Cutting too deep.... at what point do we start losing muscle?

[Spokeonawheel]

This seemed the most appropriate section of the forum for this question:

At what point in a cut or contest prep have you all noticed loss of lean tissue?

I've only ran 2 cuts. In the midst of the second one now. I'm cutting at a steeper deficit this time. Probably 1000 cals below maint (3200 cals approx maint.)
Macros are about 250 g protein fats between 60 and 80 carbs 100 g or less. Sometimes protein runs a little higher. Im averaging about 2200 cals. Ive cut down from 230 lbs to 212 now. I'd say I'm around %12 right now.

I've notice no significant loss of muscle size. Basically none. Bench, shoulder press, squat numbers are down a bit. But it's to be expected.

Only running 300 test. Just upped my cruise by a little bit for the cut. (Maybe unnecessarily)

It's had me wondering if this fear of losing muscle on a cut is largely fiction. Like we need to take all this gear to Maintain size and a lot of us just dont need to.

Now, I understand going from 16 to 12% isn't really that far into the danger zone. I also understand that I'm not huge bodybuilder size. I understand that some of us will need more gear to maintain a certain amount of size and when pursuing very low bf there will be a point where even muscle begins to melt away.

Where have you all found that point to be?

Thanks for reading this long ass post.

 

[jJjburton]

This seemed the most appropriate section of the forum for this question:

At what point in a cut or contest prep have you all noticed loss of lean tissue?

I've only ran 2 cuts. In the midst of the second one now. I'm cutting at a steeper deficit this time. Probably 1000 cals below maint (3200 cals approx maint.)
Macros are about 250 g protein fats between 60 and 80 carbs 100 g or less. Sometimes protein runs a little higher. Im averaging about 2200 cals. Ive cut down from 230 lbs to 212 now. I'd say I'm around %12 right now.

I've notice no significant loss of muscle size. Basically none. Bench, shoulder press, squat numbers are down a bit. But it's to be expected.

Only running 300 test. Just upped my cruise by a little bit for the cut. (Maybe unnecessarily)

It's had me wondering if this fear of losing muscle on a cut is largely fiction. Like we need to take all this gear to Maintain size and a lot of us just dont need to.

Now, I understand going from 16 to 12% isn't really that far into the danger zone. I also understand that I'm not huge bodybuilder size. I understand that some of us will need more gear to maintain a certain amount of size and when pursuing very low bf there will be a point where even muscle begins to melt away.

Where have you all found that point to be?

Thanks for reading this long ass post.

Also interested. Because like you said at some point a cruise dose wont work for cutting, without losing muscle.

 

[Demondosage]

Sub 10%, I've always lost muscle no matter how much gear or how much protein. Once you get single digit it'll take some muscle away, for myself the arms always are the biggest bitch to hold the size on!

 

[Demondosage]

Also, I think 8% is ideal for me. It looks healthy and you are already hungry enough there. Anything more drastic becomes straight fucking misery! You can look amazing and it won't even matter when you are that miserable and dragging ass

 

[malfeasance]

At 12% body fat I have not lost any strength on any exercise. I am usually still gaining strength. I am probably more down around 8% before I notice any loss of strength, and even then only on some exercises.

Are you doing cardio? If not, I would suggest you introduce it. Also, increase your carbs on some days to 250. Maybe every third or fourth day. See how that treats you.

Also, as to your "unnecessarily" comment about the testosterone increase, I disagree. Hormones signal your body to hold on to muscle while you are cutting (slowly starving!). I do not agree with those who cut on 100 mg a week of trt a week. If anything, I would increase it more than you have done for the remainder of the cut.

Also, take some photos of mandatory poses. I know it might sound silly to you, but you can't see yourself except in the mirror. Nothing reveals your level of body fat like comparing a photo of you doing a rear double biceps to an on stage competitor. You'll figure out whether you are lean really quickly that way. Plus, it helps you track your progress.

Don't be scared of the scale dropping, and don't be scared of losing muscle and strength.

The gains when you come off of a really lean state are amazing.

 

[Spokeonawheel]

Thanks for replies @Demondosage and @malfeasance . I was hoping both of you would chime in.

As far as loss of strength I'm comparing peak bulk and cycle PRs as far as any loss of strength. I am off of the very top numbers I've ever put up but still gaining steadily.

My lazy ass has not been doing cardio. I have no real excuse. I should be.

I would certainly enjoy more carbs....Jesus. my understanding of how to nourish myself properly bulking or cutting is decent, but not great. I definitely appreciate all input.

Have been keeping test dose low as I am prepping for a bulking blast soon. After my first cut I had the best bulk cycle of my life.