Bloodwork 11 months post cycle

[kosp]

OK.

In fact, I don't believe that the "line of irreversible damage" is even well-documented, nor do I think people are conducting pre and post cycle checks properly, not to mention the long lasting effect of SERMs and allowing SUFFICIENT time.

So, that "irreversible decrease to HPG axis functioning" you mentioned is rather a confusing concept.

 

[Jin23]

I don't think I crossed the line of making irreversible damage.

I have done 3 full cycles and another 2 had to stop at 2-3 weeks. Since 18 and I am 27. Never more than 13 weeks. Always resting +1year as minimum, even more.

Have you used hcg on cycle? Hcg helps prevent leydig cell apoptosis.

 

[kosp]

Have you used hcg on cycle? Hcg helps prevent leydig cell apoptosis.

No, but I blasted good doses of HCG at the end of cycle, when leading to PCT

Balls feel as big as ever

 

[Jin23]

No, but I blasted good doses of HCG at the end of cycle, when leading to PCT

Balls feel as big as ever

That doesn't matter, it only helps making pct easier. Your balls were still completely shut off for 13 weeks and that's when the irreversible damage happens and this is most likely why you're experiencing lowered gonadal function post cycle. It's why we use hcg during the cycle ...

 

[kosp]

That doesn't matter, it only helps making pct easier. Your balls were still completely shut off for 13 weeks and that's when the irreversible damage happens and this is most likely why you're experiencing lowered gonadal function post cycle. It's why we use hcg during the cycle ...

I hope that's not the case dude... I would get extremely pissed off if I don't achieve my true levels again.

Also, I started mid january 2023, it hasn't been even 1 year after first pin, also with longer esters, a 13 weeks cycle are actually 17 weeks or so of suppression, because it shuts you down pretty quick since first pin.

It's not a crazy idea you take 1 year to fully recover after compounds have cleared, this is pretty nasty shit for the body....

 

[Jin23]

I hope that's not the case dude... I would get extremely pissed off if I don't achieve my true levels again.

Also, I started mid january 2023, it hasn't been even 1 year after first pin, also with longer esters, a 13 weeks cycle are actually 17 weeks or so of suppression, because it shuts you down pretty quick since first pin.

It's not a crazy idea you take 1 year to fully recover after compounds have cleared, this is pretty nasty shit for the body....

Oh, so it's actually app 5 to 6 months after your pct and not 11 months?

Regarding hcg on cycle and leydig cell apoptosis, unfortunately yes, ... I never lost any gonadal function, zero, nada, presumably as I always used hcg on cycle. I lost gonadal function on my last stint, which was 9 months long and I used only 100 iu eod. TT dropped by about 100, 150 ...

 

[kosp]

Oh, so it's actually app 5 to 6 months after your pct and not 11 months?

Regarding hcg on cycle and leydig cell apoptosis, unfortunately yes, ... I never lost any gonadal function, zero, nada, presumably as I always used hcg on cycle. I lost gonadal function on my last stint, which was 9 months long and I used only 100 iu eod. TT dropped by about 100, 150 ...

Yes, now it's about 6 - 7 months AFTER PCT.

I think that a more prevalent factor about your case is the length of cycle, 9 months is a lot of time. It doesn't matter how much hcg you are pinning, your balls were asleep for a long time.

 

[Jin23]

Yes, now it's about 6 - 7 months AFTER PCT.

I think that a more prevalent factor about your case is the length of cycle, 9 months is a lot of time. It doesn't matter how much hcg you are pinning, your balls were asleep for a long time.

Both were a factor.

The dose of hcg mater's. At a certain dose the gonads are working at a normal, natty capacity or above ...

 

[kosp]

Both were a factor.

The dose of hcg mater's. At a certain dose the gonads are working at a normal, natty capacity or above ...

I did in 2019 a 10-weeks test C cycle with no hcg, just some doses at the end, leading to PCT. I recovered great, 3 months after PCT I did fucking 1000ng/dL, it was a different bloodowork lab though, I don't know what happened there.

