4 week Dbol/Var cycle into 6 week Prop cycle Log

[Maven3]

Ive already started this cycle but logging it now as I believe its an interesting experiment and should be recorded.

I know oral only cycles are not recommended for a variety of reasons but Ive had one in mind that I wanted to try out personally.

Week 1-4
Dbol 40mg ED
Anavar 80 mg Dbol

Yes its a shit ton of orals but its only 4 weeks plus all the standard liver supps.

In this scenario Im using the var as the base of the cycle at 560mg per week and the dbol for added mass and strength.

Goals are strength and mass gains. Im starting at 9% BF at 165 pounds.

After the 4 weeks is done I will roll over straight into a 6 week prop cycle 150mg EOD.

The goal of the 6 week prop cycle is to hold onto the muscle from the the dbol/var and keep adding lean gains.

 

[Maven3]

Update:

Have completed the 4 weeks oral cycle. Interesting results.

Gained 15 pounds. I would qualify that as a good result. Strength gains were impressive went from lifting 220 pound bench press for a single top end set at 3 reps to 220 bench for 10 reps x 4 sets.

Overall gains and strength better than the first 4 weeks of my Test E cycle last year.

Now for the cons:

Test suppression kicking in around 2 weeks, fairly lethargic, no sense of well being like on a good test cycle. At 3 weeks + really dragging ass to the point its a struggle getting motivation to get to the gym. Once Im there energy seems to come on and I have a killer workout.

By week 4 I feel like Ive had enough, noticeable lack of energy, somewhat grumpy. Libido still okish but can take it or leave it kind of feel.

My overall thoughts.. definitely good results and I would say people on both sides of the oral only debate are correct. Gains are good. My impression is it works just as well or better than test even in the right stack BUT all the downsides are true. Lack of energy, loss of libido plus it is a strain on the liver for sure.

Would I do it again? Most likely not. Very much looking forward to not popping pills and just jabbing the Test P for the next 6 weeks and enjoying that "on" feeling.

I cant imagine running an oral cycle for 6-8 weeks as some do. Wouldnt want to feel like crap for that long.

 

[Maven3]

Update:

Ok did my first shot in right ventro glute. Been about a year since my last inject so I had to brush up on my technique but all seemed fine.

Got massive test flu the next day. I actually had to leave work and just lay in bed most of the day.. did mega doses of vit c powder as I always do when Im sick. Seems to have worked by today (Friday) I felt well enough for my 2nd jab which went into the left delt. Used a 27g 1/2 needle so painless!

Lunchtime now and Im finally starting to feel good, pretty amazing how you can go from wretched full flu symptoms to feeling great in 24 hours..

Shoulder workout today. Super happy I recovered quick from test flu.

And now Im caught up in this log with the cycle so will try to post updated at least once weekly.

 

[stang4u2nv]

Interesting cycle, i wouldn't have done it so my hat is off to you sir. Suppressing hpta like that no bueno.

 

[Maven3]

It wouldnt suppress hpta any more than a normal test cycle though? Or am I missing something.

 

[stang4u2nv]

Besides the fact that hpta suppression has a ton of effects on the body including testosterone production cessation, meaning your testosterone its probably in the gutter while on the orals and then you have to wait for the effects of the upcoming test to raise them. Not a good combination in my opinion but go for it.let us know.

 

[Maven3]

Fair enough I just wouldnt have thought it would be significant at only 4 weeks of orals. One thing that may have helped is I was shooting 250iu HCG twice weekly from week 2 to 4.

Quick update:

Just did my 3rd shot of the prop cycle into my other vg. 2nd shot went into my delt on friday.

So far the prop has held up all the strength from the var/dbol cycle and actually increased 1 or 2 reps at max working weight.

After 2nd shot I got a recurrence of test flu though I would say it was easily 50% the strength of the first one.

Im hoping by now after my 3rd shot my body has adjusted but well see.

 

[stang4u2nv]

Hcg would aid in maintaining the leydig cells stimulated even though there is no actual test production. That wouldnt do much but aid in recovery when on pct. I guess is better than nothing.

 

[HuckingFuge]

Update:

Have completed the 4 weeks oral cycle. Interesting results.

