New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidance

[titleesq]

Good Afternoon,

I just recently discovered this site during my research for sources of information on TRT. At first glance, there seems to be a treasure trove of information regarding the practices surrounding TRT and proper protocols, but there also seems to be many conflicting arguments surrounding said protocols as well. This is causing my head to spin.

I'm a 38 year old male, 5 foot 6 and 190lbs., married with two beautiful girls. After years of suffering from an entire laundry list of symptoms, including depression, lack of motivation, extreme fatigue, loss of libido, ED, etc., I had NO luck with any of the popular psych meds and combinations thereof.

Finally, when I was at the end of my rope, I was referred by a friend to schedule a consultation at the University of Maryland Medical Center, Department of Integrative Medicine. I set-up an appointment, and based upon my symptoms, they immediately ordered labs to measure my total T. The results came back and my total T was 252ng. She prescribed me injectable Test C @ 200mg every TWO weeks. I didn't want to take the risk of transference with the gels/creams, and I heard that the TD's were not that great. I have taken two shots so far (the second (without the docs knowledge), only 5 days after the first as I thought more is better, and that I needed a proper "loading" dose). Anyway, I'm due for another shot on Thursday and that will put me back on my every other week schedule. I have so far noticed ZERO difference.

Johns Hopkins is located pretty much in my backyard, and as soon as I received the diagnosis of low T, I scheduled an appointment with Dr. Adrian Dobs, who is supposedly Hopkins' best when it comes to the issue of male hormones. The earliest that I could be seen as a new patient is October (Unbelievable). Does anyone have have any information regarding Dr. Dobs? Am I taking the correct steps in getting a second opinion?

This morning I went to Quest Labs and had about 30 different tests performed. I guess that upon receipt of the results of these labs, my protocol will be fine tuned (at least I hope it will). But as I said, I'm a total newbie, I'm confused, anxious, kind of scared, and not sure where to turn for correct info and advice. I plan on sticking around here for the duration, and learning as much as I possibly can. Thank you all for being here and providing guidance, support, and education to all who are lucky enough to find there way to this forum.

I know this may be a dumb question, but what do I do now?

Ari

 

[CubbieBlue]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

Good Afternoon,

I just recently discovered this site during my research for sources of information on TRT. At first glance, there seems to be a treasure trove of information regarding the practices surrounding TRT and proper protocols, but there also seems to be many conflicting arguments surrounding said protocols as well. This is causing my head to spin.

I'm a 38 year old male, 5 foot 6 and 190lbs., married with two beautiful girls. After years of suffering from an entire laundry list of symptoms, including depression, lack of motivation, extreme fatigue, loss of libido, ED, etc., I had NO luck with any of the popular psych meds and combinations thereof.

Finally, when I was at the end of my rope, I was referred by a friend to schedule a consultation at the University of Maryland Medical Center, Department of Integrative Medicine. I set-up an appointment, and based upon my symptoms, they immediately ordered labs to measure my total T. The results came back and my total T was 252ng. She prescribed me injectable Test C @ 200mg every TWO weeks. I didn't want to take the risk of transference with the gels/creams, and I heard that the TD's were not that great. I have taken two shots so far (the second (without the docs knowledge), only 5 days after the first as I thought more is better, and that I needed a proper "loading" dose). Anyway, I'm due for another shot on Thursday and that will put me back on my every other week schedule. I have so far noticed ZERO difference.

Johns Hopkins is located pretty much in my backyard, and as soon as I received the diagnosis of low T, I scheduled an appointment with Dr. Adrian Dobs, who is supposedly Hopkins' best when it comes to the issue of male hormones. The earliest that I could be seen as a new patient is October (Unbelievable). Does anyone have have any information regarding Dr. Dobs? Am I taking the correct steps in getting a second opinion?

This morning I went to Quest Labs and had about 30 different tests performed. I guess that upon receipt of the results of these labs, my protocol will be fine tuned (at least I hope it will). But as I said, I'm a total newbie, I'm confused, anxious, kind of scared, and not sure where to turn for correct info and advice. I plan on sticking around here for the duration, and learning as much as I possibly can. Thank you all for being here and providing guidance, support, and education to all who are lucky enough to find there way to this forum.

I know this may be a dumb question, but what do I do now?

Ari

If I were you, I would STOP the TRT, look at these labs (hopefully you looked at Vit D and thyroid) and see what is going on. If you do the second opinion wait on the TRT until you see him. If you are on TRT w hen you see him there's not much he can do except tell you to continue or stop so he can get a baseline. Better to go and see him with a fresh slate.