TT oscilates a lot, give it more time.

 

[Jin23]

I did in 2019 a 10-weeks test C cycle with no hcg, just some doses at the end, leading to PCT. I recovered great, 3 months after PCT I did fucking 1000ng/dL, it was a different bloodowork lab though, I don't know what happened there.

TT oscilates a lot, give it more time.

Ok : )

 

[kosp]

Ok : )

leydig cell apoptosis... jesuschrist dude.

 

[Jin23]

leydig cell apoptosis... jesuschrist dude.

Huh?

 

[GuerillaPete]

The real question is why is your prolactin high?and why did you not test estradiol?

 

[kosp]

The real question is why is your prolactin high?and why did you not test estradiol?

No idea, but it's getting better, 3 months ago was at 36... my hormones are still regulating. May prolactin be a problem?

I did estradiol 1 month post pct and it was at 34, no problems with that. This time the doc didn't order it.

 

[kosp]

Huh?

I just hope it didn't happen dude haha

 

[GuerillaPete]

No idea, but it's getting better, 3 months ago was at 36... my hormones are still regulating. May prolactin be a problem?

I did estradiol 1 month post pct and it was at 34, no problems with that. This time the doc didn't order it.

Yes it can be the problem and high prolactin usually comes with high e2.
If not you have some other issue.
P5P is said to help with prolactin but i have no personal experience with it.

 

[kosp]

Yes it can be the problem and high prolactin usually comes with high e2.
If not you have some other issue.
P5P is said to help with prolactin but i have no personal experience with it.

Indeed when prolactin levels are elevated, it can interfere with the normal functioning of the HPTA, thus reducing testosterone production.

I already told my doc about it, with a level of 36 (upper limit 19,4), and he gave 0 importance to it, he said that it will be fixed by itself over time and that it's not a really high level, 3 months later it improved from 36 to 19,7.

I don't want to self medicate but maybe 0.25 dostinex twice per week for a few weeks will be the finishing touch to regulate this. What do you think?

 

[kosp]

You wont and if you do it will be as @Type-IIx said, a transient elevation, although I doubt you'll see even that - but if you do, it doesn't mater. And I agree, you're done recovering. Makes little sense worrying about it. Besides, your TT and SHBG levels are fine.

You might have had higher shbg pre cycling and that could have been reflected in a higher TT level. Although it's usually the opposite, my shbg is around 70 - 80 after cycling when it used to be around 40.

I wouldn't mess with Ai's though. Any gains made with Ai's is only temporary. I've no knowledge about Ai's increasing leydig cell function or increasing LH output long term. Estrogen should bounce back and with it; the whole system should return back to your baseline. @GuerillaPete what's the reasoning behind Ai use; what good would a short term T elevation serve?

A couple months later...

TT 800ng/dL, I did bloodwork yesterday early in the morning This is my true level, thank God for my natty power.

@Type-IIx

 

[Jin23]

A couple months later...

TT 800ng/dL, I did bloodwork yesterday early in the morning This is my true level, thank God for my natty power.

@Type-IIx

I'm glad you finally saw the number which made you happy buddy.

Was this test at another lab and at an earlier hour then the rest off them? Also remember, TT varies from day to day, if you get a couple more measurements at this level, then you can be assured with a greater certainty that this is it now.

 

[kosp]

I'm glad you finally saw the number which made you happy buddy.

Was this test at another lab and at an earlier hour then the rest off them? Also remember, TT varies from day to day, if you get a couple more measurements at this level, then you can be assured with a greater certainty that this is it now.

Yes this time has been in my regular lab since 8 years ago, where I even did my pre first cycle tests, I have a long record there of TT measurements lol. I am where I am supposed to be now.

Time of extraction as always, between 8 and 9 am.

Yes, TT varies, and I didn't even sleep well, if I slept better it would have been higher level.

I can tell results can vary from lab, I have tried another one in the past and I did 1000ng/dL, and in this one, my max ever was 820 ng/dL. It's probably best to stick to one lab to have objective measurements.