Cycle Input

[Beachbum69]

Long story short I had an ACL replacement and some life shit a year ago. Went from athletic shape (no-aas use for 3 years) to low key dad bod. Used to be yoked. But.. Here I am. I'm looking to get back into the gym 2-3 hours a day, melt some of this extra fat and get back into gear ().

The last cycle I did was a test, tren, mast a few years ago. Did great. Everyone was very impressed as was I with my results and no sides for me either. (not many of my friends touched gear). Here is my upcoming cycle I'm thinking:

Week 1-16
Primobolan E. 300mg twice a week
Test E 250mg twice a week

Week 1-10
Proviron 50mg daily

Week 1-8
ECA Stack (25/300/162) split daily (I'm sensitive)

Week 10-18
Anavar 50mg daily first week, 80mg daily the rest

PCT
Nolvadex 20mg twice daily for 45 days
Clomid 50mg twice daily 30 days
HCG 2000iu eod for 20 days


My thinking here is that test and provi are amazing together, great synergistic effects. Add Primo to the mix and I'm seeing great clean gains, healthy lean muscle building without significant sides to manage. I have a big appetite and I need an appetite suppressor more than a clen burner. I figure a low side dose ECA stack for 8 weeks would be greatly beneficial without much health risk(?). At 10 weeks I'd start taking Var to start slimming out and transition towards cutting the muscle gains of the last 10 weeks. Half life is short and would be great to lead into my PCT 2 weeks after my last test E shot and I could start my PCT essentially day after my anavar ends and continue cutting with my PCT.

Any input on what you would change up in terms of length, PCT, or dosages let me know. I'm not interested in any other types of gear right now. I think the dosages are a good sweet spot and the synergy is there at proper times. Looking forward to your constructive feedback.

 

[AlwaysHungry]

Dosages and cycle outline looks good itself I wouldn't change anything. But tell us your stats now like height weight bodyfat etc.
If y wanna melt down fat you should also do cardio and dieting.

One thing maybe I would change is this.
When I'll add the Var I would increase dosage to 50-100mg a day and reduce test for 500 to 250. Just to drop the water and see more clearly what bodyfat I have burned. And also look more polished etc.
Or maybe I would di 250 test from start and increase a little primo

 

[Beachbum69]

Hey there!

I'm Male, 6", 220, broad shoulder build. I need to test my BF but I think I'm around 25% right now. I started dieting last month and already lost 10 lbs. I also plan on staying under 2,000 calories a day, under 30 carbs, and at least 250g of protein a day. As best I can at least. Really hoping that ECA stack can help curb my appetite.

On the var, I was only going to do 50mg a day for the first week just to make sure I tolerate it well then up it to 80mg daily for 7 weeks. I should IP the dosage more? I understand why you would drop the test, because of the water retention right? What would the benefit of upping the Primo be? Running 6000mg for 16 weeks is already costing me a nice chunk of change. Lol.

One thing I'm mixed on is the Test. Seems like you have your "more test is better" crowd and your "250-350mg" of test is all you need crowd. I'm not really sure what would be ideal. I was thinking because I still have decent muscle and muscle memory but I'm not stacked anymore I'd benefit from the larger test dosage my first cycle and a lower dose next time would be good. I'm not an expert though.

 

[BigDaddyV]

Hey there!

I'm Male, 6", 220, broad shoulder build. I need to test my BF but I think I'm around 25% right now. I started dieting last month and already lost 10 lbs. I also plan on staying under 2,000 calories a day, under 30 carbs, and at least 250g of protein a day. As best I can at least. Really hoping that ECA stack can help curb my appetite.

On the var, I was only going to do 50mg a day for the first week just to make sure I tolerate it well then up it to 80mg daily for 7 weeks. I should IP the dosage more? I understand why you would drop the test, because of the water retention right? What would the benefit of upping the Primo be? Running 6000mg for 16 weeks is already costing me a nice chunk of change. Lol.

One thing I'm mixed on is the Test. Seems like you have your "more test is better" crowd and your "250-350mg" of test is all you need crowd. I'm not really sure what would be ideal. I was thinking because I still have decent muscle and muscle memory but I'm not stacked anymore I'd benefit from the larger test dosage my first cycle and a lower dose next time would be good. I'm not an expert though.

Higher primo would provide some clean gains. IMO more test is better for putting on size. When you’re trying to achieve a goal like yours I’d say less test.

