Avodart and Gyno - Pictures and Lab Work Attached

[ef11]

Hello all,

I would please ask if you have nothing productive to add and just want to be rude, do not comment. I am a happy successful 27 year old male just looking for some advice while I wait a month for my Endo appointment. For those that can help, thank you so much for taking the time. I am really not in a position to stop taking the Fin, so please do not recommend that.

Background:
I have taken Fin since I was 19 (8 years now) and never experienced side effects from 2008-2013 and it has worked well for me. I know some people have lots of issues, so for this I am thankful. in 2013 I thought I could take it to the next level and add some Avodart (Dutasteride) to my regiment. I took two pills a week for four weeks and all of the sudden I got puffy nipples, I immediately stopped taking the Avodart. I saw an Endo and took Clomid for a few weeks but it didn't seem to help.

Current Status:
Since 2013 I haven't touched Avodart and have remained on Fin which never gave me any side effects, but the puffy nipples have remained and have very slowly gotten worse over the past three years. I feel pain in my nipples from time to time as well. I have no sexual side effects and no brain fog, I feel great, run a few miles every day, perform well at work, overall life is great!

My Thoughts:
It seems something with the Avodart just through my system off balance and it has never got put back in place. For 5 years the Fin didn't give me a single side effect but after 8 pills of Avodart the puffiness started and hasn't gone away even with discontinuing it. I am not in a position to stop Fin so please don't go there. It worked great for 5 years with no effects, and I would like to get back to that situation and once back in balance I will probably have surgery to correct the Gyno.

Questions:
It looks like my lab results are good? So I'm really not sure what could be wrong. I have no other symptoms which I am very grateful for.

Is there anything I could try taking to lower Estrogen some without impacting hairloss, I don't think I need something really strong, just something to help put my system back in balance if it is off.

Any thoughts on what could be going on here? Seems crazy to have no other effects other than Gyno, but everyone is different I guess

Pictures:
The first picture is me in 2012 at 165 LBs before ever touching Avodart, at this point in time I could wear any Tshirt, golf shirt, etc and my chest looked very good.
screen shot on pc

The second picture is me in 2016 at 173 LBs three years after taking 8 pills of Avodart (yes, 8 LBs heavier but my chest shouldn't look this much different. I have been at 165 LBs this year and the Gyno remained the same as in this picture) At this point wearing golf shirts and most Tshirts doesn't look great, can clearly see the Gyno. You can see how much weight I am carrying around my chest.
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Here is a side view currently:
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Lab Results (I did fast for 12 hours before):
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Thank you so much for taking the time to read

 

[TheOldFart]

I'm far from being an expert on this, but here are my thoughts.

I don't see any problem with your labs. Your T is great and I think that your estradiol is right where it should be. I'm 71 YO and have been on TRT for about 6-7 years and feel the best when my E2 is 25-30. I don't think that 25.6 is too high. You need to be careful if you want to lower it, as some studies show that E2 is more important then T in preventing osteoporosis, even in men. If you take something like Arimidex then you could force E2 very low very fast.

I think that some of the extra chest is just fat. Looking at your entire chest/ab area, you have less definition everywhere. It's harder to see your ribs and your stomach is less defined. Most of the chest growth could just be fat.

Have you by any chance gained weight because of less exercise over the past few years? If so then you might have gained more fat then just the 8 pounds gained. Less exercise would result in some muscle loss, so if you lost like 4 pounds of muscle then you could have gained 4+8 or 12 pounds of fat.

 

[ef11]

Hello, thanks for your reply.

I have been leaner than my 2016 picture attached (165 LBs) and the gyno remained, and I had also been 195 pounds in 2012 (I lost a bunch of weight to get to the 165 in that picture) and I still didn't have gyno. So this is definitely true Gyno that won't go away with just weight loss alone. Also the pain I have in my nipples and the fact that they got puffy in a one month time frame without weight gain contribute to this thought.

