Cycle to get huge

[svenstero]

If I were you, I would do 500mg test, 250 EQ, test E2, adjust EQ as needed. At 21 and 11 month on gear, I think your going to be disappointed with gh.

what do you think about test deca eq instead of test eq?

 

[AnabolicTacos]

what do you think about test deca eq instead of test eq?

i wouldnt introduce two compounds at once, if you never used it, eq can crush you´re e2 hard, but deca can have estrogenic side effects, just try 500 test, and 200-250eq

 

[Astartes]

It's also a very clean dist so you aren't getting a ton of fat at all. That's clean eating. Im just pointing out protein shakes is not a substitute for real food in a meal so a small bowl of cream of wheat and fruit and protein shake would be more a cutting meal. You said you want to grow.

This concept has always confused me. (… and to my understanding, has been debunked over and over)

Why is milk protein (whey, isolate, casein, etc) inferior to say real eggs or chicken?

(Unless you are referring to elongation of the absorption bolus which can be achieved by more frequent protein supplement snacks)

Now don’t get me wrong, protein shakes get old and it is simply nice to get another source with perhaps some added nutrients…

…but there is this underlying implication I often see that whey protein is inferior to say chicken or tuna purely as a protein source. (Hint… it’s the opposite)

Also… you may have simply been reminding OP that just protein powder & carbs won’t get him where he needs to go. I did see you say “meal” so my rant may have better been directed elsewhere

Apologize if so *facepalm*

 

[RockyP]

Lee Labrada, to prove a point and to help push his supplement company, once prepared for a competition using his protein powder as his sole source of protein. While absorption rates differ (whey isolate will absorb very quickly compared to protein in a steak due to fat content) but your body really can’t tell the difference.

 

[BabaJagga]

Lee Labrada, to prove a point and to help push his supplement company, once prepared for a competition using his protein powder as his sole source of protein. While absorption rates differ (whey isolate will absorb very quickly compared to protein in a steak due to fat content) but your body really can’t tell the difference.

also it ussually has (or should) complete amino acid profile, unlike some other sources i think?

 

[Astartes]

^ Correct. Current research points toward milk proteins converting to muscle as a more complete profile… more than any other protein, followed by egg and animal. (Though for all practical intents purposes they are interchangeable to the vast majority of us human beings) Plant proteins much less so.

 

[RockyP]

also it ussually has (or should) complete amino acid profile, unlike some other sources i think?

As I’ve scaled up my Reta dosage I’ve had to implement more liquid meals both protein and carbs (BCD) due to appetite issues and also heartburn from consuming more than 5 or so ounces of animal protein at a time. I’ve noticed zero adverse impact. If anything it’s been beneficial. No more heartburn. The BCD digests well and doesnt bloat me. I would prefer to get more whole food in but this is suiting me just fine for now

 

[BabaJagga]

^ Correct. Current research points toward milk proteins converting to muscle as a more complete profile… more than any other protein, followed by egg and animal. (Though for all practical intents purposes they are interchangeable to the vast majority of us human beings) Plant proteins much less so.

ive seen that or simillar chart i think. egg whites were right after whey i belive. every meat source was bit under.

not that one should consume whey only but to tell its not real and doesnt count is.. bit weird of a statement

 

[BabaJagga]

As I’ve scaled up my Reta dosage I’ve had to implement more liquid meals both protein and carbs (BCD) due to appetite issues and also heartburn from consuming more than 5 or so ounces of animal protein at a time. I’ve noticed zero adverse impact. If anything it’s been beneficial. No more heartburn. The BCD digests well and doesnt bloat me. I would prefer to get more whole food in but this is suiting me just fine for now

same here during summer cut with tirz. 0 hunger. i enyjoed it more than dry chicken brest without oil/butter from air frier. 0 issues with digestion.

i actually like shakes. with 1.5% milk, some honey, berries, whey, sometimes oats etc, its pretty tast and filling.

if i wanna "snack", its ideal. 300ml of milk, 50g of whey and drizzle of honey.

 

[Adi18]

I don't know, every huge bodybuilder I've seen pushes real food. Protein shakes are a good snack, they're supposed to supplement your protein intake. Regardless if youre trying to get serious size, the meal plan presented I feel is inadequate. Also id want to see data on people stating out, not bodybuilders already that are huge using protein shakes as a replacement.