 

[Beachbum69]

Higher primo would provide some clean gains. IMO more test is better for putting on size. When you’re trying to achieve a goal like yours I’d say less test.

I'm definitely trying to burn the fat but I think that will happen whether I cut or add lean mass right? Would doing an anavar cycle for 6 weeks starting 12 weeks instead of at 10 for 8 serve my purpose of putting on more mass for 12 weeks then leaning it out with var after? How much more Primo dosage are we talking?

 

[BigDaddyV]

I'm definitely trying to burn the fat but I think that will happen whether I cut or add lean mass right? Would doing an anavar cycle for 6 weeks starting 12 weeks instead of at 10 for 8 serve my purpose of putting on more mass for 12 weeks then leaning it out with var after? How much more Primo dosage are we talking?

I’ve never used anavar I can’t really say.
people tend to use somewhere in the ballpark of a gram of primo. I’m sure a little less wouldn’t be too detrimental, you may not even need to raise your dosage with the var and test you will likely accomplish your goals. I’m a believe in getting the most you can out of as little as possible, so start where you are and if you need to increase it then fuckin go for it

 

[malfeasance]

One thing I'm mixed on is the Test. Seems like you have your "more test is better" crowd and your "250-350mg" of test is all you need crowd. I'm not really sure what would be ideal. I was thinking because I still have decent muscle and muscle memory but I'm not stacked anymore I'd benefit from the larger test dosage my first cycle and a lower dose next time would be good. I'm not an expert though.

There is a real study out there about varying doses of testosterone. The participants did not work out. The two highest doses were 300 and 600 weekly.

The 600 weekly group lost more fat and added more muscle than the 300 or lower groups.

They were not lifting weights. Just running testosterone for a period of time and then measuring fat and muscle.

These were on healthy young males.

I would be careful, however, with high body fat and testosterone, because higher body fat = higher aromatization. Just something to keep in mind or keep an eye on. I am glad to hear that you already dropped 10 pounds, but please keep in mind that is mainly glycogen and water. You are just now, with glycogen and water lowered, tapping into and burning fat stores. Keep at it!

What are you going to do for cardio with that ACL issue?



Suggestions: Keep cutting natty a while longer. Get that body fat a little lower, get your natty cardio capacity up some, before introducing things we know have bad cardiovascular effects.

If you are on track, losing two pounds a week, then twice a month increase your carbs to 200 grams (just trust me on this one), preferably the day before a leg or back day. Enjoy the extra oats, rice, and potato without guilt and then see what happens over the following week.

 

[BigDaddyV]

There is a real study out there about varying doses of testosterone. The participants did not work out. The two highest doses were 300 and 600 weekly.

The 600 weekly group lost more fat and added more muscle than the 300 or lower groups.

They were not lifting weights. Just running testosterone for a period of time and then measuring fat and muscle.

These were on healthy young males.

I would be careful, however, with high body fat and testosterone, because higher body fat = higher aromatization. Just something to keep in mind or keep an eye on. I am glad to hear that you already dropped 10 pounds, but please keep in mind that is mainly glycogen and water. You are just now, with glycogen and water lowered, tapping into and burning fat stores. Keep at it!

What are you going to do for cardio with that ACL issue?



Suggestions: Keep cutting natty a while longer. Get that body fat a little lower, get your natty cardio capacity up some, before introducing things we know have bad cardiovascular effects.

If you are on track, losing two pounds a week, then twice a month increase your carbs to 200 grams (just trust me on this one), preferably the day before a leg or back day. Enjoy the extra oats, rice, and potato without guilt and then see what happens over the following week.

I’m a believer in more test, I literally always run high test but I also think that since he will be on other compounds the high test is not necessary. That group was only on testosterone. Though, you are correct that 600 would be better than 3, that is if it’s ran solo, I personally feel as though the added compounds will make the higher test unnecessary. Just my opinion though I’d like to hear yours

 

[malfeasance]

I've never run primo. It is one of those things I have always wanted to try.

 

[Beachbum69]

I found a study out of Portugal that showed that Anavar uptake was increased 10-20 fold when taken with 160mg+ of coffee at the time you take the pills. (think two shots of expresso). Which is why I'm considering even staying at 50mg because I'll be getting the entire dosage and not have to compensate for the loss of bio-availability in the liver with a higher dosage.

