Atrophy when switching from HCG to clomid.

[Stevo213]

Hi all,

I got my TT to a good level of 700ng/dl with HCG (have been shut down for years). Balls also grew back a little and were firmer. Semen volume also increased which I was struggling with for years. I did this with 1000iu e3d over the span of 3 weeks.

I switched to Clomid 25mg ED and now suffering from atrophy again along with softness.

Any ideas?

 

[EcpertRealistic]

Hi all,

I got my TT to a good level of 700ng/dl with HCG (have been shut down for years). Balls also grew back a little and were firmer. Semen volume also increased which I was struggling with for years. I did this with 1000iu e3d over the span of 3 weeks.

I switched to Clomid 25mg ED and now suffering from atrophy again along with softness.

Any ideas?

Hipotalamus is shut down.

Naloxone might stimulate it.

Hcg keep your balls alive but keep your hipotalamus dormant just like any suppressive steroid will. LH and FSH will be very low

Hcg will also rise estrogen. Estrogen is more suppressive than testosterone to the hpta. Very important to keep estro around 30 when running a cycle,hcg or pct to prevent a harder suppression

 

[Evom1]

Hi all,

I got my TT to a good level of 700ng/dl with HCG (have been shut down for years). Balls also grew back a little and were firmer. Semen volume also increased which I was struggling with for years. I did this with 1000iu e3d over the span of 3 weeks.

I switched to Clomid 25mg ED and now suffering from atrophy again along with softness.

Any ideas?

I'm no expert but that dose of Clomid seems low

 

[Stevo213]

Hipotalamus is shut down.

Naloxone might stimulate it.

Hcg keep your balls alive but keep your hipotalamus dormant just like any suppressive steroid will. LH and FSH will be very low

Hcg will also rise estrogen. Estrogen is more suppressive than testosterone to the hpta. Very important to keep estro around 30 when running a cycle,hcg or pct to prevent a harder suppression

Thank you for your reply.
I had e2 tested at 36 pg/ml before starting clomid.
Possibility of going into SERM treatment with too high e2 therefore no response from balls?

 

[EcpertRealistic]

Thank you for your reply.
I had e2 tested at 36 pg/ml before starting clomid.
Possibility of going into SERM treatment with too high e2 therefore no response from balls?

Hcg will rise your testosterone above normal during treatment but your TT will go down after discontinuation. Size of testicles will decrease after hcg discontination, but testicles shouldn't atrophy; they should be bigger than before treatment. Size decrease and atrophy are too different things, make sure you are not confusing terms.
Too much hcg, specially for longer periods of time can cause desensitization and hpta shutdown; this may result in atrophy. This is why short bursts when off cycle are a better option - while small dosages during cycle will keep normal function of the testicles without overstimulating them and desensitizing them.

After a long cycle 25mgs clomid/day for 4 weeks might not be enough.

Your estrogen is on the higher side of normal and it should come down a few weeks after hcg treatment is over.


Time for another test? Atrophy and a tt of 700 doesn't make sense. Your results will depend on wether you are under stimulants or completely natty

 

[mands]

Hcg will rise your testosterone above normal during treatment but your TT will go down after discontinuation. Size of testicles will decrease after hcg discontination, but testicles shouldn't atrophy; they should be bigger than before treatment. Size decrease and atrophy are too different things, make sure you are not confusing terms.
Too much hcg, specially for longer periods of time can cause desensitization and hpta shutdown; this may result in atrophy. This is why short bursts when off cycle are a better option - while small dosages during cycle will keep normal function of the testicles without overstimulating them and desensitizing them.

After a long cycle 25mgs clomid/day for 4 weeks might not be enough.

Your estrogen is on the higher side of normal and it should come down a few weeks after hcg treatment is over.


Time for another test? Atrophy and a tt of 700 doesn't make sense. Your results will depend on wether you are under stimulants or completely natty

You do know decrease and atrophy are synonyms correct?