There may be issues causing the low T:
- sleep apnea
- low Vitamin D
- hypothyroidism

are the big ones. If your other labs check out and those are fine, at 38 years old, I wouldn't wait too long before getting back on the T cyp.

Good luck.

 

[titleesq]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

If I were you, I would STOP the TRT, look at these labs (hopefully you looked at Vit D and thyroid) and see what is going on. If you do the second opinion wait on the TRT until you see him. If you are on TRT w hen you see him there's not much he can do except tell you to continue or stop so he can get a baseline. Better to go and see him with a fresh slate.

There may be issues causing the low T:
- sleep apnea
- low Vitamin D
- hypothyroidism

are the big ones. If your other labs check out and those are fine, at 38 years old, I wouldn't wait too long before getting back on the T cyp.

Good luck.

Cubbie,

Thanks for the reply, it is greatly appreciated. Before I respond, please keep in mind that I am a total newbie, have pretty much close to no idea what I am talking about, and if for some reason i offend you, I apologize.

Regarding sleep apnea, I have never been tested or questioned about it (and have no family history), but after a cursory review of the symptoms, it seems that many of them are the same as low T. Without a whole big production (I'm assuming a sleep study is needed), is there a way to rule that out as a cause of my problems based upon the blood work? If all the blood work points to low T, would it not be safe to assume that it is low T causing the problems and not sleep apnea? If you hear hoof beats behind you, normally you would think it's a horse and not a zebra, correct?

As part of my work-up they performed a test called Vitamin D 25-Hydroxy. Unfortunately, after speaking with a rep at Quest this evening, I found out that this is considered a specialized test and they have to send it out to another lab. I will not have the results of this test for another 7 days, whereas I should have the bulk of the remaining results tomorrow. How important are the findings of this test and what impact does it have on low T? If that could be a potential problem, couldn't I just avoid that by supplementation of Vitamin D?

The testing that I had done included a full thyroid work-up (T3 Total, T3 Uptake, T4 Total, T4 Free, TSH, and TSH w/Reflex). There could possibly be more tests relating to the thyroid, but those are the only ones I recognize as being specifically for thyroid.

As far as establishing a baseline, isn't that what I am doing now? Prior to starting any treatment I had a total T test done (252ng). Now I am aware that is not nearly enough information to effectively diagnose and treat properly, but I have only had two injections of Test Cyp at 200mgs. The last injection that I had was last Monday June 27, and I had blood work drawn this morning. Taking that information into account, am I not at, or at the very least, pretty darn close to baseline at the moment? If not, how skewed could it possibly be? Also, couldn't baseline be calculated by factoring in the half-life of my dosage of Test Cyp?

Thanks for taking the time to help. I would appreciate any replies/comments as to my responses. I need to beat this shit. I have had enough of feeling like I'm 100 years old.

Ari

 

[Nordic11]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

It takes 4-5 weeks on Test Cyp to feel the effects.

 

[CubbieBlue]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

It takes 4-5 weeks on Test Cyp to feel the effects.

I felt different that very same day.

 

[CubbieBlue]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

Cubbie,

Thanks for the reply, it is greatly appreciated. Before I respond, please keep in mind that I am a total newbie, have pretty much close to no idea what I am talking about, and if for some reason i offend you, I apologize.

Regarding sleep apnea, I have never been tested or questioned about it (and have no family history), but after a cursory review of the symptoms, it seems that many of them are the same as low T. Without a whole big production (I'm assuming a sleep study is needed), is there a way to rule that out as a cause of my problems based upon the blood work? If all the blood work points to low T, would it not be safe to assume that it is low T causing the problems and not sleep apnea? If you hear hoof beats behind you, normally you would think it's a horse and not a zebra, correct?

As part of my work-up they performed a test called Vitamin D 25-Hydroxy. Unfortunately, after speaking with a rep at Quest this evening, I found out that this is considered a specialized test and they have to send it out to another lab. I will not have the results of this test for another 7 days, whereas I should have the bulk of the remaining results tomorrow. How important are the findings of this test and what impact does it have on low T? If that could be a potential problem, couldn't I just avoid that by supplementation of Vitamin D?

The testing that I had done included a full thyroid work-up (T3 Total, T3 Uptake, T4 Total, T4 Free, TSH, and TSH w/Reflex). There could possibly be more tests relating to the thyroid, but those are the only ones I recognize as being specifically for thyroid.

