2nd Cycle Plans ... What'cha Think?

[C-J]

Heres the paln for next month. Brief stats... 35, 6'2, 250, 18% bf (mostly belly)

Plan is: 10 wks or 500/400 Sus/Deca per week. .25 Armidex ED even through clomid theropy. 35-40 mgs Dbol for 1st 6 weeks, Winny last 4 weeks. Have Nolva on hand just in case.

I did this same cycle early 02 with super results. Put on nearly 20 pounds and kept about 15 of it. I managed to loose 2 inches off my belly during cycle too. So, I figured I'd run with it again considering I've been off AAS for well over a year, receptors should be back to normal true/false?

Let me know what I should change and why.

Thanks fellas
CJ

 

[C-J]

Nobody?

BUMP

No opinions? No way! Somebody has to have something to say.

CJ

 

[BigLibby]

what up bud, at your weight i would take the sust 600-800mg a week... hitting it EOD... that way you will see the most out of it

 

[C-J]

what up bud, at your weight i would take the sust 600-800mg a week... hitting it EOD... that way you will see the most out of it

Thanks BL...

Is body weight the main factor in deciding on how much to use? Should I front load wk 1 to jump start? Some say yes...others say no. 600/800 huh? Anybody else have any suggestions?
CJ

 

[joe shmoe]

libby brings up a good point(as usual) about upping the dose due to your weight. however, since you've been totally off for a year, and you made good gains on 500/400, i would think that you'd make good gains again. i kind of have mixed feelings about this....stay at 500/400 or upping the dose.

at 18%, you have 45 lbs of fat at a current weight of 250 lbs. if you were 10% BF, you'd have a current weight of 225 lbs. i'm not sure where i'm going with this. an average guy at an average 10% BF would do nicely on 500/400 i would think. i'm not sure if the extra 8%BF would be a consideration. again, not too sure where i was going with this. i think 500mg/wk of sust and 400mg/wk of deca would do good for a second cycle. but for some reason, i just cant give a definative answer.

you freekin got me stumped over here. DAMN YOU TO HELL .

have a nice day

 

[P-DOG]

Thanks BL...

Is body weight the main factor in deciding on how much to use? Should I front load wk 1 to jump start? Some say yes...others say no. 600/800 huh? Anybody else have any suggestions?
CJ

always frontload when your using slow acting drugs.

 

[C-J]

Ummm Thanks?

Damn Joe... you we're a hell of alot of help here man... thanks?

P-Dog, would the frontload be same dose but EOD for week 1, then back down to twice a week?

Thanks

Anybody else have words of wisdome for me?
CJ

 

[womenrimmer]

Well,if it was me,I'd go with 250 mg's of Sus eod.Blood levels will fluctuate too much with just 2x's weekly injects.You'll get much better results if go eod with Sus.Maybe go with 10 weeks Deca and 12 weeks Sus.Eod injects will keep blood levels consistent with the Sus.You could maybe even go with 500 mg's weekly
Deca,which won't be too much for your size already and will give maybe even little better results.The arimidiex will keep the bloat down that you'll get from the Test/Deca combo.You'll get strong off of this cycle if you lift heavy.If you have any more questions,just ask.Everyone is here to help.

 

[BigLibby]

Damn Joe, you been smoking that meth again huh. Anyway, no need to front load when using dbol, just a waste of test. At your size, I would probably go with 600 mg of test and 400 deca. If your susty is 250 mg per, 500 is sufficient and easier on the math.

I guess 500mg would be enough. But make sure you inject it eod... the prop ester will be in and out of your body quickly... so to get the most bang for your buck. Inject eod. This shouldn't be a prob because you can preload about 3 weeks worth of gear. Also at those doses I don't think front loading would have much benefit

 

[BigLibby]

Well,if it was me,I'd go with 250 mg's of Sus eod.Blood levels will fluctuate too much with just 2x's weekly injects.You'll get much better results if go eod with Sus.Maybe go with 10 weeks Deca and 12 weeks Sus.Eod injects will keep blood levels consistent with the Sus.You could maybe even go with 500 mg's weekly
Deca,which won't be too much for your size already and will give maybe even little better results.The arimidiex will keep the bloat down that you'll get from the Test/Deca combo.You'll get strong off of this cycle if you lift heavy.If you have any more questions,just ask.Everyone is here to help.

Hey you beat me to it...

 

[Bigasmatt]

Can I tack on to this thread for the sake of interest?
If you take Sust eod and deca 400 mg once/w. would it be best to take the Deca on two seperate days each week (200mgs) or all at once in one dose(400mgs).
Or doesnt it make any difference?
+
Where can I get whatever Joe has been taking, must be some crazy shit LOL jk
BaM

 

[C-J]

Anyone else?

Lets BUMP this up again. Thanks for the feedback fellas, much appreciated.

CJ

 

[MaxRep]

The following is not a put-down to anyone but just meant to get us all to think and give feedback.

I'm just curious, among all those of you who advocate taking sustanon EOD, how much experience you have with sustanon 250 and various shot frequencies and real world results.

For example, at EOD, that's 875mg's/week. Have any of you really experienced noticable differences between taking in those 875mg's EOD versus twice a week?