Desensitization? Really show me where you found this info?

And 36 pg/ml is high side of normal? wtf.

STOP giving advice man. You are ridiculous.

mands

 

[EcpertRealistic]

You do know decrease and atrophy are synonyms correct?

Desensitization? Really show me where you found this info?

And 36 pg/ml is high side of normal? wtf.

STOP giving advice man. You are ridiculous.

mands

You still mad because I said you were overweight ??

You are 70+ pounds over your ideal weight and you holding a lot of fat due to your lack of estrogen control... That's all I said as a constructive criticism but if you took it personal and got offended that's your problem.

All I said was true. And btw nobody wants to look like you.
You are too fat and soft, not to forget your bitch tits.

Both your advice and your physique SUCK. Everyone here long enough know many people you have adviced ended up with gyno just like you.



Again sorry if I offended you to start with but you are screwing people up with your advice

 

[MindlessWork]

You still mad because I said you were overweight ??

You are 70+ pounds over your ideal weight and you holding a lot of fat due to your lack of estrogen control... That's all I said as a constructive criticism but if you took it personal and got offended that's your problem.

All I said was true. And btw nobody wants to look like you.
You are too fat and soft, not to forget your bitch tits.

Both your advice and your physique SUCK. Everyone here long enough know many people you have adviced ended up with gyno just like you.



Again sorry if I offended you to start with but you are screwing people up with your advice

Who the fuck you think you talking down to? @mands is one knowledgeable member here and you talk shit to/about him a lot. Seems your shitty advice is getting the response it deserves

 

[mands]

You still mad because I said you were overweight ??

You are 70+ pounds over your ideal weight and you holding a lot of fat due to your lack of estrogen control... That's all I said as a constructive criticism but if you took it personal and got offended that's your problem.

All I said was true. And btw nobody wants to look like you.
You are too fat and soft, not to forget your bitch tits.

Both your advice and your physique SUCK. Everyone here long enough know many people you have adviced ended up with gyno just like you.



Again sorry if I offended you to start with but you are screwing people up with your advice

You never said I was overweight or anything else I highlighted in red. Those are lies. Try again.

Absolutely nothing you have said is true in the whole thread.

Post some pics up little man and learn how to spell advised. I do not have gyno dude.

Of course you didn't post anything I asked you to prove. Go play in the street or over at EVO.

mands

 

[master.on]

Hi all,

I got my TT to a good level of 700ng/dl with HCG (have been shut down for years). Balls also grew back a little and were firmer. Semen volume also increased which I was struggling with for years. I did this with 1000iu e3d over the span of 3 weeks.

I switched to Clomid 25mg ED and now suffering from atrophy again along with softness.

Any ideas?

Even if you restore pituitary LH/FSH (by Clomid or other means)
their stimulation to Testis may be too weak
that's why you need HCG (which mimics LH, and FSH a bit), at high enough dosages as to provide a stronger signal to get testis to respond.

You may need to stay on HCG for several months
no big deal as studies show HCG is safe long-term
Therapy with human chorionic gonadotrophin alone induces spermatogenesis in men with isolated hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism--long-term follow-up. - PubMed - NCBI
just watch your Estrogen and use Aromatase Inhibitors if needed.

 

[Stevo213]

Even if you restore pituitary LH/FSH (by Clomid or other means)
their stimulation to Testis may be too weak
that's why you need HCG (which mimics LH, and FSH a bit), at high enough dosages as to provide a stronger signal to get testis to respond.

You may need to stay on HCG for several months
no big deal as studies show HCG is safe long-term
Therapy with human chorionic gonadotrophin alone induces spermatogenesis in men with isolated hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism--long-term follow-up. - PubMed - NCBI
just watch your Estrogen and use Aromatase Inhibitors if needed.

That's exactly what happened. High LH/FSH but low T after swapping to clomid.
Will follow your advice you gave me on an older post and do 1000iu a week for months.