment 316035

why not after getting at the full dose of tirzepatide (15mg or more) adding a low dose of survodutide to get additional GLP1 and Glucagon agonism wich lacks with tirzepatide? Glucagon agonism is especially beneficial for bone and liver health, and improve metabolism efficiency.

could do it. I know some people stack glps, ghoul will probably give you an in-dept answer about this.

 

[Luke391]

It’s been about two weeks into my first run with Tirz at 1mg EOD (3.5mg per week).

I haven’t experienced any appetite suppression, though that’s not my primary reason for taking it. I also haven’t noticed any improvements in my blood glucose levels at this dosage.

The only notable change is that I’ve completely lost the urge to eat junk food, even during my off-season/push phase. I used to snack between meals and enjoy the occasional sweet, but that desire is entirely gone. Additionally, my sleep quality has significantly improved since starting Tirz.

I plan to stick with 1mg every other day until I begin cutting, as I don’t want to suppress my appetite too much. I also have Reta on the way, which I’ll likely incorporate during the second half of my cut phase.

Ghoul will tell you this, DO NOT DO THIS BULLSHIT OF MICRODOSING GLP1 DRUGS.
STICK TO THE PHARMA PROTOCOL, ONCE A WEEK INJECTION AND TITRATE UP AS YOU NEED.
You can become tollerant to these drugs by doing this microdsing shit.
I just started tirz as well. Last week 2.5mg felt nothing so I went up to 5mg this week and in litterally 3 days I feel like my life has changed. No food toughts and I feel completely in control of what I eat. so far no side effects either.
Consult Ghoul, he's the expert here.
These are not drugs you want to be experimenting with, just get on tirz once a week, low dose (2.5 or 5mg a week) so you still have your appetite and get the health benefits.
Do not take them intermittently, either stay on them or stay off. Again, you can cause yourself a level of immunity to these drugs by doing that.

 

[Ghoul]

could so it. I know some people stack glps, ghoul will probably give you an in-dept answer about this.

At the least if you're going to go that inadvisable route keep them separate and pin on different days.

 

[Juiced_lizard]

I personally did microdosing for a while and I did find once a week is for one easier and second I think worked better overall. Pinning one more thing multiple times a week is just another thing to remember.

 

[Ghoul]

Ghoul will tell you this, DO NOT DO THIS BULLSSHIP OF MICRODOSING GLP1 DRUGS.
STICK TO THE PHARMA PROTOCOL, ONCE A WEEK INJECTION AND TOTRATE UP AS YOU NEED.
You can become tollerant to these drugs by doing these microdsing shit.
I just started tirz as well. Last week 2.5mg felt nothing so I went up to 5mg this week and in litterally 3 days I feel like my life has changed. No food tought and I feel completely in control of what I eat. so far no side effects either.
Consult Ghoul, he's the expert here

It has to do with the immunogenicity and the build up of antibodies that cause a resistance to develop against the peptide. More frequent dosing can make this much worse. Any resistance can be very long lasting, even permanent and shouldn't be taken lightly.

We already know non-pharma copies of peptides are much worse in this regard, and frequent dosing makes an already elevated risk worse.

 

[Luke391]

Is it? Then I could be wrong. Seems like you only hear about 2.5 which isn’t really a dose. More so a starter to get acclimated. Then going to 5,10 and 15 but I could be wrong. Either way I don’t see the problem going up 2.5. Again nothing wrong with going slow. I see no problem in staying at 5mg if it works. Who cares if it’s been 4 weeks. If it works then keep going.

pharma protocol is upping by 2.5mg every 4weeks. I think jumping by 5mg at a time could be too much, if 4weeks at a time is too slow jump 2.5mg every 2 weeks.
Many people feel nothing on 2.5mg but I still think it's best to start with 2.5 just to see how you respond and acclamate to tirzepatide

 

[Ghoul]

pharma protocol is upping by 2.5mg every 4weeks. I think jumping by 5mg at a time could be too much, if 4weeks at a time is too slow jump 2.5mg every 2 weeks.
Many people feel nothing on 2.5mg but I still think it's best to start with 2.5 just to see how you respond and acclamate to tirzepatide

If you feel absolutely nothing at 2.5mg, I think titrating to 5mg the following week is ok. If still no effects whatsoever, 7.5mg the following week is also safe imo.

HOWEVER, if you feel ANY effects, wait at least two weeks before titrating up (4 is better), because the full effects of a given dose take time to develop as blood concentration rises. So if a new dose feels "weak" and you increase it the following week, it could easily become too much.

And of course, there's nothing wrong with going slow. There's no need to increase after 4 weeks at a certain dose if you don't want to. That's per the most current prescribing guidelines.

 

[Juiced_lizard]

I personally did microdosing for a while and I did find once a week is for one easier and second I think worked better overall. Pinning one more thing multiple times a week is just another thing to remember.

Further more I think everyone uses it for different reasons. I see chase irons name dropped a lot for micro dosing and I’m sure he isn’t using it like the majority is using GLP’s. Most use it as a weight loss/overall health more so than anything else.

 

[Ghoul]

Further more I think everyone uses it for different reasons. I see chase irons name dropped a lot for micro dosing and I’m sure he isn’t using it like the majority is using GLP’s. Most use it as a weight loss/overall health more so than anything else.

Immunogenicity doesn't care what it's being used for though. Stopping and starting, referred to as "re-exposure events" raise immunogenicity risks even higher.

 

[Juiced_lizard]

Immunogenicity doesn't care what it's being used for though. Stopping and starting, referred to as "re-exposure events" raise immunogenicity risks even higher.

I agree not saying it’s the best way but many use it like that with what seems like success for whatever they are using it for. For how long? Who knows but they do it.

 

[Ghoul]

I agree not saying it’s the best way but many use it like that with what seems like success for whatever they are using it for. For how long? Who knows but they do it.

The thing is, it's not as if the only way to achieve what he's trying is via micro dosing. The people using it this way think they're improving something with no additional risk. They're simply unaware of immunogenicity and its consequences.

Imagine discovering you slowly built a cross immunity to your natural GLP-1, a crucial endogenous peptide.

Such things have happened with pharma peptides, catastrophes, and took years and years to develop.