As far as establishing a baseline, isn't that what I am doing now? Prior to starting any treatment I had a total T test done (252ng). Now I am aware that is not nearly enough information to effectively diagnose and treat properly, but I have only had two injections of Test Cyp at 200mgs. The last injection that I had was last Monday June 27, and I had blood work drawn this morning. Taking that information into account, am I not at, or at the very least, pretty darn close to baseline at the moment? If not, how skewed could it possibly be? Also, couldn't baseline be calculated by factoring in the half-life of my dosage of Test Cyp?

Thanks for taking the time to help. I would appreciate any replies/comments as to my responses. I need to beat this shit. I have had enough of feeling like I'm 100 years old.

Ari

Ari, I'm saying a natural baseline. Basically what I'm saying is that you can try and figure out why you are hypogonadal or accept it and treat it. At your age it is possibly age related. There's also a small chance you can figure out what is causing the low T and treat that, taking care of the low T.

It's up to you, but I recommend right now you stop the T treatments, post all of your labs, and seek the second opinion from the "expert" and see what he says. If after a cursory review of your labs here no one sees anything glaring, it would perhaps be wise to just restart the TRT.

Round here we do TRT pretty simple: in most cases, just T.

100mg per week in two or more injections per week.

Others use aromatase inhibitors to prevent conversion to estrogen, hCG to prevent testicular atrophy, but if TRT is done right in most cases they aren't needed.

 

[seeking]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

you are going to really mess things up if you change your dosing routines and lie about it to the doctor, really mess up

 

[Mytime]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

Good Evening,

I can only give you my experience regarding HRT. I am 47 and like you, I started having symptoms around 42. Same thing. Low Libito, No energy etc... I had no idea what was going on and thought I was suffering from depression after my divorce. I really considered mental medicine, but quickly decided I would not do it as it has long term side effects.

I spoke to my doctor and he mentioned it could be low t. Test came back at 202. He prescribed me the topical at first but really did no good. Started self injecting test 1 cc every 10 days and felt an immediate result. Everything changed. Energy, Libito, Excitement about life....took several months but got the dosage right and now taking 1.5 cc every 10 days and my levels are 650 last check. it really is the best thing since crunchy peanut butter. Has made a world of difference in my life..and BTW, I have no side effects on this. Tolerating it very well.

Dont lie to your doctor, if he is worth his salt he will see that 200 is low and work to get your levels up. Stay on this therapy. It works.

 

[titleesq]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

Thank you all for your input. Any and all help/advice/experience is very much appreciated. Just to clear things up, I did not directly "lie" to my doctor. I just read that waiting two weeks between injects would cause the so called "roller coaster" effect, and so I took it upon myself to increase frequency of injects. I'm not justifying what I did, and I realize how wrong I was and the mistake that I made. I came clean to the Doc, admitted what I did, and she just laughed it off and told me to stop helping her so much. LOL!!!

Thanks as always

Ari

 

[Jeton]

Re: New to Forum, TRT in General, VERY Confused and Emotional, and Hoping for Guidanc

Thank you all for your input. Any and all help/advice/experience is very much appreciated. Just to clear things up, I did not directly "lie" to my doctor. I just read that waiting two weeks between injects would cause the so called "roller coaster" effect, and so I took it upon myself to increase frequency of injects. I'm not justifying what I did, and I realize how wrong I was and the mistake that I made. I came clean to the Doc, admitted what I did, and she just laughed it off and told me to stop helping her so much. LOL!!!

Thanks as always

Ari

u need to read up on hormones b4 u take elective, unauthorized license with them. u injected early to AVOID the rollercoaster effect, but u've essentially ensured it by ur action. i doubt ur doc is going to prescribe u 200mg of t cyp every 5 days, so now ur on a brief high that will hopefully settle into a normal range without u noticing the difference.

more frequent dosing is indeed better...some guys even inject sub-q daily with fatter insulin needles. my husband n i inject tuesdays b4 noon n fridays b4 midnite...gonna start prepping injections in a bit..

ur gonna need to see what ur levels r...ur new expert will probably want to match ur levels to the median for ur age. 100mg weekly (divvied up in whatever fashion) may bring u to that median, or over-/under-shoot the mark. i'd aim for overshooting if i was u, as median T levels have apparently been declining in America over the last century for many reasons.