Gained 15 pounds. I would qualify that as a good result. Strength gains were impressive went from lifting 220 pound bench press for a single top end set at 3 reps to 220 bench for 10 reps x 4 sets.

Overall gains and strength better than the first 4 weeks of my Test E cycle last year.

Now for the cons:

Test suppression kicking in around 2 weeks, fairly lethargic, no sense of well being like on a good test cycle. At 3 weeks + really dragging ass to the point its a struggle getting motivation to get to the gym. Once Im there energy seems to come on and I have a killer workout.

By week 4 I feel like Ive had enough, noticeable lack of energy, somewhat grumpy. Libido still okish but can take it or leave it kind of feel.

My overall thoughts.. definitely good results and I would say people on both sides of the oral only debate are correct. Gains are good. My impression is it works just as well or better than test even in the right stack BUT all the downsides are true. Lack of energy, loss of libido plus it is a strain on the liver for sure.

Would I do it again? Most likely not. Very much looking forward to not popping pills and just jabbing the Test P for the next 6 weeks and enjoying that "on" feeling.

I cant imagine running an oral cycle for 6-8 weeks as some do. Wouldnt want to feel like crap for that long.

I think you lethargy came from your estrogen being too high. I didn't seem you running an AI.

 

[stang4u2nv]

Iam almost certain the lethargy comes from low testosterone, combine that to high estrogen boom, recipe for disaster. Thats my humble opinion.

 

[HuckingFuge]

Iam almost certain the lethargy comes from low testosterone, combine that to high estrogen boom, recipe for disaster. Thats my humble opinion.

this could be the case too. orals have a super short half life.

 

[Maven3]

Sorry forgot to mention i was running adex 0.5 ED throughout the oral cycle and have continued it into the prop cycle.

Lethargy well last time I ran dbol with test e I had some lethargy problems as well. Seems like dbol jist makes me want to sleep with or without test.

 

[roastdawg]

Interesting... Thinking of running tren a/dbol/var for my next two week bill roberts style cycle. Either that or just dbol and tren... Still deciding. Thanks for posting.

 

[Maven3]

I think the dbol/var combo is pretty good to be honest. In retrospect I would have liked to have just added in the Test Prop from the beginning.

If one were keen on a short 4 week cycle I believe you could get a good result from a 4 week cycle at:

Week 1-4
Test Prop 150mg EOD
Dbol 40mg ED
Anavar 80mg ED

Just conjecture but I would think adding in the Prop would have boosted gains at least another 5-10 pounds for a net gain of somewhere around 25 pounds.

Now minus the water and fat gain lets optimistically assume a 10-15 pound nett gain.

For the bigger guys throw some Tren A in there as well, I reckon it would be a killer short cycle.

Fuck I really wish Id done that now ha ha.

 

[ironwill1951]

i have found that if you do a cycle that you have not seen before its because it either does not work or its very unhealthy.. no one is going to come up with a new cycle it has all been tried by someone, their is a reason certain cycles are talked about all the time its because they work..

 

[Maven3]

I believe you are right. There are any number of classic cycles that would work as well or better than what Ive attempted.

I wouldn't recommend what Ive done to anyone else certainly.

However Ive always been stubborn about doing things my own way, or trying out ideas that I get. Sometimes it pays off sometimes it doesn't.

In this case what I like is what Ive learned about the gains that come from just orals alone and in particular the Var/Dbol stack, which I still believe is a good one.

However as Ive learned now, which all the vets ALWAYS say, stack it with test. Im quite sure that would have turned the first 4 weeks from an ok cycle with some minor sides like lethargy into a killer blast with high energy/aggression in the gym and better gains.

I will take what Ive learned in this cycle and apply to my next which wont be until around August next year.

 

[Maven3]

Update:

Into week 2 of the T Prop cycle. Today was the first time I came round to the original injection site. Im really hoping the muscle has adapted somewhat to the prop. Every inject from the last week has had fairly heavy pip. Painless injection, slight pip on day 2 and then heavy pip day 3-6.

Aside from that it was overall a good transition week. All major lifts went up 1-2 reps on max working weights. Body weight actually stayed the same, could be some water weight from dbol coming off?

Keen for a big 2nd week, just hope the pip eases up, Im walking around so stiff with 2-3 inject sites giving me pain at any one time ha ha