 

[BabaJagga]

I don't know, every huge bodybuilder I've seen pushes real food. Protein shakes are a good snack, they're supposed to supplement your protein intake. Regardless if youre trying to get serious size, the meal plan presented I feel is inadequate. Also id want to see data on people stating out, not bodybuilders already that are huge using protein shakes as a replacement.

real food vs whey powder is no debate thats for sure but to say it doesnt count is bit stupid imo.
if someone cant push more chicken/beef/eggs/insert your fav source, isnt it better to have it supplemented by whey powder, rather than undereat?

i have friend that is relyin on whey shakes 80% of time. he is progressing. maybe/probably not as much as with chicken breast but still. quiete newbie, back to trainin after 10+'years.

 

[Astartes]

I don't know, every huge bodybuilder I've seen pushes real food. Protein shakes are a good snack, they're supposed to supplement your protein intake. Regardless if youre trying to get serious size, the meal plan presented I feel is inadequate. Also id want to see data on people stating out, not bodybuilders already that are huge using protein shakes as a replacement.

Well sure. Pro Bodybuilders consume vast amounts of food. Easily 4-6 times more than an average human being needs to consume.

2-4 times more than probably you or I need to. (Assuming say… we are representative of top 5 built people at any gym we go to)

In that case the sheer cost of food becomes exorbitant, and protein supplements are an escalated cost.

Mostly though, it is the need for natural micro nutrients that becomes the factor. Along with some foods (which includes protein sources) that have a longer absorption bolus.

I am most certainly in agreement that getting _all_ your protein from milk protein powder sources is probably not the most well rounded approach.

My point was primarily in the “quality” of protein misconception that is out there. That somehow natural protein in of itself is superior. (Btw… one could argue milk proteins are natural… just refined)

The concept simply isn’t supported by science.

Make sense?

 

[Adi18]

real food vs whey powder is no debate thats for sure but to say it doesnt count is bit stupid imo.
if someone cant push more chicken/beef/eggs/insert your fav source, isnt it better to have it supplemented by whey powder, rather than undereat?

i have friend that is relyin on whey shakes 80% of time. he is progressing. maybe/probably not as much as with chicken breast but still. quiete newbie, back to trainin after 10+'years.

It definitely count, supplementation is the key word
@Astartes makes total sense. It's not about the quality of protein so much as getting the majority of your nutrients from whole food. I use protein powder, its great, but I don't rely on it as my main source of protein

 

[dinfaralt]

It definitely count, supplementation is the key word
@Astartes makes total sense. It's not about the quality of protein so much as getting the majority of your nutrients from whole food. I use protein powder, its great, but I don't rely on it as my main source of protein

33g protein powder a day is fine. 1 scoop a day to help me get to 300g protein.

defiently main source as protein is not good. not too much ultra processed food a day.

 

[svenstero]

33g protein powder a day is fine. 1 scoop a day to help me get to 300g protein.

defiently main source as protein is not good. not too much ultra processed food a day.

It’s so stupid to say you Progress better on meat and chicken than Protein powder

 

[BabaJagga]

It’s so stupid to say you Progress better on meat and chicken than Protein powder

i wouldnt take super seriously everything what you read here. lot of very strict opinions.

i think, important thing is to be consistent. if what you do is workin, keep doin that until it stops workin.

 

[IndividualMan]

In that case the sheer cost of food becomes exorbitant, and protein supplements are an escalated cost.

THIS
assuming i use the cheapest protein powder accessible to me, 18.90 EUR/KG, unflavored, I am still slightly overpaying compared to cheaper lean meats, while also getting in unwanted milk sugar. Higher quality protein powders (90%+ protein content without nitrogen spiking) cost up to 40 EUR/kg.
Insane costs, i could get between 5 and 8 kgs of lean meats (sub8% fat content) for that price, even cheaper when i go to local stores/ meat vendors/ hunters

 

[BabaJagga]

THIS
assuming i use the cheapest protein powder accessible to me, 18.90 EUR/KG, unflavored, I am still slightly overpaying compared to cheaper lean meats, while also getting in unwanted milk sugar. Higher quality protein powders (90%+ protein content without nitrogen spiking) cost up to 40 EUR/kg.
Insane costs, i could get between 5 and 8 kgs of lean meats (sub8% fat content) for that price, even cheaper when i go to local stores/ meat vendors/ hunters

22€ for good quality whey here vs 8-10€ per kg of chicken breast.

buuuut... chicken is full of water. 40-50% of weight is water... even local farm do that cause they cant compete with big chains.

 

[dinfaralt]

buuuut... chicken is full of water. 40-50% of weight is water...

im pretty sure that simply isnt allowed in eu. max 5% or have to be declared

shit like that only happens in usa

 

[BabaJagga]

im pretty sure that simply isnt allowed in eu. max 5% or have to be declared

shit like that only happens in usa

plenty of stuff isnt allowed, that doesnt mesn its not a thing. we have food 2/3 grades lower in quality compared to western eu. same stuff here and there, completly different.