I know we can all point to roid calculators charts and say with authority, EOD shots are best. Well, actually, according to the charts, ED shots are the best so maybe we should all advise ED shots...

The reason I think EOD shots are unnecessary is because I can't tell any difference between the results from them and twice a week shots. When the total number of mg's are the same. Neither can anyone else I've trained or trained with.

The last time I checked, the shortest ester in sust was propionate and it has a 2-3 day half-life and is included in sust in the smallest amount, making up only 30 of the 250mg's. And shot frequency is being based on that...?

Personally, over the past 24 years, I've used sust once every 2 weeks, once a week, twice a week, three times a week, and every other day.

Again, as long as the mg's/week were the same, I could never tell any difference between; twice a week, three times a week and every other day.

Just something to think about.

Regarding Bigasmatt; sorry but proper etiquette is for you to start your own thread.

Regarding CJ; for your second cycle, what you laid out in your first post is fine. The Dbol is the front load. I don't know who suggested front loading the sust, but that's not necessary when already front loading with an oral.

And, as you can tell from above, I believe the sust and deca, taken together in twice a week shots will work just as well as sticking yourself EOD.

MaxRep

 

[womenrimmer]

I should have said Mon.Wed.Fri.injects or Tues.Thurs.Sat.injects,instead of eod injects.Technically,that's not eod.I would not give advice on something I had not tried myself.I don't like Sus myself.I feel it's inferior to single esther compounds such as Cyp,Ent,but,he asked for suggestions with Sus.And yes,blood levels will fluctuate with Sus because of the Prop in it,but maxrep is right,it will stay in your system for between 48-72 hours and the Prop..is only 30 mg's of the product.I just feel;Why have any fluctuation whatsoever.If I was going to do 750 mg's weekly of Sus.and I had Norma or Organnon Deca,I would draw 1 cc of the Sus.into syringe first,then I would draw the 2 cc's of the Deca.I tried this cycle a couple of years ago and I didn't experience any pain from it.I've talked to other people that started adding other compounds to the Sus.syringe,and they stated that it masked the pain associated with Sus.Now,I only did 1 Sus.cycle before.I combined it with Deca and achieved satisfactory gains in strength and size,but not like I would have if I would have taken 750 mg's weekly of a single-esther compound test though from all of my other experiences.My recommendations were based on my experiences,not from what I've read or heard,but I've only tried it once.

 

[freak]

I agree with maxrep.
I also read a opinion from dan duchain the guru. A guy asked how should he split up 750mgs a week of sust.?
duchain responded that sust. is a very long acting test blend. in some people up to 21 days on one inject.
he advised the guy, it don't make a damn if you take the 750mgs all on one day , say Monday, then keep hitting every Mon.. thats one of the benefits of sustanon.

peace, freak

 

[C-J]

Thanks

MaxRep... much appreciated. All the input means alot to me. Thanks fellas.

Bump this up again for anyone else with real insight.

Thanks again
CJ

 

[C-J]

Anyone else?

BUmp this back up top.
Thanks
CJ

 

[Power Rabbit]

i agree you will prob see nearly the same gains...but jabbing EOD in my opinion would keep bloodlevels alittle more stable and possibly stave off sides...

 

[MaxRep]

I have never experimented with the dosing of the susty. I could be they recommend it EOD due to the short acting esther. The prop or undeclyonate has a half life on what about two days. So I think 3 shots EW is sufficient. But for a disclaimer again, I have not experimented with that. Generally, I will use cyp/enanth and prop instead of susty.

BigK, the propionate is only 30mg's out of the 250mg's and has a half-life of roughly between 2 and 3 days. The undecylenate ester has a half-life of roughly 8-10 days. Undecylenate has a long half-life, due to it's long carbon chain which is even longer than Decanoate's. Which as you know is usually used with nandrolone and considered very long lasting.

As far as staving off any side-effects, I think a person would have to go to extremes before noticing any difference in side effects. An extra few days shouldn't produce any difference in side effects, at least none that I ever noticed.

A lot of people like to talk about blood levels and fluctuations. The funny thing is, when you chart sust, it charts out basically the same as a single ester product. Taking Test enan or cyp or Nandrolone Deca, twice a week, results in very similar blood level fluctuations as does taking sust twice a week. So why don't we recommend taking everything EOD? The reason is because in real life, these fluctuations don't matter.

For those of you who don't know, you can go to:

http://powerboard.rockarfett.com/roidcalc/index.html

and play around with this to your hearts content. You may need to change some of the half-life information as there are several that are clearly wrong. For example, cypionate and enanthate are listed as having the same half-life and decanoate and undecylenate are listed as having the same half-life and it is impossible for these products to have the same half-life and in fact, they do not.

MaxRep

 

[womenrimmer]

I feel that for me fluctuating blood levels meant a lot,because I did not get the same "kick" from Sus.that I did from single esther test.I feel that it was probably what impeded my gains vs.the single compound products.Hey,
everybody is different.I achieved satisfactory(good) gains in strength and size,
but not great gains as I was used to with say Cypionate or Enanthate.I found
that for me,Cypionate always worked best.