So it sounds like between you guys, my plan is meeting in the middle (that sweet spot as I called it in my OP).

The Test E + Provi will significantly increase the effectiveness of the Test with very little risk of any sides or liver toxicity and reduce any estrogen concerns because of my body fat percentage currently. Stack the Primo at 600mg which also works synergistically will be a great addition to the cycle as my main steroid which will result in solid, healthy muscle and mass gains.

The ECA stack should help curb appetite and burn calories/fat in the first half of my cycle. Which will be good to keep me stacking muscle while losing significant fat. Once I'm done with that ECA stack, two weeks later when the Provi is done I'll be taking Anavar to compliment the last half of my Primo/Test. .

I've read that Provi and Anavar aren't recommended to take together because they are for two different results (mass vs cutting). This is why I'm doing a 16 week cycle + 2 weeks overage with the Anavar (8 weeks total).

Because I'm running for 16 weeks I figure my dosages are good enough for that period of time.

Thoughts?

 

[BigDaddyV]

I found a study out of Portugal that showed that Anavar uptake was increased 10-20 fold when taken with 160mg+ of coffee at the time you take the pills. (think two shots of expresso). Which is why I'm considering even staying at 50mg because I'll be getting the entire dosage and not have to compensate for the loss of bio-availability in the liver with a higher dosage.

So it sounds like between you guys, my plan is meeting in the middle (that sweet spot as I called it in my OP).

The Test E + Provi will significantly increase the effectiveness of the Test with very little risk of any sides or liver toxicity and reduce any estrogen concerns because of my body fat percentage currently. Stack the Primo at 600mg which also works synergistically will be a great addition to the cycle as my main steroid which will result in solid, healthy muscle and mass gains.

The ECA stack should help curb appetite and burn calories/fat in the first half of my cycle. Which will be good to keep me stacking muscle while losing significant fat. Once I'm done with that ECA stack, two weeks later when the Provi is done I'll be taking Anavar to compliment the last half of my Primo/Test. .

I've read that Provi and Anavar aren't recommended to take together because they are for two different results (mass vs cutting). This is why I'm doing a 16 week cycle + 2 weeks overage with the Anavar (8 weeks total).

Because I'm running for 16 weeks I figure my dosages are good enough for that period of time.

Thoughts?

IMO mass or cutting depends mostly on diet. You can bulk on drugs that people say are for cutting and I use drugs like anadrol when I cut so I don’t really believe that one compound is only good for one scenario.
I think your cycle sounds good though you should keep an AI on hand just in case

 

[FR0Z3N_B0MB3RRR]

Anavar as a fat burner... in wonderland maybe...

Anyway, if you wanna slim use somethink like 2-3.3 iu of good HGH upon waking fasted pre cardio, and stay fasted almost for 3 hours..

If ephedrine get you fuzzy i would try phentermine as anorexizing

 

[AlwaysHungry]

If you are 18-25% of bodyfat and y just wanna burn fat just use some test 350 and cycle some fat burners good diet and cardio.

With so much bf to burn primo is a waste.
Primo we use for cosmetic purposes mainly and anabolism when we switch from bulk to cut.
Some like use it to grow but they also have other players in like GH mainly test and tren slin etc .

If you like primo as and idea to build your body on primo its expensive so save some money cut on just test and fat burners and as frozen says if you can have some GH and do fasted cardio apon y wake and pin it before that's the best.
And then you can rebound using primo and some npp or oral whatever y like.

tip: when on low doubles then run the anavar and cycle some burners with it

Also I wouldn't keto especially on steroids but that's personal.
All i can say is use carbs for your advantage.

 

[BigDaddyV]

If you are 18-25% of bodyfat and y just wanna burn fat just use some test 350 and cycle some fat burners good diet and cardio.

With so much bf to burn primo is a waste.
Primo we use for cosmetic purposes mainly and anabolism when we switch from bulk to cut.
Some like use it to grow but they also have other players in like GH mainly test and tren slin etc .

If you like primo as and idea to build your body on primo its expensive so save some money cut on just test and fat burners and as frozen says if you can have some GH and do fasted cardio apon y wake and pin it before that's the best.
And then you can rebound using primo and some npp or oral whatever y like.

tip: when on low doubles then run the anavar and cycle some burners with it

Also I wouldn't keto especially on steroids but that's personal.
All i can say is use carbs for your advantage.