I work out with weights 2-4 times per week and typically run at least 2 miles per day, so I am physically active. My arms and legs are very defined, but I store fat around my stomach and chest. When I get cold my chest tightens up and the Gyno essentially goes away but I think that is typical with most cases of lite/medium Gyno.

 

[ef11]

A few additional pictures after running 3.5 miles today:
One thing that always throws me off is when I run hard or am cold the Gyno almost goes away and gets extremely tight. I think Gyno does this though, correct? When I'm not cold my nipples are as shown in the original post and very puffy and stick out.

Looks much closer to my 2012 picture
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Compared to the side view before it looks much better
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[Savagesteve]

I'm also not an expert on this but here we go. Do you have a lump behind the nipple? I also agree with @TheOldFart that it looks like fat in the chest area as you aren't as Lean as the before avodart pics. You may also hold water there.

 

[ef11]

Hello, thank you for your reply. It's hard to tell if there is a lump, the left one is bigger and it feels like a bunch of stuff is behind the nipple, some of it hard. The right not so much.

But, as I stated, I weighed over 200 LBs in high school and I was 195 LBs right before that picture in 2012 where I had no Gyno and at both very high weights there was no Gyno. Now I weigh in the low 170s and have significant Gyno where I can clearly see it in golf shirts and many TShirts, so I really don't understand how it could just be fat.

And I've been 165 this year and still had Gyno just the same as my pictures and I feel pain in my nipples.

 

[ef11]

Hello, just wanted to see if anyone else wanted to chime in. It is definitely gyno as it grows ever so slowly even if I am loosing weight and I feel slight pain in my nipples.

I'm ok with having Gyno surgery but I would like to ensure I don't have surgery and then continue to have growth.

Thanks for the replies.

 

[DoUEvenCardio]

Hello, just wanted to see if anyone else wanted to chime in. It is definitely gyno as it grows ever so slowly even if I am loosing weight and I feel slight pain in my nipples.

I'm ok with having Gyno surgery but I would like to ensure I don't have surgery and then continue to have growth.

Thanks for the replies.

I'm not a educated on the subject that much, but I believe during gyno surgery most doctors will remove the glands keeping you gyno free after. If you are really concerned just go see a dr. and he will tell you if it's gyno and what your options are. Some people have had luck with taking daily doses of Raloxifene to reverse gyno. If it's not fully hardened, this may be an option for you.

 

[Raven101]

First off, im SHOCKED your doctor would prescribe clomid for gyno ! Clomid could make it worse. Why, clomid is a serm which blocks estrogen in certain area' ( hypothalamus) and promotes it in other area's. Nolvadex( tomaxafen) which is also a serm is VERY breast tissue specific and much better at combatting gyno. Clomid is a good option to restart T production but not so good at getting rid of gyno.
Try nolvadex at 10 mgs a day for a month and see what happens. Worse case, you get surgery which is easy and painless.
Did fina help your hair ?

 

[johntt44]

It doesn't look like gyno just a little chest fat. As was stated by another poster you just look leaner overall in the first picture. People's bodies put on fat in different areas than other peoples do. Best of luck to you!

 

[ef11]

Thanks for the replies, I will keep you posted on the status. I definitely wish he would have prescribed me nolvadex as well, I might not be in this situation. Fin does help with the hair but nothing is perfect.

It defintely is gyno...I have weight 215 pounds in highschool and as low as 165 in that picture and I never had a bit of gyno (I fluctuated weight a decent amount, right now I'm at 170). I took Avodart and had nipples within 4 weeks and gained 0 Lbs. I understand the pictures from present day show me the have more weight on my body, but I had the same "nipple profile" when I was just as lean as the first picture with puffy nipples that stick out. The avodart drastically changed my chest appearance and it has stuck.

 

[Dr JIM]

If that's GCM few would notice or be concerned about its appearance.

As others have suggested the changes are most likely CHEST WALL FAT rather than GCM.

The two can be readily differentiated by Sono but the use of Avodart some FIVE YEARS AGO has NOTHING to do with it.

My suggestion start an exercise routine to improve your body image!