I agree with the keto thing and hgh would be a much more effective fat burner than primo. Plus it would cost less

 

[Beachbum69]

All great replies. Thank you.

I healed my ACL, just need to rebuild my muscle now to support it. A lot of bike and stair master.


I've read so much information perhaps I've gotten dieting mixed up. Makes sense on the carbs for building muscle. What diet do you all recommend? Calories/carbs/proteins/fats

I think over 16 weeks of consistent gym workout I'll be burning my dad bod pretty much in combination with a healthy diet, no more drinking, and a cycle. I just want to make sure I'm utilizing the gear I've picked out at proper times.

The last time I did a cycle I used hgh and some dirty shit called Stack 500 by Pro Labs. Test Blend with Tren and something else. I can't even find them anymore but it was dirty and I was younger and ignorant. (I'm 30 yrs old now). I remember I pinned wrong a few times and a year later I had a massive tumor I had to get removed. So tren and hgh just really put me off. I'll never touch it again.

I crunched some numbers and if I reduce my primo to 500mg I'll use that skrill to get HCG and pin small doses before cardio every day? I work a desk job from 7am-6pm though. Can only workout after work.

I appreciate all the constructive conversation

 

[BigDaddyV]

All great replies. Thank you.

I healed my ACL, just need to rebuild my muscle now to support it. A lot of bike and stair master.


I've read so much information perhaps I've gotten dieting mixed up. Makes sense on the carbs for building muscle. What diet do you all recommend? Calories/carbs/proteins/fats

I think over 16 weeks of consistent gym workout I'll be burning my dad bod pretty much in combination with a healthy diet, no more drinking, and a cycle. I just want to make sure I'm utilizing the gear I've picked out at proper times.

The last time I did a cycle I used hgh and some dirty shit called Stack 500 by Pro Labs. Test Blend with Tren and something else. I can't even find them anymore but it was dirty and I was younger and ignorant. (I'm 30 yrs old now). I remember I pinned wrong a few times and a year later I had a massive tumor I had to get removed. So tren and hgh just really put me off. I'll never touch it again.

I crunched some numbers and if I reduce my primo to 500mg I'll use that skrill to get HCG and pin small doses before cardio every day? I work a desk job from 7am-6pm though. Can only workout after work.

I appreciate all the constructive conversation

Hgh not hcg! Lol

 

[Cashton]

N

All great replies. Thank you.

I healed my ACL, just need to rebuild my muscle now to support it. A lot of bike and stair master.


I've read so much information perhaps I've gotten dieting mixed up. Makes sense on the carbs for building muscle. What diet do you all recommend? Calories/carbs/proteins/fats

I think over 16 weeks of consistent gym workout I'll be burning my dad bod pretty much in combination with a healthy diet, no more drinking, and a cycle. I just want to make sure I'm utilizing the gear I've picked out at proper times.

The last time I did a cycle I used hgh and some dirty shit called Stack 500 by Pro Labs. Test Blend with Tren and something else. I can't even find them anymore but it was dirty and I was younger and ignorant. (I'm 30 yrs old now). I remember I pinned wrong a few times and a year later I had a massive tumor I had to get removed. So tren and hgh just really put me off. I'll never touch it again.

I crunched some numbers and if I reduce my primo to 500mg I'll use that skrill to get HCG and pin small doses before cardio every day? I work a desk job from 7am-6pm though. Can only workout after work.

I appreciate all the constructive conversation

Not HCG, HGH, hcg for cycle support for the boys, hgh = growth hormone.

 

[Beachbum69]

Ah got it. Yeah hgh I stay away from because of past health issues and concerns with cancer scare.

 

[Cashton]

Ah got it. Yeah hgh I stay away from because of past health issues and concerns with cancer scare.

Idk about all that..

 

[Spokeonawheel]

In browsing through the thread I see a lot of suggestions about which drugs to take to help w dropping the BF. And, yeah, you can totally go down that road if you like.

But, fuck, just eat smart, do cardio, and run your gear.

I remember listening to an interview with John Meadows and he was talking about clen. And he said yeah you can take that or you could do an extra 20 minutes of cardio, or you could eat 200 calories less.
(Note: we aren't talking about contest prep)

Anyways, that shit always stuck with me.

Good luck OP.